BCS-460, 3 elements, 2 pumps

[Beeskneesbrew]

Pj will that fit in a keggle....I don't see any measurements.

 

[P-J]

Pj will that fit in a keggle....I don't see any measurements.

Here is a link to another site that has a good description of it:
ComfortGurus.com: SP10869ML - 240V/4500W 15-1/2" LWD Water Heater Element (2-pack)

 

[cdwiggi]

P-J

I have gathered all the materials for my brewery but I have another question for you concerning the switches Here in the diagram for lets say switch #5-7 I see the two purple contractors at the far right of the diagram and I assume these are the ones on the switch its self(without the red and green attachments). If the given switch is off when in the center position, and in the on position when turned right and on when turned left. How is that represented in the diagram? I am just not sure and I think some time with the continuity setting on my volt meter and studying will help but I was thinking it would be better to just ask the expert first.

Thanks
Caleb

 

[P-J]

Caleb,

Here is the switch:

The Red module contains N/C contacts. They cannot be easily used in this particular application. For the wiring diagram the switches need to have N/O modules only. The Switch Lamp connections are located on the switch base module (Black).

And the switch layout:

In the drawing I'm showing each switch section as having 3 terminals. There are actually 4 terminals for each double throw section. The Switch Lamp connections I represent as the red squares on the right side of each unit in the drawing.

I hope this helps.

 

[P-J]

As another issue with this type of switch. The "center off" type of switch has a completely different behavior with N/C contacts than the switch type that is not a center off type. Just saying.

Take a look:

Just saying.

I sure hope this helps everyone to understand the complexity of this type of switch module.
I'll shut up now. I'm done...

P-J

 

[yjfun]

That's awsome P-J. These things might be a pain in the but to draw out in a diagram but they sure do their job well. I can't imagine what a pain it would be to wire up an industrial controller without these little guys.

 

[cdwiggi]

As another issue with this type of switch. The "center off" type of switch has a completely different behavior with N/C contacts than the switch type that is not a center off type. Just saying.

Take a look:

Just saying.

I sure hope this helps everyone to understand the complexity of this type of switch module.
I'll shut up now. I'm done...

P-J

Good Morning PJ,

I have been wiring all of this up and have a question? In the previous slides your schematic here. I noticed and was wondering while looking at switch 5, 6, or 7 when one puts it in manual mode how is contact made back at the ssr or is this normally closed?

Thanks Caleb

 

[P-J]

Good Morning PJ,

I have been wiring all of this up and have a question? In the previous slides your schematic here. I noticed and was wondering while looking at switch 5, 6, or 7 when one puts it in manual mode how is contact made back at the ssr or is this normally closed?

Thanks Caleb

When in manual mode, the SSR is energized by placing +5VDC on the SSR's plus input terminal #3. This triggers the SSR and circumvents the BCS controller function. (i.e. - manual mode)

Hope this helps.

 

[cdwiggi]

Thank you again PJ for you wealth of information but I am still a little daft about the drawing or the switches and the connection to the N/O contactors. On the wiring diagram I see three points of contact (5, 6, 4) for a switch and another three points stacked next to it (2,3,1). Do each one of these section represent the two switch positions of left and right? I am wondering does the +5 volts contact and the out 1 share the same contact? I am very confused on this matter and any help would be useful.

Thanks again

CD

 

[cdwiggi]

Good Afternoon PJ- I have been doing a little more digging and after looking over the schematic again and some of your older schematics I found this thread
Post 74 Could you explain how to use these switches described in the current thread like you did in the linked thread? THank you again for all your hard work.

CD

 

[P-J]

Good Afternoon PJ- I have been doing a little more digging and after looking over the schematic again and some of your older schematics I found this thread
Post 74 Could you explain how to use these switches described in the current thread like you did in the linked thread? THank you again for all your hard work.

CD

They would be wired exactly the same way. The difference is that switch is a bat handle switch and the diagram shows an illuminated switch.

 

[cdwiggi]

They would be wired exactly the same way. The difference is that switch is a bat handle switch and the diagram shows an illuminated switch.

OK going back to your original diagram on this thread here the switches here have 2 inputs per side (left right) and plus each layer... I don't see how those connections from the drawing are connected to four points? I only see three wires coming into each layer of the switch?
Thanks Again

cd

 

[P-J]

OK going back to your original diagram on this thread here the switches here have 2 inputs per side (left right) and plus each layer... I don't see how those connections from the drawing are connected to four points? I only see three wires coming into each layer of the switch?
Thanks Again

cd

The explanation is HERE in this thread.
And this POST.

Please keep in mind that I will not redraw the diagram.

 

[cdwiggi]

The explanation is HERE in this thread.
And this POST.

Please keep in mind that I will not redraw the diagram.

Thank you for the help PJ and I understand that you don't have time to redraw this. In this post are points 11 and 13 tied together?

Thanks

CD

 

[P-J]

Yes.

 

[cdwiggi]

So how does switch 8 have three positions?

cd

 

[P-J]

So how does switch 8 have three positions?

cd

It has 3 positions because it is manufactured that way just like switches 2 through 7. The switch turns to the left and the associated circuit contacts close. In the center position all the N/O contacts are open. Turned to the right position and all the associated contacts close.

 

[Beeskneesbrew]

with the switches PJ has mentioned in this diagram the red contact blocks are N/C and the Green are N/O... is this correct? Which also means I would need to acquire 3 more greens according to the diagram?

 

[P-J]

with the switches PJ has mention in this diagram the red contact blocks are N/C and the Green are N/O... is this correct? Which also means I would need to acquire 3 more greens according to the diagram?

With the 3 position switch (center off) you do not want to have any N/C modules (Unless you really understand the total operation of this type of switch and its function).

All the switch modules should be N/O units on a 3 way - center off switch.
Yes. The green is N/O.

Regarding the modules. Generally, when you order the modules, they are a single unit. You need to order them in pairs to accomplish what you are trying to achieve. The modules sit side by side on the switch stack.

I do not think I'm making any sense in my post. I'm about to give up..!!

Hmmm.. Damn....

Wait - wait: Check this out:

NO/NC Switch Block

Does this help???

P-J

 

[Beeskneesbrew]

I purchased the switches from automation direct. This is what they came with.

 

[P-J]

I purchased the switches from automation direct. This is what they came with.

So sorry. I'm not familiar with those switches. (They are illuminated units? No?)

 

[Beeskneesbrew]

Yes, they are the same part number you listed on the diagram.

 

[Beeskneesbrew]

If that helps you at all.

 

[P-J]

Yes, they are the same part number you listed on the diagram.

If that helps you at all.

Ok...

???

 

[Beeskneesbrew]

Will they work for your diagram?

 

[P-J]

Will the work for your diagram?

Yes. I've already covered the issues regarding these switches in this thread:

post#3613995
And
post#3714201
And
post#3714938

Bottom line is the switches will need additional N/O modules to function in the application shown in the diagram. The N/C modules are not needed.

 

[Beeskneesbrew]

Is there anyone that has followed this diagram, that has pictures inside and out of their control panel?

 

[Beeskneesbrew]

But just switches 5-7 correct PJ?

 

[P-J]

But just switches 5-7 correct PJ?

That is correct. For those switches you need another pair of N/O modules added to provide the function needed.

 

[cdwiggi]

Good Morning P-J,

I have finnally gotten the entire brew rig together but I am running into an issue. On the heating element/element legs i am not getting the voltage reading I would expect. I have hem hooked up like so: one 120 leg to one point in the plug another 120 leg on the oposite leg and a ground hooked to the ground leg. In the schematic all three are hooked up exactly like I have them but I am getting no voltage when testing between ground leg and either one of the 120 legs. At this point I was thinking I misunderstood your directions and thought the gound leg should be the common and when testing between the common and either one of the legs I see 12v ac weather on or not... Do you know what this may be or why I would be getting this tickle voltage?

Thanks for all your help

cd