Beer Tools Pro vs. Beer Alchemy

[Sudz]

After playing with the big three I've decided to purchase my trial version of BTP.

I typically install my brewing software on my home computer but frequently use it from my office computer.

Can a single purchase of BTP be installed on two computers?

 

[Bobby_M]

Yes it can. I have it installed on three computers actually.

 

[Sudz]

Yes it can. I have it installed on three computers actually.

Thanks Bobby. You're the Man!

Your videos made a big difference in me trying BTP initially. After some time on the system it does appear to satisfy my interest more than the others.

 

[beergolf]

I just got Beer alchemy and like it. It has some shortcomings but over all it seems to work just fine. I am doing extract partial boil batches and it does not have a way to deal iwth late malt extract additions. Just beginning of boil and end of boil. Pretty minor.

I do like that it has several export options. I export recipes in pdf format and can sent then anywhere I want. You can even synch it with your iPhone or iPad. Seems like a nice feature.

 

[Bobby_M]

Not knowing anything about Beer Alchemy, I will say that the one thing BTP has going for it without question is that it's dual platform. I know it's rare for a MAC guy to ever entertain going to a PC, but it would sure suck to have to relearn a whole new software package. It's not as bad in the other direction because you can emulate a PC on a MAC. Rambling...

 

[MX1]

Bobby,

Once you go Mac, you never go back, or is that something else.
I am a dual system guy, Mac and PC, but TBH, I would rather just carry my whole iMac to the brew location, then to open the Dell Laptop.

Tim

 

[a_w_taylor]

As a lifer on the Mac I went w/ BA. I do get frustrated w/ not being able to adjust the AA% in a batch & would love to know my thermal mass, but I have 2 little kids and don't have the time to calculate for my 5 gal rubbermaid. I want to start using the inventory manager as I have recently made the switch to AG and would like to buy in bulk. When BA doesn't have an ingredient I just look it up on the wiki and plug it in! I did find it odd that Maris Otter wasn't on there.

 

[MusselDoc]

Imo, the customer service is rude. At least they gave me my money back.

 

[a_w_taylor]

Hmmm - I had a personalized response within 12 hours to my inquiry.

 

[Bobby_M]

I don't think it's fair to make a short blanket statement about a company's service without explaining the situation in more detail. I mean, you can do what you want but I don't take that sort of "review" seriously.

 

[a_w_taylor]

Wow - MusselDoc - changing ur post? Got a vendetta?

 

[MX1]

If needed I have the original post from MD. Some of the ohter boards I am on really frown upon removing content, so if it is needed here. let me know.

I will say that in the last 24 hours I have had 3 different exchanges with Steve, trying to figure out what seems to be a bug on my end.

I could not ask for more in the world of customer service at all.

Tim

 

[steve_flack]

Here is the entire email conversation with him. You can decide if I was rude or not. The only edits have been for his email address and the overlong email signature...

A business that takes pleasure in refunding money is doomed to fail.
It's a shame that you were incapable of simply being polite to a
customer. Do not contact me about this matter again.

xxx


On Feb 22, 2011, at 5:05 PM, Support - Kent Place Software wrote:

> Done…with pleasure. Your serial number is now deactivated and your
> payment will be returned shortly.
>
> Steve Flack
> Kent Place Software
>


> From: <removed>
> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2011 16:01:29 -0500
> To: Steve Flack <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: Recipe update
>
> How about you just refund my money. Plenty of other good programs
> out there. My order number is: ST74480837
>
> xxx
>

>
>
> On Feb 22, 2011, at 3:52 PM, Support - Kent Place Software wrote:
>
>> I do get your point but I'm sorry, it doesn't work that way. If the
>> batch is wrong you will need to change both the batch and the
>> recipe. Alternatively you can delete a batch and create a new one
>> then it will pick up the changes. The situation where you would
>> change a recipe and NOT want the batch to change is more likely in
>> my opinion. You might have made edits to the recipe in the batch
>> you didn't want changed. This is why the app works the way it
>> does. If you disagree then you are entitled to, but don't assume
>> that because you do that my position is wrong. I'm not changing the
>> way the app works to suit the whims of one user.
>>
>> If you think I'm being rude then you are mistaken. I was explaining
>> the situation.
>>
>> Steve Flack
>> Kent Place Software
>>
>> From: <removed>
>> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2011 15:34:28 -0500
>> To: Steve Flack <[email protected]>
>> Subject: Re: Recipe update
>>
>> Yes I would. I guess you are not understanding the point. If you
>> type in 10 into the grain bill and it automatically inputs 10
>> ounces instead of 10 lbs, then when you correct this error, you
>> would want it to update. If you do not catch the error for a batch
>> or two, then all of your calcs will be wrong. So, while you
>> actually use 10 lbs of grain, the program only reads 10 ounces.
>> You would want the batch to update based on the correct original
>> recipe. This is not after the fact changes to the intent of the
>> recipe. Subsequent changes are made in the subsequent batches, but
>> corrections to the original recipe need to be linked to the batch
>> so they are actively updated and accurate.
>>
>> I feel there is a real need for this, especially since the program
>> auto-updates or scales the recipe based on other functions you may
>> click. For example, if you change water volumes, it will modify
>> the recipe. Even if you used the original amount of grain, your
>> calcs are off because the program made adjustments. you should be
>> able to input the correct information, and the recipe should be
>> linked back to the original so that the cals will always be correct.
>>
>> Please do not make any more off-the-cuff retorts. Your tone is
>> rude and you clearly didn't understand my original question.
>>
>> xxx
>>
>>

>>
>> On Feb 22, 2011, at 3:22 PM, Support - Kent Place Software wrote:
>>
>>> They don't update. That's the point. If you brewed a recipe would
>>> you want a subsequent change in the parent recipe to change a
>>> batch you'd already brewed? The batch is the recipe at the time
>>> the batch was created. After that they can be edited independently
>>> (and in your case will have to be).
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>>
>>> Steve Flack
>>> Kent Place Software
>>>
>>> From: <removed>
>>> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2011 14:54:25 -0500
>>> To: Steve Flack <[email protected]>
>>> Subject: Recipe update
>>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> My question is concerning recipes and batches in Beer Alchemy. I
>>> created a recipe, then started a batch of a particular recipe. I
>>> found that I had input a wrong amount into the original recipe, so
>>> I corrected this in the original recipe but it failed to update
>>> the target values (based on the correction) in the batch. So, the
>>> target OG and FG values in my batch session is incorrect based on
>>> the modification to the original recipe. How do I get the batches
>>> to update if I make a change to the original recipe?
>>>
>>> xxx
>>>

 

[artguy]

...would love to know my thermal mass, but I have 2 little kids and don't have the time to calculate for my 5 gal rubbermaid...

One thing about this: if you pre-heat your mash tun (I pour in the mash water a bit above strike temperature, close the top, and let it sit 5 minutes), then you can input the the thermal mass as zero.

It's the only software I've used so I can't compare, but I love working with BA.

 

[a_w_taylor]

Thx artguy - I did pick that up somewhere and used it on my last batch.

 

[MX1]

Steve,

Not sure where it all fell apart, but you and your software is top notch in my book.

Tim

 

[Airborneguy]

I wouldn't want that change either, for the exact reason Steve stated. I frequently change my recipes, pretty much every time I brew them, and want the batches to reflect what was brewed at the time. Obviously this guy didn't get Steve's response and understand why you wouldn't want what he proposed to happen.

 

[MX1]

I am sure it was just an inability to communicate ideas across the spectrum of text and type.

Tim

 

[Bobby_M]

No, I don't believe Steve was rude at all. Someone got really anxious because a particular function didn't work the way they thought it should and the developer clearly explained why it doesn't. Frankly, this is another example of why this rather arbitrary recipe -> batch hierarchy fails. I'd like to know how many people see value here. Sure, I've brewed batches a second time based on a given recipe, but what's the big deal naming the first file awesome_apa_1 and the followup one awesome_apa_2?

 

[Beerrific]

Yeah, if that was rude, I am not sure what not-rude would be. I have emailed Steve a few times and he has always gotten back to me and even addressed most of my issues in later updates.

Honestly, is the batch feature somewhat new? I used Beer Alchemy for about a year before I even knew that feature existed. I just fix my recipe exactly how I want to do it and when I brew if I am off I just note it in the notes. Maybe I will work on using the batch feature.

I don't buy much software and I would have to say this might be the only software I have bought that I am actually happy to own. Now, Steve, anyway I could convince you to develop a compatible app for Android? Yeah, didn't think so, oh well.

 

[MX1]

Bobby,

I use the batch function alot. I make small changes to the recipe, and make lots of notes in BA. I can go back and find what worked with the beer and what didn't, and I have it all laid out for me in a easy to understand, and use order. Of course as with everything, YMMV. And if i happen to make a change in grain from one to a different, then I just use the Beer v1, beer v2, Beer v3, and so on.

Tim

 

[artguy]

I'd like to know how many people see value here.

One reason I like to use the batch function is that if you input your inventory and use it in "inventory aware" mode, it will calculate ibus based on your actual hop AAs, and you can then "adjust inventory" after brewing the batch to reflect stuff you've used up. Works well for me.

 

[Airborneguy]

Frankly, this is another example of why this rather arbitrary recipe -> batch hierarchy fails. I'd like to know how many people see value here. Sure, I've brewed batches a second time based on a given recipe, but what's the big deal naming the first file awesome_apa_1 and the followup one awesome_apa_2?

I couldn't think of NOT using it at this point. I feel it organizes everything perfectly, and I don't have to look at paragraphs of notes for every time I brewed a particular recipe to get some quick info. Plus, I don't think it would track your history if you don't create batches. By using the batch feature, I basically only take notes on out-of-the-ordinary occurances.

Honestly, I settled on BeerAlchemy because of this feature. I didn't like how the BTP kept track of my brews/recipes. I thought it was much more complicated.

I don't use the inventory tracker because I frequently trade ingredients with friends and don't feel like constantly updating all of that, but if you do, batches become even more important.

Steve, if you are still following this, how about a feature that compiles data from within a particular set of batches? IE, a way to chart how the recipe changed or how the particular outcomes changed throughout the set of batches? Let's say I brewed 10 batches of my pale ale. It would be great to have a feature that could tell me how the OG/FG fluctuated, or the IBU's, etc. One of the programs I use at work does something similar in regards to crime trends and its an awesome reporting tool.

 

[steve_flack]

Steve, if you are still following this, how about a feature that compiles data from within a particular set of batches? IE, a way to chart how the recipe changed or how the particular outcomes changed throughout the set of batches? Let's say I brewed 10 batches of my pale ale. It would be great to have a feature that could tell me how the OG/FG fluctuated, or the IBU's, etc. One of the programs I use at work does something similar in regards to crime trends and its an awesome reporting tool.

Not a bad idea that one.

 

[nicmert]

Not a bad idea that one.

I like that idea too. As a new brewer, I think it would be handy.

btw, this thread made up my mind on which software I should go with, that would be BA. I've always liked developers of any kind (software, mechanical whatever) to be active in popular forums. Steve, thanks for that.

Cheers

Steve

 

[lutinplunder]

not really sure this is the best place for this but I have BTP running under wine on Ubuntu. Runs pretty well but seems to have a little problem with the pop-up dialogues, but I'm not a 100% sure it's a BTP problem as I have other apps that have similar issues under wine. All functionality is there and useable the problem I'm having is that I have to reselect the app to get the pop-up to show up.

As far as I know this is the only brewing software running on ubuntu.

 

[mabaty]

Beersmith FTW!

sorry had to do it, I like beersmith. I have the iPhone BA though.

 

[Morgason]

Has anybody used the ibrewmaster on iPad yet?

 

[bartbert]

I have been using the iBrewMaster for iPad. I think it is a really great application for tracking your recipes and the status of your batches, but if you want good tools for calculating, I would go with some of the other tools.

 

[reddskinnfan]

I like the batch feature for multiple reasons:

Track changes in recipes

Auto-correct recipes based on available hop form and IBU

Ability to promote a batch to a recipe (for that stellar APA that I switched from Amarillo to Citra hops)

Ability to scale, so if your only doing 5g batches then you buy additional equipment that can accommodate 10g. You just scale it up and promote.