Apfelwein... carb vs. non-carbonation

[Poindexter]

1.010 sounds high. That's about the same as adding a pound of dextrose to a five gallon batch that fermented out. I added 8.7 ounces to a five gallon batch that had fermented out with great results. I don't think I would want any more than that in there.


TL

Thanks TexLaw I think I agree with you that 4 volumes of CO2 ought to be plenty. I found the following on page 229 of the big thread:

My current batch was at 1.010 this past weekend. It is very clear and very tasty. I'm considering bottling it this coming weekend if it gets all the way down to the target FG. However, I don't plan on intentionally carbing it. Since there is a small amount of sugars and small amount of yeast, would this provide sufficient carbonation if I don't let it get down to 1.000? Or I guess my real concern is whether or not it would create bottle bombs? I realize there's always a chance but I wanted to see if anyone has tried this themselves or knows the answers.

and same post:

My Cider Book says if you bottle 1.010 it will carb on its own. No bottle bombs. If you do this be sure to comp for temp.

If you wait until 1.000 add 5oz by wt or 3/4 cup of corn sugar

I guess I'll do some mathletics of my own, I am going to send Schlenkerla a PM with linky to see if he tried it.

I have a wake coming up on 12-15-2007, the guy was only 42. Lived out in the country, his wife gave CPR 42 minutes waiting on EMS. Five gallons of Apfelwine...

 

[Schlenkerla]

My cider book, Cider, by Annie Proulx & Lew Nichols says this.

"To bottle up a batch, sugar each bottle w/ two teaspoons of sugar or, more efficiently adding enough sugar to the dry bulk cider to bring up the specific gravity to 1.010, and then bottling. This amount of sugar will add 1% of alcohol to the finished batch of cider."​

This is the excerpt from page 69, verbatum.

I have never tried this. I alway let mine go to 1.000 or less.

If you are concerned about bottle bombs you can check the carb every few days to see if its good enough then. Stash them all in the fridge or pasterize by boiling the capped bottles for 10 minutes each. Air cool them w/o clinking the bottles. I suppose you can wire the corks in too.

I hope this helps - I'm going to Cancun in a few days so I won't be online much. OK

 

[mot]

i have yet to try the uncarbed ones of mine...I have about a 6 pack uncarbed, and about 18 carbed bottles left that I have been bottle aging for about 9 months now

 

[Schlenkerla]

i have yet to try the uncarbed ones of mine...I have about a 6 pack uncarbed, and about 18 carbed bottles left that I have been bottle aging for about 9 months now

At 9 months they should be great!!

 

[Poindexter]

My cider book, Cider, by Annie Proulx & Lew Nichols says this.

"To bottle up a batch, sugar each bottle w/ two teaspoons of sugar or, more efficiently adding enough sugar to the dry bulk cider to bring up the specific gravity to 1.010, and then bottling. This amount of sugar will add 1% of alcohol to the finished batch of cider."​

This is the excerpt from page 69, verbatum.

I have never tried this. I always let mine go to 1.000 or less.

I hope this helps - I'm going to Cancun in a few days so I won't be online much.

Excellent. Have a safe trip. Honestly I am glad I am not any more forgetful than SWMBO already knows about.

So on the mathletic mat, we know 5ozs of corn sugar is good for 0.005 SG points in 5 gal, and 2.0 to 2.7 "ish" volumes of CO2. So eight ounces will be about 8 points and not quite four volumes, so I at least used the same reference TexLaw did.

Finish gravity is here: https://cdn.homebrewtalk.com/gallery/showimage.php?i=2945&c=1&userid=4569 , thank you EdWort. 0.998 final +0.005 to +0.008 to prime, I shall bottle between 1.003 and 1.006.

I am ass/u/me-ing Schlenkerla's reference is for cider with no added corn sugar.

 

[Schlenkerla]

I am ass/u/me-ing Schlenkerla's reference is for cider with no added corn sugar.

It could be. If you can add sugar to reach 1.010 from priming why not bottle at 1.010 as its fermenting out from the OG? It might be a harder target to hit.

I think the safe bet is to let it go to 1.000 then add 1oz/gal of corn sugar. If you add 8oz it will be really efforvesent.

 

[TexLaw]

If you add 8oz it will be really efforvesent.

It is quite effervescent, along the lines of champagne, and the CO2 contributes noticeably to the flavor and aroma profiles. That's what I was shooting for, though.


TL

 

[beergears]

My carboyed apfewein is just about to pass the month milestone, still bubbles a bit.

When should I go to bottles, and should I expect to se the traditional "flat" gravity response for a couple of days, like with beer..?

 

[TexLaw]

Yes. If you are bottling, let the yeast finish. Check with a hydrometer. If you did the original recipe, and your SG > 1.000, you're pretty well finished and probably are safe to bottle.


TL

 

[verbal]

I must thank EdWort's for the Apfelwein as my girlfriend loves it. She also wonders why it gets her drunk so fast?( she doesn't know its 8% and she doesn't need too either) and this is why I am thanking you!

Joking aside, it is GOOD!

 

[mrfocus]

Sorry to bring up a dead thread, but I just wanted to confirm that 12 oz bottles and caps can handle up to 4 volumes of CO2.

I will be bottling tomorrow so I wanted to make sure.

Thanks.

 

[njnear76]

Sorry to bring up a dead thread, but I just wanted to confirm that 12 oz bottles and caps can handle up to 4 volumes of CO2.

I will be bottling tomorrow so I wanted to make sure.

Thanks.

I've done 3.5 volumes of CO2 and in my opinion it is more than enough. I hope that helps.

Mike

 

[bigjohnmilford]

I vote carb, but if you don't that cut's down on the waiting. hmmm... I may have to re-think my vote. cheers either way.

 

[coeceo]

Reviving a dead thread...

I'm going to assume that you guys are all priming the original recipe, specifically you used Montrachet yeast?

Also , most ciders I've had are relatively light in carbonation, this is from extensive testing with a very precise burpometer.

My plan is to do all carbonated with standard 5 oz in 5 gallons. Then I'm going to bottle approx. half the batch, then add about 12 splenda packets (boiled like priming sugar) to have some sweet ones...

Anyone sweeten theres?

 

[BlindLemonLars]

Also , most ciders I've had are relatively light in carbonation, this is from extensive testing with a very precise burpometer.

My plan is to do all carbonated with standard 5 oz in 5 gallons. Then I'm going to bottle approx. half the batch, then add about 12 splenda packets (boiled like priming sugar) to have some sweet ones...

I think it's a mistake to think of Apfelwein (at least that made by this recipe) as "cider." Think "sparkling wine" and you'll be in the ballpark. I greatly prefer it carbonated, and I force carb most of mine.

My girlfriend sometimes puts a touch of splenda in her glass, when she's in the mood for something just slightly sweet. I've tasted it that way, it's not bad.

 

[coeceo]

My girlfriend sometimes puts a touch of splenda in her glass, when she's in the mood for something just slightly sweet. I've tasted it that way, it's not bad.

I was mostly thinking of the GF with the sweetening idea. Thanks for the input I'll let her sweeten to her liking and will bottle it w/out the splenda.

 

[BigKahuna]

half the batch, then add about 12 splenda packets (boiled like priming sugar) to have some sweet ones...

Anyone sweeten theres?

I would suggest doing some with more...some with less when it comes to Splenda. I put a tbs on a wine bottle.. It's great!! when you mix it about 3 parts unsweetened, to 1 part sweet...But this is still. I thought it wasn't enough when bottled...but cows it's too much now. I think it'd be just about right for a carbed version. My problem is that I am just now (2 months and 20 gallons later) Back to the original recipe. I had to do some of the knee jerk batches that you come up with when you see bottles that say 100% Juice....even if they are not apple.

 

[EdWort]

My problem is that I am just now (2 months and 20 gallons later) Back to the original recipe. I had to do some of the knee jerk batches that you come up with when you see bottles that say 100% Juice....even if they are not apple.

Welcome back to the fold, prodigal son, welcome. Your misdeeds are forgiven. Now go start another proper batch.

 

[BigKahuna]

Welcome back to the fold, prodigal son, welcome. Your misdeeds are forgiven. Now go start another proper batch.

I rarely take advice and run with it, Usually I ask...then do what the hell I was going to do anyway; But I take EdWort at his word. I have paid for my sins, and do hereby promise to never be without a batch in the works. I Bow Down to you Sir.

 

[WortMonger]

Now that I have an extra 2 carboys, I am going to have to start doing wines and apfelwein. There is just too much talk for it not to be the shizzle for rizzle.

 

[Richard]

With all the pro-carbonation posts in this thread I am wondering if I should even bother to make a non-carbed batch.

 

[TexLaw]

Really, you start off with a still batch. Just try it out of the fermenter when you are ready to bottle or keg and see what you think. I think it is pretty darn good just still, but I like it better carbed up well.


TL

 

[Richard]

I guess you're right...I'll be making more so I should experience both.

 

[JustDave]

I guess you're right...I'll be making more so I should experience both.

If you have carb tabs, it's easy to split the batch up half and half, or 1/4 and 3/4, etc. I'd say try it both ways and decide which is the best.

 

[BigKahuna]

With all the pro-carbonation posts in this thread I am wondering if I should even bother to make a non-carbed batch.

I thank the good Lord above that It is simple, strait forward, and totally my choice. I wouldn't think of making a batch that wasn't split...50-50

 

[MULE]

Well this is my first batch of the stuff. I bottled it today. Although I added dextros to carb the batch, I took three 16oz bottles and put them in the fridge to test it still. I drank two and called it a night

I am lovin it

 

[Richard]

Sounds good. I'll split the batch when I bottle. How much corn sugar should I use for 2.5 gallons?

 

[Empty Bottle Man]

I have had it still, lightly carbonated, carbonated around where you would expect a beer, and heavily carbonated. I have to say that I like it at the lighter side of carbonation.

 

[blackhammer]

I also prefer it carbonated. When we first tried the stuff, it reminded us so much of champage, we decided to carbonate it that way. I added 8.7 oz of dextrose to the five gallon batch to get around 4 volumes of CO2 (accounting for residual CO2 at my bottling temperature) and bottled in 1 L, swing-top bottles. After a couple weeks at room temperature, it was brillantly clear. After a couple days in the fridge, the carbonation was right on target. It poured just like champagne.

The effect on taste is that you get that carbonation bite and detect CO2 in the nose. It really crisps it up nicely.

However, it's great stuff, still or carbonated.


TL

Do you need to pasteurize the bottles after carbonation?

 

[BamaProud]

Another vote for Carbonated. I did my first batch 4 ways, carbonated, still, carbonated&sweetened, and still&sweetened. Carbonated&Sweetened won, so that is how I make all batches now.

As a matter of fact I need to get started on another batch.