Ordinary Bitter Boddington's Bitter

[Northern_Brewer]

I thought British ales, in general, are low in carbonation.

Well, it's more that (classicly) they're naturally carbonated. That doesn't mean they can't be really quite carbonated when a cask if first tapped, as the ceiling of many a pub cellar will attest. And in the first few hours after tapping, a cask can be full of condition. But that a) relies on good enough cellarmanship for them to be properly conditioned in the first place and b) it lasts for a fairly small percentage of the lifetime of a cask on the bar, so it's fairly rare to find. But scanning Untappd for some examples of Marble Pint, which is the (NZ hop-heavy) spiritual successor to Boddies, this is an extreme example of condition clearing leading to a bit too much head - that opacity is all CO2 in what is otherwise a completely clear beer :

And this is a bit more representative, at "home" in the legendary Marble Arch pub in Manchester :

Again you can see the condition clearing from the bottom - any lack of clarity on the bottom is just being out of focus and maybe a bit of condensation on the outside. And I can't tell you what a joy it is to be showing off photos of beer in actual pubs again!

So British beers should have a bit more carbonation than most people think, they just don't get to experience them with sufficient condition. It also gets complicated up north with sparklers. But you just can't really replicate cask conditioning with force carbonation, even if you mess about with nitro, it's just "different".

But personally I aim for something like 1.7-1.9, in bottles at least.

 

[hout17]

Well, it's more that (classicly) they're naturally carbonated. That doesn't mean they can't be really quite carbonated when a cask if first tapped, as the ceiling of many a pub cellar will attest. And in the first few hours after tapping, a cask can be full of condition. But that a) relies on good enough cellarmanship for them to be properly conditioned in the first place and b) it lasts for a fairly small percentage of the lifetime of a cask on the bar, so it's fairly rare to find. But scanning Untappd for some examples of Marble Pint, which is the (NZ hop-heavy) spiritual successor to Boddies, this is an extreme example of condition clearing leading to a bit too much head - that opacity is all CO2 in what is otherwise a completely clear beer :
View attachment 739872

And this is a bit more representative, at "home" in the legendary Marble Arch pub in Manchester :
View attachment 739879

Again you can see the condition clearing from the bottom - any lack of clarity on the bottom is just being out of focus and maybe a bit of condensation on the outside. And I can't tell you what a joy it is to be showing off photos of beer in actual pubs again!

So British beers should have a bit more carbonation than most people think, they just don't get to experience them with sufficient condition. It also gets complicated up north with sparklers. But you just can't really replicate cask conditioning with force carbonation, even if you mess about with nitro, it's just "different".

But personally I aim for something like 1.7-1.9, in bottles at least.

So for a CO2 draft system 1.5 would be a bit to low in your opinion? I just want to get the carbonation right on this one so any relevant info would be appreciated.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Maybe a bit low - but as I say it's a bit apples and oranges, it's just a different kind of carbonation. Some people squirt it up and down a bit with a syringe to try and replicate the tight creaminess of a sparkled head.

Now the next challenge is cloning Pint - Munich & torrified wheat, Lemon Drop, Nelson Sauvin, Dr. Rudi, and Citra....

 

[hout17]

Maybe a bit low - but as I say it's a bit apples and oranges, it's just a different kind of carbonation. Some people squirt it up and down a bit with a syringe to try and replicate the tight creaminess of a sparkled head.

Now the next challenge is cloning Pint - Munich & torrified wheat, Lemon Drop, Nelson Sauvin, Dr. Rudi, and Citra....

Thanks, yeah, I'm well aware I won't be able to fully replicate it. I could also just bottle it and carb to 1.7 or naturally carbonate in a keg.

I'm most likely going to keg it on Monday and I think I'll put the range between 1.5 and 1.8 on a dart board and wherever I hit that will be what I force carb it up to lol. Either way I'm sure it will still be great beer. Thanks for your input and actual pics!

 

[hout17]

Alright folks just got the bodds kegged. Corrected final gravity comes in at 1.011 estimated 3.8% abv.

I also received my creamer Perlick faucet so we will give that a shot when it is carbed up!

The sample tasted VERY good.

Edit: One more Pic!

 

[DuncB]

Looks about the right colour, you are on the right track for sure. Don't drink it too cold aim for about 12 celsius.

 

[hout17]

Next time I brew this which based on the sample will be quite a bit I think I'm going to naturally carbonate in the keg and pick up a floating dip tube.

I wonder if this will help bring me closer to the cask conditioned version. I know it still won't be the same but I would think it may bring me closer.

Thoughts?

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Natural conditioning will always get you closer, it's just different to force carbing.

The CAMRA purists will argue that you need just a hint of oxidation but while it definitely helps darker styles, it's not something you really want for something this pale.

 

[hout17]

Here you go came out pretty tasty! I have it carbed to 1.7 @54°F. It's actually a little.lighter than the picture but this is the best one I could get!

 

[DuncB]

That's looking good, I find beer very difficult to get a good picture. Just finished my five points best clone the other day, drank perfectly clear down to the last half pint I could get out of the keg with the beer engine. Plus there was only half a pint of dregs left so got great utilisation.

 

[hout17]

Nice that looks great beautiful beer!

Yeah, I didn't cold crash or do anything to promote clearing and used wyeast 1318 so it may take a while to clear but tastes great.

 

[DuncB]

The taste of the yeast is important for real ale, I made a Harveys Sussex clone and when it was cloudy it really tasted fantastic. Once it was clear it looked good but failed to deliver on the taste. But cask ale is mostly a young beer. I've just done a fremlins best clone and getting ready to transfer that to the barrel for secondary. So it'll be a few days yet.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

The taste of the yeast is important for real ale, I made a Harveys Sussex clone and when it was cloudy it really tasted fantastic. Once it was clear it looked good but failed to deliver on the taste.

You shouldn't be tasting "yeast" - esters etc produced by the yeast, but not the yeast itself. Up until 5 years ago or so, if a pint was anything other than crystal clear, it would get sent back as the assumption would be that it came from the dregs of the barrel. It's got a bit more complicated now with the hazy influence, but even today you'll see the older generation questioning hazy pints even if that's what they're meant to be like.

Whatever you're experiencing, it's not the yeast. If you're serving it on cask then it's more likely oxidation - a hint is good, too much is death.

 

[DuncB]

@Northern_Brewer
Yes I probably didn't explain that well, was a slight haze and it probably was the esters late in primary ferment. Those nuances disappeared in that batch as the yeast cleaned up. It wasn't oxidised that's for sure as really at the end of primary, but as you say oxidation an essential part of the cask experience.

 

[hout17]

Here's a video and a pic I'll probably use some finings next time to clear it up a little more bit it's been pretty tasty got a little more foam since I couldn't hold the glass during the pour sitting at 1.7 volumes of carbonation drinks smooth.

Now I'm tempted to get a beer engine, firkin, and aspirator so I can hook up CO2 to the cask to fill headspace instead of air. Cask in basement and run a line up to my office on the first floor.

 

[DuncB]

You can serve the beer from a bag that removes the need for an aspirator.

 

[hout17]

You can serve the beer from a bag that removes the need for an aspirator.

Not a bad idea but I already have the CO2 so it would be an easy hookup anyway.

 

[DuncB]

I have the demand valve on the beer engine ( essential if you have any pressure in the system ) and then just squirt a bit of CO2 into the barrel to replace the volume. Not so convenient for you if the pin ( half the size of a firkin ) is in your basement.

Beer engine info here

Chuck info in here

Great news with the beer engine.

Beer Engine strip down advice
..
www.homebrewtalk.com



Good video of how to set engine and demand valve up, here



This thread very useful
Beer Engine Set Up Help
Hi, First post, so please go easy :laugh8: I'm hoping somebody can advise me on how I can connect the beer engine I have acquired to a bag In box supplied by my local brewery. After doing a bit of prior research I bought some 3/8 keg beer pipe, metal hose clips, a non return valve and a Vitop...
www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk

Demand valve for beer engine
keg back filled with co2. It also helps to counter balance the hand pull operation. I’m having a slight issue with half foaming. For reference the pressure I set is around 1-2 psi so it’s not over carbed. I think it might be the demand valve as I can definitely hear air being drawn in during...
www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk

and the chap called peebee wrote this which is extremely thorough

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bw...bWc/view?resourcekey=0-oe5EQ2MtwRSmrDKRMjcO1g



This thread also has some useful ideas / different methods for serving relevant bit for us from post 1345 the last page

Mini Keg Discussion / Mods / Show Off - Dedicated Thread
Hi All, Just wondering how you guys manage your kegs? I have acquired 6 x 8L kegs and 3 x 5L kegs. I have 3 tapping heads and the remaining kegs have the blank caps. Do you just switch the tapping head to the next keg and if so how do you carbonate it beforehand? Thanks yes - switching heads is...
aussiehomebrewer.com

Also just discovered this whilst looking up for this reply and it's also very good

How to attach a Beer Engine Hose | Real Ale America

 

[schmurf]

I've got a sodastream gas bottle connected to the kegs I use for my beer engine. Just a tiny tiny bit of pressure, almost not noticeable on the regulator, is enough.

 

[hout17]

Tried my hand at making #2 Invert today it went really well. Going to use it for the Barclay Perkins 1943 IP Boddington's Recipe I'm going to brew this week to try out. It's sitting right around 30ish SRM by my eye. Can't wait to try this recipe!

 

[hout17]

We are off to the races fermenting the bodds 1943 IP recipe.

 

[DuncB]

@hout17
Looking good, try a big blob of blutack to hold your temp probe on nicely and give a more stable reading for the beer.

 

[hout17]

@hout17
Looking good, try a big blob of blutack to hold your temp probe on nicely and give a more stable reading for the beer.

Thanks for the info. I do have a tilt in the fermentor so I know what the beer temp is sitting at. Currently holding 68 deg F. There is a 2 degree difference between the probe and the internal fermentation temp currently.

I'll definitely give the blutack a try though thanks.

 

[hout17]

To update everybody. Here is a proper pint of the 1943 Bodds IP. It came out stellar I went for 1.5 volumes. It probably needs another day or two carbonation wise but came out beautiful. Smooth and malty with a nice lingering bitterness.

 

[DuncB]

That looks great, just the right colour ( only having seen the newer beer) and no nasty creamy nitro head either. Well done.

 

[hout17]

That looks great, just the right colour ( only having seen the newer beer) and no nasty creamy nitro head either. Well done.

Thanks!

Yeah, it's a little too drinkable! Going to brew the 1971 version next and see how that one differs.

 

[Dynachrome]

My version is darker, but that's beautiful pour!

 

[monkeymath]

no nasty creamy nitro head either. Well done.

Yeah well the pint in that pic has no nitro head by virtue of not having any head at all.

(Not trying to spin up a debate about nitro or the depicted brew - it looks great! -, I just thought it was funny to compliment on its head (or absence thereof).)

 

[Northern_Brewer]

This is what Twitter is for :
"boxing day is where its at... It's just football and Boddingtons"

 

[visitor]

This is what Twitter is for :
"boxing day is where its at... It's just football and Boddingtons"
View attachment 753597

Woah that's quite the session there... our Gunners had a successful outing but it was a bit early to get into a session this side of the pond.