Ask Your Welding Questions Here!!!

[GreenMonti]

no...not as strong as tig....and dont ever mig weld a keg if u dont have to....mig welding is more for stuff u dont really care about...tig is way cleaner and better to use for a sanitary process:rockin:

Not every body has access to TIG. Not every body has the ability to TIG even if they had access to a machine. Also, the only pieces that "need" to be sanitary are the pieces that come in contact with the boiled wort. The kettle doesn't even "need" to be sanitary welded.

Why the push for a sanitary weld, when you welded on a threaded coupling?

 

[tigmaster]

the longevity of it...and its prettier..and plus its what i do for a living...i love making that weld...i have a very strong passion for my work and what i do!

 

[tigmaster]

plus i wouldnt trust any type of chemical cleaner around the solder...its a real soft metal....these r my opinions...and i work in process facilitys and we back purge....its how we operate...remmeber your talking to a professional!! and tig is the best process to learn in my opinion...once you learn how to control the metal...other welding is easier to grasp

 

[GreenMonti]

the longevity of it...and its prettier..and plus its what i do for a living...i love making that weld...i have a very strong passion for my work and what i do!

I can understand that. No doubt. I too am a weldor. I was in the food industry before my current position in aerospace.

I guess its the MIG remark that got me. IMO, there is nothing wrong with MIG if that's what one has to work with. If they have the skills to weld the thin gauge material and not have a leak, then it will work and last just fine for anything up to the boil. While there are some "pro's" on here, IMO the majority is the DIY home brewer.

You do nice work, and your a skilled weldor. Your passion shows in it IMO. I'm not trying to be rude or call you out in any way.
Have a good night.

Just for fun, here is one of mine.

 

[tigmaster]

hey so what is the tool to pullthe keg wall ouut like that? and i didnt take it that way! cheers! thats very nice too..your dipping the rod...i can telll...i do that to but mainly walk thje cup

 

[GreenMonti]

plus i wouldnt trust any type of chemical cleaner around the solder...its a real soft metal....these r my opinions...and i work in process facilitys and we back purge....its how we operate...remmeber your talking to a professional!! and tig is the best process to learn in my opinion...once you learn how to control the metal...other welding is easier to grasp

Just remember, your not the only one.

Every single weld I do is purged. I also work in a purge chamber when needed, due to the part being difficult to purge.

This is an 8" flange welded to a formed body. The material is 718 Inconel. .045 filler added.
Outside,

Inside,

 

[GreenMonti]

hey so what is the tool to pullthe keg wall ouut like that? and i didnt take it that way! cheers! thats very nice too..your dipping the rod...i can telll...i do that to but mainly walk thje cup

I know you walk the cup. That's the snake skin appearance in your welds. Yes I dip the wire in my fillets, I ball the wire up and drop it in my groove/butt welds.

Oh yea the tool. I lost my pics of that tool. I will send them to you just the same as the others that are asking me. There is another version of it on here that the others have built. Theirs is much more simple to build then mine. Check the soldering thread.

 

[tigmaster]

hey thats freaking sweet bro...i dig that...wish i could get into aerospace...thats some good skill...how does the inconel weld compaired to 304 or 316 or even the al6xn...thats the toughest stuff ive welded

 

[tigmaster]

like u mean u literally let the wire ball up and the jam it in there or ?

 

[GreenMonti]

hey thats freaking sweet bro...i dig that...wish i could get into aerospace...thats some good skill...how does the inconel weld compaired to 304 or 316 or even the al6xn...thats the toughest stuff ive welded

The Nickel content makes it a bit muddy. It likes to skin if your not in the right heat range or have bad gas coverage. Gas is very important just like SS is. It will sugar but not as bad as 304. It interesting material. If you get a chance, weld on it. Once you get good at Inconel, SS is a snap to weld.

Yes I get the end of the rod to melt and ball up. When I have the right size ball on it for the weld I'm doing, I just touch the ball to the puddle. The puddle sucks the ball right into the weld.

 

[sjvicker]

I can understand that. No doubt. I too am a weldor. I was in the food industry before my current position in aerospace.

I guess its the MIG remark that got me. IMO, there is nothing wrong with MIG if that's what one has to work with. If they have the skills to weld the thin gauge material and not have a leak, then it will work and last just fine for anything up to the boil. While there are some "pro's" on here, IMO the majority is the DIY home brewer.

You do nice work, and your a skilled weldor. Your passion shows in it IMO. I'm not trying to be rude or call you out in any way.
Have a good night.

Just for fun, here is one of mine.

...And the rest of them on the kettle are just as good!

 

[GreenMonti]

...And the rest of them on the kettle are just as good!

HA,HA....LOL

Yep that's yours, you noticed.

 

[JonW]

I've been thinking of getting into welding to do some basic brew stand stuff and whatever misc. things come up. However, doing tig for SS is something I'd like to tackle as well.

I have a handed down machine (Miller Dialarc HF) that I've not used before and quite honestly, this old beast looks intimidating. I'm wondering if I should just buy a small mig unit to start with or work on getting this Miller up and running. Thoughts?

Here's a pic I found on the web, but my unit is identical to this:

 

[GreenMonti]

I've been thinking of getting into welding to do some basic brew stand stuff and whatever misc. things come up. However, doing tig for SS is something I'd like to tackle as well.

I have a handed down machine (Miller Dialarc HF) that I've not used before and quite honestly, this old beast looks intimidating. I'm wondering if I should just buy a small mig unit to start with or work on getting this Miller up and running. Thoughts?

Here's a pic I found on the web, but my unit is identical to this:

Sweet!!! Another dinosaur. Just like mine. If you have it, use it. There is nothing wrong with that welder if it works proper.

Clean and set the points at .008 I believe and plug it in.

Here is mine.

 

[JonW]

Sweet!!! Another dinosaur. Just like mine. If you have it, use it. There is nothing wrong with that welder if it works proper.

Clean and set the points at .008 I believe and plug it in.

Yep - identical! I guess what is so intimidating with it is how many options there are for AC, DC, range, frequency, amperage, etc. I've been unable to find any decent information on settings for using this machine.

When would I use AC versus DC?
What is the high frequency option and when would I use that?
What range do I set it on and at what AMP level based on the materials I'm using?
If I just have an argon tank, can I do mig & tig?

 

[tigmaster]

ac welding is mainly for aluminum
high freq is also for alum
you can do alum and ss with argon with that machine or stick weld
that machine doesnt do mig...u need a machine with cv capabilities
for ref i use about 90 to 100 amps for thicker like around 1/4 thick and 30-50 for thinner gauge stuff

 

[GreenMonti]

Yep - identical! I guess what is so intimidating with it is how many options there are for AC, DC, range, frequency, amperage, etc. I've been unable to find any decent information on settings for using this machine.

When would I use AC versus DC?
What is the high frequency option and when would I use that?
What range do I set it on and at what AMP level based on the materials I'm using?
If I just have an argon tank, can I do mig & tig?

Yours and my machine can be used to stick (arc) weld or Tig weld.

AC is used for Aluminum.

The High Freq is used when you TIG weld. Though you can scratch start TIG, its better to use the HF. It keep the contamination of the tungsten down. When using the DC options, the HF is set to start. When using the AC option, the HF is set to continuous. The HF is used continuously to clean the Alum while your welding. The DC options will be used like this. DC reverse for stick (arc) welding and for balling the tip of your tungsten for welding alum. The DC straight is used for TIG.

A fair, general rule of thumb is. To set the welder amperage at, 1 amp for every .001" in material thickness. Some times you will need more then this but, its a good place to start. I would double the amps for alum. The dial in the middle is a percentage of the range that you select.

What is the SN of your welder? If you go to Miller and look up the manual by the SN. You will get a PDF of the book for your welder.

Yes, you can Mig on argon.

If you lift up the flap on the front bottom, you will see the points and the gas solenoid. You should also have one for water if you have a cooler to run a water cooled torch. There will also be a post flow time adjustment. That will set the number of seconds that the gas will flow after you let off the foot pedal.

Any more Q's just ask. Someone will answer.

Edit;
Oh yea, the "remote/standard" toggle. Is for the amperage adjustment. On remote, the amperage can be adjusted on the fly by the foot control. It also allows you to use the HF to start the arc. If its on standard, you will have to scratch start the arc, and you will get a fixed amperage. You would use the standard for stick.

 

[tigmaster]

Yours and my machine can be used to stick (arc) weld or Tig weld.

AC is used for Aluminum.

The High Freq is used when you TIG weld. Though you can scratch start TIG, its better to use the HF. It keep the contamination of the tungsten down. When using the DC options, the HF is set to start. When using the AC option, the HF is set to continuous. The HF is used continuously to clean the Alum while your welding. The DC options will be used like this. DC reverse for stick (arc) welding and for balling the tip of your tungsten for welding alum. The DC straight is used for TIG.

A fair, general rule of thumb is. To set the welder amperage at, 1 amp for every .001" in material thickness. Some times you will need more then this but, its a good place to start. I would double the amps for alum. The dial in the middle is a percentage of the range that you select.

What is the SN of your welder? If you go to Miller and look up the manual by the SN. You will get a PDF of the book for your welder.

Yes, you can Mig on argon.

If you lift up the flap on the front bottom, you will see the points and the gas solenoid. You should also have one for water if you have a cooler to run a water cooled torch. There will also be a post flow time adjustment. That will set the number of seconds that the gas will flow after you let off the foot pedal.

Any more Q's just ask. Someone will answer.

Edit;
Oh yea, the "remote/standard" toggle. Is for the amperage adjustment. On remote, the amperage can be adjusted on the fly by the foot control. It also allows you to use the HF to start the arc. If its on standard, you will have to scratch start the arc, and you will get a fixed amperage. You would use the standard for stick.

yeah u can mig with argon....but this is for me now...that macihne wont support a mig welder...correct?:rockin:

 

[GreenMonti]

yeah u can mig with argon....but this is for me now...that macihne wont support a mig welder...correct?:rockin:

I don't believe it will. I've never looked into that one. I have a separate MIG welder.

 

[user 40839]

Monti, I would appreciate it if you'd stop posting your pictures up here, you're honestly depressing me when I think about the "quality" of the welds I have on my keggles.

Seriously, if I ever win the lottery, I'm throwing cash at you to build me a few conicals and weld up fresh keggles for me. And why not, another brewstand (mine's perfectly fine, but hey... why not have one with gorgeous welds?!)

 

[tigmaster]

hey thanks....oh wait...this is my thread...isnt it???

 

[Ohio-Ed]

hey thanks....oh wait...this is my thread...isnt it??? i dont think green monti has posted any pics of HIS welds

He posted several. Look back up a few posts.

 

[tigmaster]

yeah no work today and too many shots by now, so thats why i edited it...ive got too many dazmn tabs open :rockin:

 

[JohnTheBrewist]

Not every body has access to TIG. Not every body has the ability to TIG even if they had access to a machine.

You guys are the experts, and you obviously do some beautiful work. But this is what you do for a living. I think the average homebrewer will likely get his welder out a couple times a year for whatever project. Even after taking a couple classes, he'll never be able to make beautiful welds like that on a consistent basis with a TIG, because they wont have the practice.

I'd hate to see a bunch of guys going out and buying TIG welders only to be terribly disappointed in their welds. I've never TIG welded, but my understanding is that learning to TIG weld is not all that easy. In fact, I think it's Miller that says on their site that TIG is the most difficult process to learn.

Whereas Joe Homebrewer can buy a MIG welder today, read the manual, and start welding today. I'm not suggesting to do this on your brew kettle. That's where it's probably worth it to pay a professional to do it right. But for making things like a brew stand out of mild steel, one could do that nicely with a mig, and not have to put off doing it until he's taken a class.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but this thread was beginning to sound like "Yeah, just go out and buy a TIG welder, and you can weld like me", and I just don't think that's the case.

Moose

 

[user 40839]

hey thanks....oh wait...this is my thread...isnt it???

Sorry Steven, yours are pretty damned nice as well. (Yep, Monti posted several of his, and he's been around the forums a while - his work is legendary. But since you're local(ish), how much to weld up some keggles? )

 

[Henrythe9th]

MenkeMoose your correct, but that's just what I did 3 years ago

Santa bought me a Miller-Matic 200 stick/tig. A dozen Argon bottles later and I can put out a pretty nice weld, a very long learning curve but it can be done.
I'm in the Auto repair/ fabrication business so all I weld is thin steel/Alumn
.090 is thick for me.

I did learn to stick at 10 years old and have Mig'd for over 30 years so I had the gist of fusing metals
but the joining of Farris to Non Farris metals with Silver Brazing is something that I'm loving even more now that Santa got me a air/gas torch for this years write off copper to stainless sweet

 

[GreenMonti]

MenkeMoose your correct, but that's just what I did 3 years ago

Santa bought me a Miller-Matic 200 stick/tig. A dozen Argon bottles later and I can put out a pretty nice weld, a very long learning curve but it can be done.
I'm in the Auto repair/ fabrication business so all I weld is thin steel/Alumn
.090 is thick for me.

I did learn to stick at 10 years old and have Mig'd for over 30 years so I had the gist of fusing metals
but the joining of Farris to Non Farris metals with Silver Brazing is something that I'm loving even more now that Santa got me a air/gas torch for this years write off copper to stainless sweet

You should be Tigging that copper to stainless joint friend.

 

[GreenMonti]

I guess its the MIG remark that got me. IMO, there is nothing wrong with MIG if that's what one has to work with. If they have the skills to weld the thin gauge material and not have a leak, then it will work and last just fine for anything up to the boil. While there are some "pro's" on here, IMO the majority is the DIY home brewer.

You guys are the experts, and you obviously do some beautiful work. But this is what you do for a living. I think the average homebrewer will likely get his welder out a couple times a year for whatever project. Even after taking a couple classes, he'll never be able to make beautiful welds like that on a consistent basis with a TIG, because they wont have the practice.

I'd hate to see a bunch of guys going out and buying TIG welders only to be terribly disappointed in their welds. I've never TIG welded, but my understanding is that learning to TIG weld is not all that easy. In fact, I think it's Miller that says on their site that TIG is the most difficult process to learn.

Whereas Joe Homebrewer can buy a MIG welder today, read the manual, and start welding today. I'm not suggesting to do this on your brew kettle. That's where it's probably worth it to pay a professional to do it right. But for making things like a brew stand out of mild steel, one could do that nicely with a mig, and not have to put off doing it until he's taken a class.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but this thread was beginning to sound like "Yeah, just go out and buy a TIG welder, and you can weld like me", and I just don't think that's the case.

Moose

Moose,
That's why I posted the above statement. I really wasn't out to bash or come off as an a$$. I was just trying to say what you said. MIG has its place, and there are plenty of folks that can MIG a kettle. No worries. Doing up a stand is a great example.

Edit;
IIRC, before being a member on this board. I read in BYO that LoniMac rented the MIG to build the Brutus. Right?

 

[GreenMonti]

Monti, I would appreciate it if you'd stop posting your pictures up here, you're honestly depressing me when I think about the "quality" of the welds I have on my keggles.

Seriously, if I ever win the lottery, I'm throwing cash at you to build me a few conicals and weld up fresh keggles for me. And why not, another brewstand (mine's perfectly fine, but hey... why not have one with gorgeous welds?!)

I thank you greatly for the kind words. I would love to do the work for you. You just let me know when you win. I'll have a few brews with you.

 

[GreenMonti]

hey thanks....oh wait...this is my thread...isnt it???

It wasn't my intention to steal any thunder from you. Not in any way. I would be happy to leave the thread if you would like. No worries.

Have fun, stay dry.

 

[JohnTheBrewist]

Moose,
That's why I posted the above statement. I really wasn't out to bash or come off as an a$$. I was just trying to say what you said. MIG has its place, and there are plenty of folks that can MIG a kettle.

Yah, I got that. I don't want to come off like an a$$ or bash anyone either. I'm glad tigmaster started this thread, and some great info is coming out of it. I'm just trying to balance his heavy TIG propensity with an amateur's perspective.

Moose

 

[JonW]

GreenMonti & Tigmaster - thanks for the tips on the Miller HF. I'll do a little more research on the machine itself and see if I can do some test welds with it.

Thanks guys!

 

[tigmaster]

It wasn't my intention to steal any thunder from you. Not in any way. I would be happy to leave the thread if you would like. No worries.

Have fun, stay dry.

No way!! No I really enjoy all the conversation ..no one I know is into welding like me, so I definitely enjoy everyone's opinions ...It was late for me. Don't want anyone to think I'm an a$$ :rockin:

 

[dmfa200]

I know I'm a little late on this thread but, hasn't anyone considered a used welding machine off of ebay. You can find some incredible deals.
Look at this...
http://cgi.ebay.com/MILLER-MAXSTAR-...00547362176?pt=BI_Welders&hash=item2eb18de580
Yes it is used, but Miller machines are practically bullet proof. They either work or don't, and when they do, they work better than all that imported crap I've seen.
The bottom line is I know most of you guys aren't welders and you'll have trouble welding, (especially stainless) so why tie an arm behind your back and try to do something already difficult for you with a machine that's not quite up to the task?
Miller, Lincoln, Hobart, Esab, RediArc are some brand names to look out for.
Plus brand name welders have way better resale value.
If your gonna weld stainless, tig is the only way to go.
Mig is for production welding. If you've got 200 kegs to weld and a week to get it done then I'd choose mig.
By the way, tigmaster, and greenmonti. You guys do good work. I guess I need to post some pics of my work one these days.
I think what this site needs is a welding picture tutorial forum for all these guys.

 

[tigmaster]

Sorry Steven, yours are pretty damned nice as well. (Yep, Monti posted several of his, and he's been around the forums a while - his work is legendary. But since you're local(ish), how much to weld up some keggles? )

i charge 25 to cut the lid out, that includes smoothing it out and polishing it some
then 35 per coupling...depending on what you brought up here to get done..im sure we could work out a deat where we were both happy:rockin:
ps: i do take beer but just to drink....not for payment...unfortunetly i cant back purge with beer...or use beer to pay smud....tried that....didnt work

 

[tigmaster]

and boy oh boy is that argon expensive...and that welder sure sucks the juice....and i have a small machine....feel bad for some of those monsters out there!!

 

[JohnTheBrewist]

Hey tigmaster, that sounds like about the going rate, and a very fair price for quality sanitary welds. I wish I lived a little closer to you.

Anyway, back to welding questions...

As I said in an earlier post, I'd like to try welding some stainless this weekend with my MIG. I want to make a stand for my plastic conical fermenter out of 1.5" square stainless thin wall tubing. My welder is an old lincoln weldpak 100 with MIG conversion. From what I've researched so far, I would use a shielding gas of 90% He, 7-1/2% A, 2-1/2% CO2, and Stainless wire.

Is there anything about welding stainless that would require, say, more juice than my system has, or something else that makes this a bad idea?

Can I just change the gas and the wire and weld the stainless like I normally would with mild steel?

Any advice on doing this better? (can't afford a TIG right now, though).

I don't want to spend the money on another tank of gas and wire if it's not likely to work.

Thanks,

Moose

 

[dmfa200]

Monti, don't mean to call you out but high frequency does not provide the cleaning action while welding aluminum.
It happens during the electrode positive cycle of an AC sine wave.
High frequency is used to initiate the arc, and stabilize it during welding.
Because AC current alternates back and forth from the positive to the negative state at some point the current is at a zero state which causes the arc to become unstable and possibly extinguish during welding.
High frequency overcomes this problem.

 

[tigmaster]

I don't know...it should work...use tri mix gas...maybe a smaller gauge wire , under .035, never tried stainless in a little machine like that, I say smaller wire cause the ss might requier a little more heat

 

[dmfa200]

MenkeMoose
You'll want .030 308L wire, and a 98% Argon 2% C02 shielding gas. Although a tri-mix would also work.
If you choose this gas mixture, it can also be used to weld carbon steel.
Stainless steel typically needs less amperage to weld the same thickness as carbon steel. Usually about 10 amps less.
Your machine also has a maximum amperage of 88 amps @ 18 volts with a 20% duty cycle.
I wouldn't try to weld anything thicker than 12 gauge or .109.