Black Eye Rye Saison

[jamesnsw]

I have some Saison yeast I'd like to reuse, and thought I'd give a fairly unexplored saison a try- a black rye saison. Here's what I'm thinking. Any thoughts? Should it be darker?

I'll be using the White Labs 568, Belgian Style Saison Ale Yeast Blend.

[size=+2]Black Eye Rye Saison[/size]
[size=+1]16-E Belgian Specialty Ale[/size]


Size: 5.74 gal
Efficiency: 75.0%
Attenuation: 75.0%
Calories: 207.65 kcal per 12.0 fl oz

Original Gravity: 1.062 (1.026 - 1.120)
|==============#=================|
Terminal Gravity: 1.016 (0.995 - 1.035)
|================#===============|
Color: 21.94 (1.0 - 50.0)
|==============#=================|
Alcohol: 6.14% (2.5% - 14.5%)
|============#===================|
Bitterness: 29.4 (0.0 - 100.0)
|============#===================|

[size=+1]Ingredients:[/size]
8 lb Pilsner Malt
3.5 lb Rye Malt
4 oz Acidulated Malt
.5 lb Carafa® TYPE III
5 oz Rice Hulls
1.5 oz Styrian Goldings (6.0%) - added during boil, boiled 60 min
1.0 lb Light Brown Sugar

[size=-1]Results generated by BeerTools Pro 1.5.12[/size]

 

[edb23]

looks really good to me. Only suggestion I would have is to knock the acidulated malt down to 2 oz. That stuff can start to take over the whole beer pretty quickly, something I found out the hard way last time I tried to make a stout

 

[motobrewer]

might wanna check this out for reference:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f71/how-rye-i-am-rye-saison-2011-1st-place-best-show-hbt-comp-238831/

 

[jamesnsw]

might wanna check this out for reference:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f71/how-rye-i-am-rye-saison-2011-1st-place-best-show-hbt-comp-238831/

Yeah, this is the base of the recipe, with the addition of Carafa for color & acid for a bit more sour.

 

[jamesnsw]

looks really good to me. Only suggestion I would have is to knock the acidulated malt down to 2 oz. That stuff can start to take over the whole beer pretty quickly, something I found out the hard way last time I tried to make a stout

In my (limited) experience, 2oz wasn't enough to do more than balance my mash pH. There doesn't seem to be a ton of info on using it to sour a beer- if you know of something, I'd love to read it.

 

[edb23]

The only thing I ever read about it was in Radical brewing where randy mosher says not to let it go above 3 percent of the grain bill, but when I put it right at three percent it was too pronounced for my taste. But, i did just do the math and it's only about 2 percent of what you have going on, so I guess I take back the last comment it'll probably be good for the style. I just put an ounce of it in my mild as well so we'll see how that turns out

 

[jamesnsw]

The only thing I ever read about it was in Radical brewing where randy mosher says not to let it go above 3 percent of the grain bill, but when I put it right at three percent it was too pronounced for my taste. But, i did just do the math and it's only about 2 percent of what you have going on, so I guess I take back the last comment it'll probably be good for the style. I just put an ounce of it in my mild as well so we'll see how that turns out

Very helpful. Thanks!

 

[jamesnsw]

In looking at acid malt, I'm seeing 2 camps- NEVER go over a small amount, or throw a ton in (up to 10%). Part of this seems to be that acid malt varies a lot- like 5x more sour from one malter than another.

I think I'm at a safe amount and if this recipe is a repeater, I may tweak it.

 

[jamesnsw]

Ended up adding some oats for body & some white pepper at flameout to the recipe. Just tried it as I added some sugar to dry it out, and it tastes awesome. Chocolatey and spicy, with the great saison flavor. I'm excited to get this bottled and carbed.
I couldn't quite tell if there was the sour from the acid malt or not.

 

[jtakacs]

In my (limited) experience, 2oz wasn't enough to do more than balance my mash pH. There doesn't seem to be a ton of info on using it to sour a beer- if you know of something, I'd love to read it.

adding acidulated malt to a mash will not sour a beer in the traditional sense, imo... it might add some flavor and some tartness, but its not going to ever have an opportunity to develop. any lactobacillus won't have time to grow/expand and you're limited to whatever lactic acid there is on the malt.

that being said, i did do a wit with a large acid malt addition to the mash and some tartness came through, but went away after a month in the bottle. that was 8 oz. for an imperial wit (1.088 OG)...

 

[jtakacs]

and a black rye saison sounds awesome!