Beer flat in 15 mins

[axp]

Hi all.

I waited patiently for 3 weeks for my dubbel to carb up and have cellared it for about a month now. The trouble is when I pour the beer, which has been in the fridge for 24 hours, I get perfect carbonation but after 15 mins its basically flat. I aimed for 3 units of CO2 and it certainly has the correct fizziness when I pour, but like I say in 15 mins its all gone flat.

Is there any way to mend this and make the carbonation last longer? Is it too late to remove the bottles from the cellar and put them in a warm place if this would help at all?

 

[ChshreCat]

Might give your next test bottle at least two days in the fridge before opening one. Sounds like you're getting the right carb level, but the CO2 isn't all absorbing into the liquid before you open it, which another day or two in the fridge will remedy.

If you do that and aren't happy with the level of carbonation, you can certainly warm them back up and see if they carb further. 3 weeks is a good rule of thumb for carbonation, but it's more of a minimum and some beers take longer, especially bigger beers.

 

[axp]

will longer in a warm place help the CO2 dissolve into solution better or am I best off just leaving the bottles in the fridge for longer?

 

[rrmiller]

Drink faster?

 

[Revvy]

If it's not holding it's carb, then more than likely the beer isn't ready yet.

The 3 weeks at 70 degrees, that that we recommend is the minimum time it takes for average gravity beers to carbonate and condition. Higher grav beers take longer.

You're talking a dubbel here, that's NOT a low gravity beer. Gravity and storage temp are the two biggiest factors in carbonation time.

Stouts and porters have taken me between 6 and 8 weeks to carb up..I have a 1.090 Belgian strong that took three months to carb up.
Lazy Llama summed it up best with this diagram;

https://cdn.homebrewtalk.com/gallery/data/1/medium/chart.jpg

Everything you need to know about carbing and conditioning, can be found here Of Patience and Bottle Conditioning. With emphasis on the word, "patience."

Give them a couple more weeks and check again, and keep checking every couple weeks until they hold carb.

 

[ChshreCat]

Sitting in a warm place helps the yeast create the CO2. Sitting in the cold fridge lets the beer absorb the CO2 from the headspace. If you seemed to have a good *pop* when you uncapped it, but the carbonation didn't last in the glass, I'm guessing more time in the fridge before opening will help.

 

[axp]

Think I might do a test then. Place a couple in the fridge and leave for a week to see if carbonation improves and place the rest in a warm place and leave for a couple of weeks. My only worry is that because the bottles have been at around 10C for over a month that the yeast has gone dormant and won't re-awaken to continue the conditioning.

 

[ChshreCat]

I don't think you'll need to worry, but if you're really sweating the yeast having gone dormant, you can very gently take each bottle, turn it upside down and back upright. That'll stir the yeast at the bottom back into solution. No need to shake them or anything. Just rock them upside down and back.

 

[axp]

UPDATE - After placing two bottles in the fridge for 2 weeks the carbonation improved slightly. The fizz lasted for about 20 mins rather than the 10 - 15 mins I experienced previously. Have left the remaining bottles in a warm place to further condition. In total they have probably had 6 weeks at 22C.

Just wondering on average how long peoples' beer stays carbonated for once you have poured a glass. It seems my carbonation is not lasting anywhere near as long as the commercial examples I drink such as chimay and westmalle and they too are bottle conditioned to carbonate.

 

[ChshreCat]

Your beer shouldn't be lasting 20 minutes in the glass, let alone the carbonation.

 

[Revvy]

Your beer shouldn't be lasting 20 minutes in the glass, let alone the carbonation.

Yeah, I know.....I really don't leave any beer in a glass long enough to find out how long carb lasts..

 

[gerbache]

Those Trappist beers like Westmalle and Chimay are also carbed to a really, really high level. I'm not sure how much priming sugar you used, but it might just be that you're used to the higher carbonation level, and that makes yours seem flat in comparison. I've been afraid of taking my Belgian styles to such a high carbonation level, since I don't have a big enough collection of thick bottles, so I've just had to live with a flatter beer than the commercial ones.

 

[philrose]

Is it possible that op is referring to head retention as carbonation? Sorry if it's insulting to suggest that.

If so, it'd be a whole seperate issue.

 

[axp]

Seems like I have to drink faster then!

Its not the head retention I am using to judge carbonation, but the feel of the beer in my mouth. Though head retention is poor, this is not unexpected with the style I am brewing.

I prime to 2.9 units of CO2, as I read that most bottles can handle around 3 units. The initial carbonation seems to be the same as the commercial examples I drink its just that it seems to go flatter much quicker.

The other night I had a Westmalle and took my time over it. Probably lasted an hour or longer, and the carbonation was still there. Mine just seems to disappear.

It's really annoying because the taste of the beer is great (to me anyway!). I have another batch, that has a slightly modified recipe in secondary now and it's due to be bottled after New Year's. I think the major improvement for this batch would be if I can get the carbonation to last longer.

 

[gerbache]

According to "Brew Like a Monk" (a great read if you like brewing Trappist-style beers!), Westmalle is primed for 3-4 volumes of CO2, but others like Duvel can get more like 4.5 volumes.

I can't think of any reasons that a homebrewed beer would go flat sooner, unless it maybe is served at a warmer temperature or hasn't been given long enough to really absorb the CO2? It definitely is true that beer goes flat faster if it's warmer, but I assume you're serving them both at the same temperature, right?

 

[axp]

I love brew like a monk. Fantastic book. They are being served at same temp. Both come out of my fridge at around 5C or 6C. I had a couple in the fridge for 2 weeks. I thought that should be long enough to absorb the CO2. I am stumped by this.

Could the size of the headspace have an effect on how long the carbonation would last? The headspace was a little larger than I wanted. Instead of the 1 - 1.5 inch headspace mine was more like 2.5