DC_0602
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How do you harvest the yeast from the bottle?
American IPA Bell's Two Hearted Ale Clone (close as they come)
- Thread starter eschatz
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Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:
How do you harvest the yeast from the bottle?
Made up a cup of wort (~250ml) with 25 grams of dme. After cool, flamed the lips of the bottles and carefully poured off most of the clear beer into glasses. Started drinking the "waste" beer. Swirled the last ounce or so in the bottle to loosen up any stuck yeast and poured that into the wort. Put the flask on a stir plate and continued drinking the "waste" beer. Had quite the two-hearted headache this a.m. after three bottles of that stuff and an extra pint of my homebrew 
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Did 10 gallons of this Friday. 5 with S-05 and 5 with Danstars West Coast dry yeast. First time using that one, looking forward to the comparison. Just got Bells here, so culturing will be on deck for the next rebrew.
I posted in this thread a whole ago because I was looking for a recipie to use with my home grown Cascade hops. It has been a bit of an adventure so far using whole leaf hops for the first time. My gravity was off and my abv cane out low, but I bottled it last week and will taste the first bottle in a couple of weeks. I'll report back!
36 hours after doubling to 1 litre. Went for about 34 hours without any signs of life, and I had pretty much given up, thinking I didn't get enough yeast from the dregs. Then low and behold, I walk in the door two hours later to find a nice creamy white head. Tomorrow, I'm doubling again to 2 litres and adding a pinch of yeast nutrient. I read this whole thread, and I'm really surprised to see Chico or another neutral yeast recommended. I don't find the Bell's yeast to be very neutral at all.
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Heck, I know. I bought mine in Alabama, the second last state to legalize home brewing just a couple years ago! They've actually got quite a nice craft brew scene going on there now.
I only meant by expressing my surprise about the yeast substitute that surely there has to be a more estery strain available that would be a closer match to bells than American Ale. I find the bells yeast to be fairly aromatic compared to us-05 or the likes. Could be the remnants of the hops from the dregs I'm detecting, however. At any rate, it's certainly less flocculent than us-05.
Yeah, we don't have any in Washington state and I haven't seen it when I go to portland or either. I had some last July when we went to Duluth , then tried to make it with 05, definitely not right, too dry for starters. I might mix 05 and 04 together and see what that does. I wish I would have brought some back with me.
No reason to mix those. In the first few replies Wyeast 1272 or WLP051 is recommended, aside from culturing from a bottle. I've made a decent clone attempt with WY1272, and can recommend it. Much more suited than US-05 or S-04.
Now, to my palate, a bit hoppier version is preferred, and that's why homebrewing is so neat. Why clone if you can brew something even better?
MMJfan
Well-Known Member
Agreed. I've cultured Bells yeast from the bottle to make this as well as an Oberon clone and I've also used 1272 for both and I can say it's not worth the bother to culture the yeast. WY1272 is as close as you're going to get and the WOTS is 1272 is in fact Bells house yeast...
I'm gonna have to try 1272 on a future attempt. I can only get Bell's a couple times a year when I travel. Is it more estery than 05? Unfortunately I've never used it before.
You should brew a batch, why deprive yourself for so long?
Use a long, long hop stand (30-45' at 170-180°F) for your flavor/aroma hops. Whirlpool or stir frequently but gently, not to beat air into the hot wort.
1272 has a lot more character and is way more estery than US-05, in a really nice way. It plays extremely well with Centennial (or other citrusy hops) and the malt profile. I keep it around 63-64F for a week, then 67F for another week or until it's done. Cold crash for a few days then keg where it gets dry hopped. If you bottle, dry hop for 5 days in primary after fermentation is done, then bottle. No secondary necessary or wanted. Preventing any oxidation is key!
Drinking the dregs from the fermentor. This is a fabulous beer! Can't wait to its carbonated...
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View attachment 1451874946163.jpg
brew703
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I brewed this three months ago and finished off the last bottle today. I used Notty for the yeast and was not real impressed. I would like to brew another batch but I want to change up the hops for a more grapefruit/citrus flavor. Which hops would you guys recommend? I'm thinking Simcoe or Galaxy with magnum used for bittering. I would like to use two different hops for the aroma.
As for as the yeast, how would US-05 or Mangrove Jacks West coast ale yeast work? Want to stick with a dry yeast. Here's a photo. Not sure if the color is right as never had a Bells.
.View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1452124605.002993.jpg
As for as the yeast, how would US-05 or Mangrove Jacks West coast ale yeast work? Want to stick with a dry yeast. Here's a photo. Not sure if the color is right as never had a Bells.
.View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1452124605.002993.jpg
slym2none
"Lazy extract brewer."
Bells seems to get plenty of grapefruit out of just Centennial. I guess you could go with other citrusy hops, like Amarillo, or LemonDrop.
Your beer is much darker than a THA. Nothing wrong with that, but just for comparison's sake.
This might help:
Your beer is much darker than a THA. Nothing wrong with that, but just for comparison's sake.
This might help:
brew703
Well-Known Member
wow, mine is much darker. I went with the recipe exactly. Might have to go with crystal 10 instead of 20.
brewski09
Well-Known Member
The house yeast is where a lot of the grapefruit expression comes from in the beer. Different than every other all centennial beer I've had and I've had plenty because I love centennial hops.
For dry yeast, I've never used mangrove jacks. The us-05 would be fine but I'd do a starter or another batch before this one because I think it has a funny taste the first beer out of the gate that would throw off this beer. I don't know why.
For dry yeast, I've never used mangrove jacks. The us-05 would be fine but I'd do a starter or another batch before this one because I think it has a funny taste the first beer out of the gate that would throw off this beer. I don't know why.
brew703
Well-Known Member
Maybe I'll go with US-05. Not really trying for a Bells clone this time. Just wanted to mix it up a bit and attempt to get more citrus tones.
GrogNerd
mean old man
do all your lighter-color beers come out darker than estimated?
I had that problem.
only did it one time before I had to lay off brewing for a while, but my last IPA I added 1.5% acid malt and it turned out almost as light as the recipe said it would
hops were a bit punchier too.
can't really say pH was the only culprit and the acid malt fixed it, but when I get back to brewing, I will be adding 1.5 to 2% to all future non-dark beers.
brew703
Well-Known Member
I did add a little acid malt so that contributed somewhat to the darker color. I never tried bells so didn't have anything to compare it to.
I usually add 2-2.5% acid malt to all my brews.
GrogNerd
mean old man
I found the acid malt lightened my beer a bit
again, just the once, so it's not at all scientific and stuff
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I know you said you wanted to go with a dry yeast, but The Yeast Bay is selling a "Midwestern ale" yeast now. I'm willing to bet that it's Bell's yeast. The yeast really makes the beer, I'm convinced it's the yeast interacting with the centennial hops that brings out the characteristic flavors. Won't get that with too many other yeasts.
brew703
Well-Known Member
I thought about ordering from them but the temps here in the South are f up'ed. Couple cold days then back to 70+. I may give that yeast a try if we get a weeks worth of continued cold weather. Bad part is the yeast will sit at my house for 4 hrs after delivery as no one is home during the day.
brew703
Well-Known Member
So what hop combinations would you guys go with? i'm aiming for something citrusy/grapefuity.
I currently have the following:
cascade
citra
galaxy
centennial
magnum
simcoe
perle
I currently have the following:
cascade
citra
galaxy
centennial
magnum
simcoe
perle
Of the hops you have listed, IMO cascade, citra, and simcoe fit the bill. I use Magnum only for bittering with neutral flavor, I use citra for one of my standard brews and dry hop with a combination of citra and mosaic hops. Mighty tasty with a good citrusy/grapefruity aroma. Cheers.
GrogNerd
mean old man
gotta agree with citra+mosaic combo. tonight will be using them to dry-hop my Deschutes Fresh Squeezed clone
first brew in 1½ years plus first time using serious fermentation temperature control
previously I wasn't serious about it, used ice water in a bucket. this time have a BrewPi and temp is locked in at ±.1° within set temperature
first brew in 1½ years plus first time using serious fermentation temperature control
previously I wasn't serious about it, used ice water in a bucket. this time have a BrewPi and temp is locked in at ±.1° within set temperature
Subdivisions
Well-Known Member
I saw your beer picture and I don't think it's a question of changing from C20 to C10. That's not going to change the color too much. Yours looks like a brown ale. It's probably not as dark in real life but I've seen this in IPAs before. It was getting pretty old (3 months according to your post) and oxidation can cause it to darken over time. Was it that dark when it was younger?
brew703
Well-Known Member
yes, I believe it was basically the same. I don't think it changed much, if any over time.
I'll brew it again and see what happens.
I also brewed a Kona Pale Ale and my version was much darker. TBH, I much preferred my version vs the commercial version. Felt mine had more flavor even though it was darker.
muels
Well-Known Member
I've made it twice per the original recipe. Fantastic, and a very close clone. Going to do a side by side this week.
Subdivisions
Well-Known Member
I'd stick with the 05 if you like it. I haven't been all that thrilled with the last couple nottingham beers I've made (not this recipe). I ferment in a swamp cooler and my basement is cold this time of year. The beer isn't going above the mid 60s so I know it's not from fermenting too hot. I just think notty is more well suited for english styles and darker beers. I make edwort's robust porter with it and it's one of the best beers I make. It just has this estery component that messes with APA/IPA styles. I get this really subtle dark cherry taste from it. It doesn't go well with certain beers. People say it's clean and I agree to some extent but it's not as clean as US-05.
Of course this is just my taste buds talking. You may find it great. WLP051 or Wyeast 1272 makes the best representation of this beer IMO. I just did it with 051 and it's night and day from using US-05. The sample I took to measure FG was so smooth and hoppy compared to my last batch with 05. The 05 batch was a really good beer too so I'm excited to try this after dry hopping in the keg.
I second using the 1272 instead. The S-05 tastes great too, but the 1272 puts it on another level. At least to me anyway. Even the friends and family that tried both versions mentioned how my latest batch was the best tasting one yet (I didn't tell them that i used different yeast)
brew703
Well-Known Member
I've made this one time using Notty and I was not satisfied. Problem is I never had Bells before so don't have anything to compare it to. When I use dry yeast, it's usually US-05 so that's probably what I will stick with.
Subdivisions
Well-Known Member
Subdivisions
Well-Known Member
You'll be pleased. I took some yeast from Bell's Oberon over the summer and let it sit for so long that I'm afraid to use it. I had another sample of US-05 in a large container that started to get mold on top. I figured I'd just start from the beginning. I need to get my yeast skills to be a little better. I've harvested this batch of yeast with some good sanitation precautions so I'm working on my house version of this yeast now. Look out Bell's.
For information purposes. WL051 or WY1272 is originally from Anchor brewing in San Francisco. Bell's has used it as a house yeast for many years and it has mutated into their house strain. You can collect it from most of their beers but I suggest to do it from Oberon since it has a crapload of yeast in the bottle. Two hearted will give you way less since their huge dry hop in the tanks drop a lot of yeast out. It's higher alcohol too which doesn't bode well for the yeast that's left.
