BIAB Brewing (with pics)

[Brewitt]

Thanks mystic. Excellent ideas. I'm wondering if my probe is going to work again when it dries out. I presume it should. Anyone have experience.

 

[Brewitt]

Answered my own question (and learned to read at the same time). It was about three posts down from the post showing the technique. Just bake the probe and wire for 20 min at 350 (leave the plug outside the oven). let's see if it works.......... (30 min later)...............Yep, It works!!!!!

Thanks.

 

[The_Dog_42]

I used this digital candy thermometer with good results until I allowed the display to get wet with the battery in it (then it broke...). The only other problem I've found with it is it uses watch batteries.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00279OPDU/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

 

[dobo]

OK, so, I brewed a Belgian Strong Golden Ale today and I finally got all of my ducks in a row in terms of efficiency. First, adjusted my pH with acidulated malt to hit 5.3. Next, I made sure to hit all my temperatures properly. In addition, I used a digital probe thermometer to probe the grist during the BIAB and found I needed a lot more stirring and agitation than I normally use. My approach was to stir with a paddle and to move the grain around on the way to strike temperature by pulling up on 1 side of the bag and then the other to sort of roll the grain around in the bag. This worked very well. Finally, I did a 2 gallon batch sparge at 175 after mashing out. Overall I got 78% efficiency on a 15.5 lb grain bill. That is better than I have done. Add to that 2lb of sugar and this should be a nice brew!

Pitched yeast recovered from Pranqster Golden Ale. Already bubbling away.

78% on a 15.5 lb grain bill is a big improvement over what you were getting before! Just curious, how much water did you start with this time? (you mentioned adjusting for pH, but not volume)

Stirring enough to circulate the mash will make a big difference on making sure that all of the grist is at temp for the mash. I have found a traditional paddle can be a pain with the bag, so I went the route someone else suggested (not sure if it is back on this thread or a different one) of using a "wall board mud hand mixer" that can be found at most larger hardware stores for around $10. They basically look like a large potato masher with a longer handle, and stirring the mash with a vertical "plunging" motion is very effective and avoids getting your paddle twisted up in the bag.

here's a link to the one on HDs website.


http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc...d=10053&langId=-1&keyword=mixer&storeId=10051

 

[BPhad]

To squeeze or not to squeeze ?
When doing extract with speciality grains the directions always say don't squeeze or you will get tannins, for BIAB it seems a lot of folks squeeze the bag. What is right?

 

[Mysticmead]

To squeeze or not to squeeze ?
When doing extract with speciality grains the directions always say don't squeeze or you will get tannins, for BIAB it seems a lot of folks squeeze the bag. What is right?

here's a way to look at it.... in a commercial brewery where they are HUGE batches of beer. The weight of the grains alone pressing down on the grains at the bottom of a mash tun alone is greater than the amount of pressure you can apply by hand.

to extract tannins it takes PH that is to high along with high temp (mainly the PH as a decoction mash boils the grain and doesn't extract tannins). Squeeze that bag and enjoy the beer

 

[BPhad]

here's a way to look at it.... in a commercial brewery where they are HUGE batches of beer. The weight of the grains alone pressing down on the grains at the bottom of a mash tun alone is greater than the amount of pressure you can apply by hand.

to extract tannins it takes PH that is to high along with high temp (mainly the PH as a decoction mash boils the grain and doesn't extract tannins). Squeeze that bag and enjoy the beer

Thanks!
I did my second BIAB last weekend and got to thinking about this, I won't worry.

 

[Brewitt]

78% on a 15.5 lb grain bill is a big improvement over what you were getting before! Just curious, how much water did you start with this time? (you mentioned adjusting for pH, but not volume)

I mashed with 7.5 gallons and sparged with 1.6 gallons.

Stirring enough to circulate the mash will make a big difference on making sure that all of the grist is at temp for the mash. I have found a traditional paddle can be a pain with the bag, so I went the route someone else suggested (not sure if it is back on this thread or a different one) of using a "wall board mud hand mixer" that can be found at most larger hardware stores for around $10. They basically look like a large potato masher with a longer handle, and stirring the mash with a vertical "plunging" motion is very effective and avoids getting your paddle twisted up in the bag.

That is a great idea. Thanks for that. I did notice that moving the bag up and down was very effective because it brought up hot water from the bottom of the keggle. But I would like to swap out the handle for a long one, maybe 2-3 ft.

 

[dobo]

That is a great idea. Thanks for that. I did notice that moving the bag up and down was very effective because it brought up hot water from the bottom of the keggle. But I would like to swap out the handle for a long one, maybe 2-3 ft.

The one I have (picked up mine from the local HD store so the link I provided should be the same thing) has a long handle already. Overall length with handle and mixer head is a few inches past 3' (sorry no tape nearby so I am estimating based on 12" ceramic tiles on the floor). Would imagine it to work fine in a Keggle as is.


For roughly $10 you can't go wrong. Perfect BIAB mash paddle.

 

[garysherck]

Reading another thread about BIAB brewing (with no explanation of the term), I had to do a google search for BIAB. One of the links, of course, was HBT.

That click lead me here. So much information on HBT. I appreciate your taking the time to share your set-up, and to include pictures.

Although I am in a few beer clubs, and they are great, but finding HBT, via BargainFitting's Wayne, has been the icing on the beer glass. It gives you lots of good ideas, but the key is to brew, not just read, read, read, and I need to brew more.

 

[fenners]

This thread is a big inspiration... I've been doing extract/partials for about a year now & have that process down pretty good. A good friend who has been brewing for /years/ gave me an old 11 gallon pot as a birthday brewing gift, and I think I'm going to step up to doing all grain BIAB.

If I buy that curtain from walmart a few pages ago (for $5!), do I need to cut/modify it to fit my pot?

 

[thughes]

This thread is a big inspiration... I've been doing extract/partials for about a year now & have that process down pretty good. A good friend who has been brewing for /years/ gave me an old 11 gallon pot as a birthday brewing gift, and I think I'm going to step up to doing all grain BIAB.

If I buy that curtain from walmart a few pages ago (for $5!), do I need to cut/modify it to fit my pot?

To get started? No. Simply line the pot with the curtain and brew some beer. You will eventually want to cut/sew the curtain into a more manageable bag but at this point just shove it in the pot and have at it. Good luck!

 

[fenners]

I'm happy to buy it as a starter to see if BIAB works for me Thanks, thughes.

Looking to do this brew tomorrow... Should work 'as is' for BIAB, right?

 

[Mysticmead]

I'm happy to buy it as a starter to see if BIAB works for me Thanks, thughes.

Looking to do this brew tomorrow... Should work 'as is' for BIAB, right?

yes.. ANY All Grain recipe will work. if using a voile bag (curtain) instead of a paint strainer have the grains double crushed. I would say double crush with the paint strainer but I don't know how fine a mesh it is (voile is VERY fine)

 

[fenners]

Curtain & clips bought for $10 total. Thanks, Target!

 

[usafbeerlover]

I just did a porter double crushed in two paint strainer bags. Hardly any grains got into the wort. I love BIAB. It made my jump to AG so much easier

 

[Burgs]

Saturday was the most fun, efficient, easy & successful brewing day since I've been doing this hobby, so I wanted to share my process (sorry, this is going to be long!)

I've tried a handful of different methods and have finally settled on one that has helped me to hit all my numbers accurately (volumes and OGs), eliminate the possibility of stuck sparges, and is scalable to 10 gallons with zero extra time & maybe a small amount of elbow grease.

Basics:

• I would call it the Bag In A Cooler method
• My philosophy is: I want to accomplish a few key things: combine liquid and grains, then separate liquid from grains. I see a straining bag as a perfect device to accomplish this end goal, with no real negatives
• I do my mash in a 10 gallon rubbermaid cooler that will easily hold enough grains for medium gravity 10 gallon beer batches as well
• I use a BIAB mesh bag from Jeff Omundson (http://www.bagbrewer.com/contact-me.html)
• I do my "sparging" in a 15 gallon kettle that also serves as the boil kettle
• I do not move liquids with valves during the mash/sparge, I move the grain bag instead
• I squeeze my grain bag. I do not think it is physically possible for someone to squeeze a bag with enough pressure to influence the temperature or pH of the grains inside
• I realize some people like to just mash with the full volume of water in a single vessel, and that's fine, but my kettle has no lid so this is not optimal
• The last recipe I did with this method was formulated with an estimated 75% mash efficiency and my OG ended up being 2 points over what I intended. What I'm saying here is that there is no efficiency hit (though I will admit that this is not a number that I really pursue - I just want it to be repeatable)

Nitty Gritty & Calculations

• I use a spreadsheet I made in Google Docs to calculate my water volumes: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/pub?key=0AikCmAEkJA-8dFJ3bjIxTGtFM0RYQlUxaEZrVGFLb3c&output=html
• I normally play around with my mash thickness ratio so that it gives me mash and sparge volumes that are easy to measure (quarter/half gallons/nice round numbers), but I stay within 1.25-1.33 qts/gal
• During a 1 hour boil, my system will reliably lose 2 gallons to evaporation, so I start with a 7 gallon preboil volume target

Process

• Weigh & mill grains the day before
• Add up my mash & sparge water volumes together and heat it all at the same time in my kettle
• Overshoot the strike temperature by about 10-12 degrees
• Drain my strike water into the mash tun and seal it up to pre-heat the cooler
• Stir & equalize the temperature at my desired strike temp
• Drop in my grain bag and stir with a large stainless mash whip (like a huge whisk)
• Check the temp for hot spots and when it looks good, seal the MLT up and start the timer for 60 minutes
• At this point, whatever is left in my kettle is my already-measured sparge water
• While you're waiting for the mash, you want to get your sparge water up to 175 and keep it there
• When the mash timer is up, pick up the grain bag and squeeze it well
• Transfer the grain bag into the kettle and turn it out around the edges to combine it with your sparge water. Stir it up well for several minutes.
• You want the grains and sparge water to equalize at 168 (I don't care if mine is a little bit lower than that, but I do not want it above 170). Hold it at this temperature for 10 minutes.
• While you wait, dump your 1st runnings into a trusted graduated bucket to check that your grain absorption was in-line with what the spreadsheet estimated (i.e. on my last batch, I started with ~3 gallons of mash water, the spreadsheet estimated I'd lose .75 gallons to absorption, and sure enough I collected 2.25 gallons of 1st runnings, great!)
• If for some reason you didn't quite hit your desired volume on the 1st runnings, you can add a little bit of liquid to your sparge to compensate
• Once your grains have sat at 168 for 10 minutes, pick the grain bag up again and squeeze it well
• Set the grain bag aside and use your grains for whatever you'd like (bread, dog treats or discard)
• Dump your 1st runnings into the kettle to combine with the 2nd runnings and fire the burner up!
• You can take a pre-boil gravity reading now if you'd like - draw off a sample and set it aside to cool
• Now's the time to quickly spray out your cooler, whisk or mash paddle, and grain bag & put them away (should be very quick, since the bag did most of the dirty work)
• Boil as usual
• BIAB haters will say that the method produces cloudy wort - probably even moreso on my method because I don't care about recirculating or filtering through the grain bed or anything like that. To combat this issue, I use Whirlfloc when there is 5 minutes left in the boil (not 15, not 10), and I chill using a 50' copper immersion chiller. I get great cold break that quickly settles to the bottom of my fermenters and leaves me with very clear beer
• When my 60 minute boil is up, I drain my kettle into the same trusted graduated bucket I used before, to reality check how much wort I boiled down to. If you are still calibrating your system, this will be helpful. For me, it's just a check to make sure my batch volume is right on. If you need to top off with water (I usually avoid this), do it now. Now that your wort is in a bucket:
• Another thing I've really had good results with is aeration via just dumping my wort between two sanitized buckets - this is fun to do with a friend too. One person picks up the bucket and dumps it into the other person's bucket, then the other person repeats. You may sing a sea shanty during this time if desired.
• When you're good and aerated, transfer to fermenter

Equipment Rundown (the big, important stuff anyway)

• 10 gallon Rubbermaid cooler (valve/bulkhead optional, really - I only have one on there because I used to use a false bottom)
• 10-15 gallon Kettle - obviously you will need the 15 if you want to brew 10 gallon batches (a keggle would work great & save you some money)
• A good grain bag (I really recommend the one I linked to) - if you get a custom one made, make sure it's big enough for your largest vessel - i.e. mine is fitted to my kettle, so it's a little big for the mash tun, but that works out perfectly
• Trusty graduated buckets

Conclusion

• Because I am using larger vessels (10 gallon mlt, 15 gallon kettle), this is easily scalable to 10 gallon batch sizes. The only variables that would change would be the amount of grains that I'd be lifting, and I would change my pre-boil volume on my water calculator to 12 gallons.
• I will just get cocky and say that I could do a 100% wheat or rye beer with this method because there's no way to really get a stuck sparge.
• The wet grain bag is not that heavy (and I'm by no means a big guy), and you're only holding it for long enough to quickly squeeze and transfer from cooler to pot & pot to discard bucket.
• Cleanup is quick & I even throw my grain bag and hop bag in the washing machine to make it even easier

Nothing groundbreaking here - but if you're reading this and you have a cooler, a grain bag and a kettle and haven't tried it this way - it's definitely worth a shot. I think you'll enjoy the brew day and hopefully the results!

 

[SpacemanSpiff]

This is a great idea. I may have to give it a shot. Here's the problem I have with my current setup. I'm using a 42 qt pot and I use a 5 gallon paint strainer bag. It works even though it's a little tight to get it all the way around the rim of the pot.
My main issue is removing the bag. I'm on the stovetop and I have a range hood so it's near impossible to get the bag out cleanly. I can't raise it high enough or get enough leverage to get it high enough to clear the sides. So I always wind up getting some wort running down the side of the pot and scorching the hell out of my stove.
With the cooler, I'd have plenty of room to maneuver the bag and let it drain and even do a sparge. Then it's just a matter of getting the wort transferred to the kettle.

 

[friartuck]

Use the curtain from Walmart. $5 and you don't need to stitch it. Get some spring-clamps and use that to hold it in place around the rim of your pot. I just did a brew like this yesterday and it worked fine.

 

[Mysticmead]

This is a great idea. I may have to give it a shot. Here's the problem I have with my current setup. I'm using a 42 qt pot and I use a 5 gallon paint strainer bag. It works even though it's a little tight to get it all the way around the rim of the pot.
My main issue is removing the bag. I'm on the stovetop and I have a range hood so it's near impossible to get the bag out cleanly. I can't raise it high enough or get enough leverage to get it high enough to clear the sides. So I always wind up getting some wort running down the side of the pot and scorching the hell out of my stove.
With the cooler, I'd have plenty of room to maneuver the bag and let it drain and even do a sparge. Then it's just a matter of getting the wort transferred to the kettle.

how long does your stove take to get 6+ gallons to a rolling boil?

 

[SpacemanSpiff]

how long does your stove take to get 6+ gallons to a rolling boil?

Maybe 20-30 minutes. I'm blessed with a Viking range that has a flamethrower for a front left. If I straddle the left and middle I have no issues getting a solid boil. I started with close to 7 gallons on the last batch and had no problem. That's the main reason I haven't ventured outside and if I could solve the bag extraction and related mess on the stovetop, I'd be golden.

 

[Mysticmead]

Maybe 20-30 minutes. I'm blessed with a Viking range that has a flamethrower for a front left. If I straddle the left and middle I have no issues getting a solid boil. I started with close to 7 gallons on the last batch and had no problem. That's the main reason I haven't ventured outside and if I could solve the bag extraction and related mess on the stovetop, I'd be golden.

Ahhh... yeah a Viking would explain it..

 

[Rake_Rocko]

Planning my first BIAB and I got just one more thing I need to figure out. The bag.... I have no sewing skills so making my own is out. But my brother has one of these: http://www.brewandgrow.com/brew/equipment/stirring-straining/jumbo-straining-coarse-bag.html so I can borrow his at anytime and won't have to really buy anything.

Would the mesh be too coarse for BIAB? I just dont want too many floaters in my wort. Thanks guys

 

[drocu]

I just did my first BIAB yesterday and it went so so. The biggest problem I had was too much water. I stupidly used Beer Smith's 18.5 gal BIAB equipment profile that started with ~10.4 gal water for ~18# grain for a 5 gallon batch; the starting boil volume was ~9.5 gallons. I think this partially accounted for my low efficiency. At the time, I thought this was a lot of water to begin with but considering I'd never done BIAB or used this kettle, I went ahead anyways. I extended the boil time to 120 min to try to compensate but alas, my OG was still too low.

So my question is, what do most people use for an equipment profile in beersmith for BIAB? I've tweaked the trub loss, boil loss, etc. so the starting boil volume is only 7 gallons for future brew days, but I'm curious what other people are using.

 

[mjmac85]

Awesome guide! Really love the pulley setup. I am starting to research all grain and looking at what is needed to step up. After reading this I think I finally get it. For my partial grain I heat the water and then steep the grains for 30 min. Then add extract and boil for 60 while adding hops. With all grain it's heat the water add the grains. Get the mash temp and let it sit. Sparge and then you are right back to boil for 60 while adding hops?

 

[Sippin37]

I just did my first BIAB yesterday and it went so so. The biggest problem I had was too much water. I stupidly used Beer Smith's 18.5 gal BIAB equipment profile that started with ~10.4 gal water for ~18# grain for a 5 gallon batch; the starting boil volume was ~9.5 gallons. I think this partially accounted for my low efficiency. At the time, I thought this was a lot of water to begin with but considering I'd never done BIAB or used this kettle, I went ahead anyways. I extended the boil time to 120 min to try to compensate but alas, my OG was still too low.

So my question is, what do most people use for an equipment profile in beersmith for BIAB? I've tweaked the trub loss, boil loss, etc. so the starting boil volume is only 7 gallons for future brew days, but I'm curious what other people are using.

Yeah that setting in Beersmith defaults for a 10 gallon batch, so you should definitely make your own Equipment profile. I use a 15 gallon keggle but still only do 5 gallon batches. I usually start with about 6.5 to 7 gallons of water. Just make sure that you set the Batch Size to 5 gallons when in your recipe design and then go to Mash Details - this will show you how much water you need and what temp the strike water should be to hit your desired mash temp.

You'll get better with each batch, I know I did. Good luck!

 

[drocu]

Yeah that setting in Beersmith defaults for a 10 gallon batch, so you should definitely make your own Equipment profile. I use a 15 gallon keggle but still only do 5 gallon batches. I usually start with about 6.5 to 7 gallons of water. Just make sure that you set the Batch Size to 5 gallons when in your recipe design and then go to Mash Details - this will show you how much water you need and what temp the strike water should be to hit your desired mash temp.

You'll get better with each batch, I know I did. Good luck!

Yeah, Beersmith is funky. I did adjust the batch size to 5 gallons and it still had me using >10 gallons.

Do you start with 6.5-7 gallons before mashing in or is 6.5-7 gallons your pre-boil volume (after mashing)?

 

[Sippin37]

That's before mashing in. It just depends on how many pounds of grain you are going to be using. Beersmith does all the guessing for you though, that's why it is so great.

 

[rudy0498]

I attempted my first BIAB last night, and for the most part it went very well. I love the time savings and simplicity compared to the HERMS rig I used to have. Most of the issues I had are minor and will be easily correctable.

The one issue that has me stumpted is the amount dust (I guess you would call it) from the grain that made it into the boil. There wasn't any husk in the boil that I could tell. But after chilling, it pretty much turned into cake batter and quickly plugged up my hop stopper (from theelectricbrewery.com). I had a sanitized auto-siphon handy that saved the day, but in the future I'd like to make use of the hop stopper.

I followed the OP's process pretty closely. I used a voile bag, not a paint strainer. I ended up stirring the mash quite a bit while fighting to adjust the temp and mashing out. I didn't drain the bag for very long (maybe 5-10 Min), and only lightly pressed the grain bed with a pot lid. I get my grain crushed at he LHBS, so I don't have a lot of control over that at the moment. I don't think the crush would be the problem considering a lot of BIAB brewers double crush their grains. Also, there was less than 2oz of pellet hops in the batch, so that isn't the issue.

Has anyone had this problem before? Is allowing these finer grain particles into the boil just an inevitable part of the BIAB process or am I doing something wrong?

A couple of possible solutions I have thought of are:
- minimize stirring the mash
- don't mash out and adjust efficiency to compensate
- try a different bag (although I think my bag is just fine)
- buy grain from somewhere else, or get a mill.

Any ideas?

 

[thughes]

Seeing as though you are not lautering through a grain bed, you will get much cloudier wort (flour, etc). This is not a problem as everything settles out in either the NC cube or the primary. A lot of us BIAB'ers just dump the whole kettle into the primary and let the beer gods sort it out.

Not sure of a solution to offer concerning your hop stopper getting blocked up, I'm one of those that uses pellets and just dumps everything from the kettle straight into the fermenter.