Apple Pie Bochet-Cyser

[ShareBrewing]

Brewing up a cyser this weekend and wanted to go in a caramel apple pie direction.

Let me know what you think.

Found a recipe or two on here for caramel apple mead but they just add pounds of actual caramel to the must. Instead I want to try to get the caramel flavor from caramelizing a portion of the honey for the cyser.

Here’s my recipe (5-6 gal):

- 6 lbs Clover honey
- 6 lbs Clover honey **(caramelized 1.5 hours)
- 4 gal Fresh pressed apple cider
- 1/4 gal apple syrup **(cooked down from 1 gal)
- 2 or 3 lbs cooked apples
- 2 small cinnamon sticks (2 inches long)
- packet Lalvin 71-B or D-47 yeast
- 3 tsp Super Ferment (yeast nutr.) + 1/2 tsp every 2 days for 8 days.
- 3 tsp pectic enzyme

While caramelizing 6 lbs of the clover honey in a large 5 gal kettle, on my other burner will be the cider that is reducing down to a syrup about 1/4 the volume of the original gal. I’m debating on adding the cinnamon sticks to this reduction while it cooks, as i don’t want a strong cinnamon flavor. The honey will cook for 1.5 hours in a low-medium heat, adding a small amount of water at about the hour mark. I try not to let the honey get absolutely black like some other bochets, but opt for a nice dark mocha brown color.

Once the caramelized honey is finished it is combined with water and mixed. Along with that you’d mix in the apple cider syrup, 4 gal of fresh cider, and the rest of the clover honey. On top of this, I’ll cook down 2-3 lbs of apples (variety TBD) and add that to the primary.

My OG should land somewhere between 1.130-1.140 hopefully. Should land somewhere between 14-15% if all goes well. Going for an apple pie with a toasted marshmallow on top... in mead form!

Cheers!

 

[SKBugs]

I tried Steve Piatz's suggestion to create a Vodka essence of spices. I soaked the spice in vodka for a couple of weeks and it turned out pretty easy to add to taste just prior to bottling. That may be something to consider.
This looks like a really good recipe. May I ask what is your reason for reducing the cider to syrup, if you are adding water later? Is it simply for taste?

Along with that you’d mix in the apple cider syrup, 4 gal of fresh cider, and the rest of the clover honey. On top of this, I’ll cook down 2-3 lbs of apples (variety TBD) and add that to the primary.

Can you also explain why you plan on doing this? Does it change the flavour much or is there another reason?
This really sounds like a lot of fun. Thanks

 

[rlmiller10]

Watching this as I have hundreds of lbs of honey each year and usually press at least a 1000 lb of apples.

 

[ShareBrewing]

I just picked up 5 gal of fresh-pressed cider from a local orchard.

With the honey making up a gal in volume, 4 gal of the cider go to the main volume of the mead, while 1 gal of cider is singled out and reduced down, then added to the must. This is solely for flavor purposes.

I can’t find the original post that mentioned cooking down some of the cider for a cyser, it was in thread that wasn’t related to anything mead. Haven’t seen any other posts on it. But the poster said that it gave a more rich apple pie flavor. You can also find a few vids on Youtube of chefs cooking down cider with a little sugar and cinnamon sticks to get a syrup.

This syrup can then be used for pies, topping ice cream, as a simple syrup in cocktails, you name it. So it could be a good idea to add a portion of honey (maybe half or full pound) to the reducing cider. Just a thought, as I worry that the cider alone would be too “thin” to reduce in such a way.

Alternatively, one could add portions of the “spare” cider to the caramelizing honey later in the process. This would essentially replace the water that’d be used to reconstitute the darkened honey 1 hour into the cooking process. This is often further cooked down so you could keep adding more cider to cook down, for as long as you want in theory.

So there’s a few ways one could approach this recipe/process.

PS the apples that will cook down and be added are Cameo, Jonagold, and Macon.

And the vodka tincture will probably be the way I go on the cinnamon, it’s simply the easiest way to dose it in.

 

[bernardsmith]

I wonder if by cooking the apple juice you a) set the pectins and so have a cloudy if not jellied cyser and b) you have a cooked apple flavor, the latter of course may be what you are looking for given the title of your thread being apple pie cyser. But if you are not looking for jelly or for a cooked fruit flavor I wonder if a better approach to remove water from the apple juice (that is what the cooking is for, I think), might be to carefully and gently thaw the juice that you have frozen and so collect the first 1/3 of the "runnings" which should contain all the flavor and all the sugar but only 1/3 of the liquid. Pectins are not set and you have not cooked the fruit, but you have made a sorta kinda reduced syrup. Your call, of course.

 

[Shine0n]

Bernardsmith, I read the advice you gave me and did the complete opposite and now I have an apple cyser that's just not good as it could've been had I listened to what you said.
Although my recipe was differ from this as I used caramel malt but ended up with a cooked apple taste that's just not pleasant.
I hope this turns out well for the poster but mine did not.

 

[rlmiller10]

This syrup can then be used for pies, topping ice cream, as a simple syrup in cocktails, you name it. So it could be a good idea to add a portion of honey (maybe half or full pound) to the reducing cider. Just a thought, as I worry that the cider alone would be too “thin” to reduce in such a way.

I have made boiled cider in which I just boiled cider to about 1/8 the original volume. Has a very intense apple flavor and starts to thicken by that point. I have used it as a back sweetener to apple cider and it is good but takes quite a bit to really give the apple flavor I was looking for.

 

[ShareBrewing]

Do you mean you used it to back-sweeten a batch of hard cider? How much cider syrup did use in how many gal of finished cider? Trying to decide if it’s worth reducing a gal of fresh cider or if I should just use it as is.

 

[rlmiller10]

Do you mean you used it to back-sweeten a batch of hard cider? How much cider syrup did use in how many gal of finished cider? Trying to decide if it’s worth reducing a gal of fresh cider or if I should just use it as is.

Yes, used it as a back sweetener for a hard cider. Ended up using about a pint and a half per 2 gallons. I think I was trying to get too much sweetness out of it rather than just the flavor. I think next time I will sweeten the finished hard cider with either sugar or honey and then use the boiled cider for extra flavor. Hopefully will not need as much.

 

[ShareBrewing]

Thanks for the advise! Hmm, a pint of syrup for 2 gal... and I’m doing 5+ gal...

Well it sounds like reducing the apple cider may not be a worthy venture then, unless it’s for back-sweetening. Primary fermentation would probably blow off all of the desired aromas I want to keep.

 

[ShareBrewing]

Wow, this couldn’t have come out better! Tastes exactly like an apple pie - sweet apple filling, caramel, toasted marshmallow in the back, graham crust. Couldn’t taste more perfect. Just about had to fight the SWMBO for the sample taster back!

For brewday, I went with the below recipe. I still cooked the apples but froze the chunky apple sauce to be added in secondary (not enough room in carboy during primary).

6 lbs Zambian wildflower (added normally)
6 lbs Zambian wildflower (caramelized 1.5 hours)
5 gal fresh apple cider
3 tsp yeast nutrient
2 tsp pectic enzyme
1 tsp acid blend

Caramelized the honey, and at the 1 hour mark, I added about 1 pint of cider to the hot honey to help reconstituted. Did this a soon as black puffs of smoke begin to rise from the honey.

Cider was added to the cooking apples periodically to reduce burning (about a qt in total).

Once the 1.5 hrs was up, cut the heat and wait a few minutes. Add the rest of the cider (4.5 gal in my case) to the hot honey and mix very well. Add the nutrient, acid blend and pectic enzymes now, along with rest of your honey.

OG 1.122 @ 5.5 gal

Rehydrate and pitch yeast.

Can’t wait for this to come out.