Apera Instruments PH60 PH meter

[TallDan]

I purchased the Apera PH60 on an amazon lightning deal during their prime day sales. I know at least a couple of others here on HBT got the same meter for the same great $55 price (currently $70 "normal" price on amazon).

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01ENFOIQE/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

It seems to hit all of the marks for a good meter as outlined in the calibration thread (https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=302256) except of course, the longevity is TBD.

I conducted a stability test on it today but am not sure if I did it correctly. I left the meter in the 4 buffer for the entire 5 hours. I'm not sure if that's correct or if I should have kept it in the storage solution, and just put it in the buffer for 30s to test. Either way, here are my results:

Measurements were taken every two minutes up to the 20 minute mark, every 10 minutes until the 2 hour mark, and every 20 minutes until the 5 hour mark.

Time	pH	Temperature
0	3.97	23.5
2	3.99	23.8
4	3.99	23.9
6	3.99	23.9
8	3.99	23.9
10	3.99	24.0
12	3.98	24.0
14	3.98	24.0
16	3.98	24.0
18	3.98	24.0
20	3.98	24.0
30	3.98	24.0
40	3.98	23.9
50	3.99	23.9
60	3.99	23.8
70	3.99	23.8
80	3.98	23.7
90	3.98	23.7
100	3.98	23.6
110	3.98	23.6
120	3.99	23.6
140	3.99	23.5
160	4.00	23.5
180	4.00	23.4
200	4.01	23.4
220	4.01	23.4
240	4.00	23.2
260	4.01	23.3
280	4.00	23.2
300	4.00	23.2

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

I have the same meter, and I am generally quite happy with it.

 

[ajdelange]

Those numbers exhibit a standard deviation of 0.01 pH over 5 hours. Note that the rms error WRT the calculated pH of the buffer, 4.006, at 23.7 °C is 0.02 pH supporting an accuracy claim of 0.02 for this meter. Keep in mind the the tolerance of the buffer must also be rss'ed with this for an estimated absolute accuracy of sqrt(2)*0.02 = 0.028 (assuming the buffer is rated ±0.02). Pretty good.

 

[Labrat]

Any updates on this pH meters longevity? It is priced well and the reviews for the Hach on Amazon are not that great.

 

[day_trippr]

I bought my PH60 in October 2018 and it's still working perfectly. Very happy with it so far.
That said, my Hach PP+ is two years older and still works fine as well...

Cheers!

[ps] I don't know if you noticed it posted here but replacement sensors for the Apera are almost cheap compared to the price for the Hach. Had the Apera ph60 been around when I bought my Hach, I wouldn't have

 

[Labrat]

Thanks for the update day tripper. I pulled the trigger on the Apera PH60 today.

 

[mbg]

If you know your water chemestry and adjust for it is it still a good idea to measure the pH?

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

If you know your water chemestry and adjust for it is it still a good idea to measure the pH?

Yes, because the greatest unknown for that case is still going to be the grist itself.

 

[mbg]

Yes, because the greatest unknown for that case is still going to be the grist itself.

Thanks.

I have never adjusted my brews for pH in the past (I'm in the Chicago area and use lake water). My Beersmith gives me a list of water adjustments I need to do based on my local water supply, recipe, and pH target. When do you measure the mash pH? Do you add adjusting chemicals while mashing?

Thanks

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

Thanks.

I have never adjusted my brews for pH in the past (I'm in the Chicago area and use lake water). My Beersmith gives me a list of water adjustments I need to do based on my local water supply, recipe, and pH target. When do you measure the mash pH? Do you add adjusting chemicals while mashing?

Thanks

You cpmpute the needed adjustment and add it to the mash water beforehand. Test 30 to 60 minutes into the mash, record the mash pH (after cooling the sample to room temp.) and take notes for the next batch of the same beer.

 

[jcav]

This is a good meter. I got one to replace my Hanna that would need new probes and drift sooner than I thought they should last. This one works very well and it also lets you know when it hits the final reading and settles in. Just my two cents.....

John

 

[Cato1507]

I purchased the Apera PH60 on an amazon lightning deal during their prime day sales. I know at least a couple of others here on HBT got the same meter for the same great $55 price (currently $70 "normal" price on amazon).

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01ENFOIQE/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

It seems to hit all of the marks for a good meter as outlined in the calibration thread (pH Meter Calibration) except of course, the longevity is TBD.

I conducted a stability test on it today but am not sure if I did it correctly. I left the meter in the 4 buffer for the entire 5 hours. I'm not sure if that's correct or if I should have kept it in the storage solution, and just put it in the buffer for 30s to test. Either way, here are my results:

Measurements were taken every two minutes up to the 20 minute mark, every 10 minutes until the 2 hour mark, and every 20 minutes until the 5 hour mark.
View attachment 407589

Time    pH    Temperature
0    3.97    23.5
2    3.99    23.8
4    3.99    23.9
6    3.99    23.9
8    3.99    23.9
10    3.99    24.0
12    3.98    24.0
14    3.98    24.0
16    3.98    24.0
18    3.98    24.0
20    3.98    24.0
30    3.98    24.0
40    3.98    23.9
50    3.99    23.9
60    3.99    23.8
70    3.99    23.8
80    3.98    23.7
90    3.98    23.7
100    3.98    23.6
110    3.98    23.6
120    3.99    23.6
140    3.99    23.5
160    4.00    23.5
180    4.00    23.4
200    4.01    23.4
220    4.01    23.4
240    4.00    23.2
260    4.01    23.3
280    4.00    23.2
300    4.00    23.2

I just put mine in for 30 seconds or so to calibrate, otherwise it stays in the storage solution. Maybe i missed something in the instructions but i dont get the purpose of a 4 hour test.
At any rate mine has been flawless and so easy to use. I dont use it every time i hrew but do spot checks periodically.

 

[mbg]

You cpmpute the needed adjustment and add it to the mash water beforehand. Test 30 to 60 minutes into the mash, record the mash pH (after cooling the sample to room temp.) and take notes for the next batch of the same beer.

Thanks - I get it now. So you don't adjust it on the fly.

 

[day_trippr]

[...]Maybe i missed something in the instructions but i dont get the purpose of a 4 hour test.[...]

Well, it's a "stability test". It takes time to execute to show drift if it's going to happen.

fwiw, I have a Hanna 98128, a Hach PP+, and a PH60. The Hanna works - barely - and is a hangar queen at this point - I'm not even sure why I keep it around; the Hach PP+ still works fine but has been relegated to backup duty; as the PH60 is my favorite...

Cheers!

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

Thanks - I get it now. So you don't adjust it on the fly.

The mash is generally nearly over by about the 20 minute mark. You can't undoo anything via adjusting on the fly.

 

[mbg]

I'm close to pulling the trigger on this meter but have a question about calibration. I only brew around 6 times a year - will I have to calibrate the meter before every brew?

Also, I'm a little confused about storage. Do you just store the probe in distilled water? Does it evaporate and need replacement if stored for 2-3 months?


Thanks - Mike

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

I'm close to pulling the trigger on this meter but have a question about calibration. I only brew around 6 times a year - will I have to calibrate the meter before every brew?

Also, I'm a little confused about storage. Do you just store the probe in distilled water? Does it evaporate and need replacement if stored for 2-3 months?


Thanks - Mike

Yes, it must be calibrated before (and sometimes during) every use.

Storage is in a nigh-on saturated Potassium Chloride solution. It evaporates and crystallizes, and must periodically be replaced with fresh. I've heard that some people seem to have very good results with storing the probe in 4.01 pH buffer, but in ballpark 48 years of using pH meters I've never seen this as the recommendation.

 

[Cato1507]

I'm close to pulling the trigger on this meter but have a question about calibration. I only brew around 6 times a year - will I have to calibrate the meter before every brew?

Also, I'm a little confused about storage. Do you just store the probe in distilled water? Does it evaporate and need replacement if stored for 2-3 months?


Thanks - Mike

you get a starter set of calibration and storage solution, but it won't last long. I bought a pint of each and it should last a while.
Calibration is simple and easy instructions to follow.
Yes I calibrate on each use.

 

[mbg]

Yes, it must be calibrated before (and sometimes during) every use.

Storage is in a nigh-on saturated Potassium Chloride solution. It evaporates and crystallizes, and must periodically be replaced with fresh. I've heard that some people seem to have very good results with storing the probe in 4.01 pH buffer, but in ballpark 48 years of using pH meters I've never seen this as the recommendation.

@Silver_Is_Money Thanks for the response. I found a copy of the manual and it mentions: "Storing the PH60 and PH60F dry will NOT cause any permanent damage. It will only temporarily cause the probe to lose its sensitivity, which can always be restored by soaking in the storage solution. "

With your vast experience can the probe be stored dry and then soaked 12 hours in potassium chloride (like referenced above) or do you recommend storing in potassium chloride and refreshing as required?

Thanks

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

With your vast experience can the probe be stored dry and then soaked 12 hours in potassium chloride (like referenced above) or do you recommend storing in potassium chloride and refreshing as required?

Thanks

I read that also. And I even tried it. I speculate that dry storage was what may have led to the demise of my Apera pH60, but I really can't say for sure. Maybe I can revive it with a good acid cleaning of the probe and a 12-24 hour soak in the potassium chloride solution. All I know is that it is currently nigh on impossible to calibrate, and when I think I finally have it calibrated it won't hold the calibration at all. I can't even get it to hold calibration long enough to take a single mash pH reading as it stands now. There does not appear to be any glass damage on the probe though.

I got about 2 years of service from it before it wound up in the predicament it's in now.

In the mean time I replaced it with one of these, when I saw it on Amazon.com for only $78. No sooner did I receive mine than they bumped up the price a whole bunch.
https://www.amazon.com/Oakton-pH-Handheld-Meter-Probe/dp/B00AM20JI4/ref=sr_1_10?dchild=1&qid=1598367660&refinements=p_89:Oakton&s=industrial&sr=1-10

 

[mbg]

I read that also. And I even tried it. I speculate that dry storage was what may have led to the demise of my Apera pH60, but I really can't say for sure. Maybe I can revive it with a good acid cleaning of the probe and a 12-24 hour soak in the potassium chloride solution. All I know is that it is currently nigh on impossible to calibrate, and when I think I finally have it calibrated it won't hold the calibration at all. I can't even get it to hold calibration long enough to take a single mash pH reading as it stands now. There does not appear to be any glass damage on the probe though.

I got about 2 years of service from it before it wound up in the predicament it's in now.

In the mean time I replaced it with one of these, when I saw it on Amazon.com for only $78. No sooner did I receive mine than they bumped up the price a whole bunch.
https://www.amazon.com/Oakton-pH-Handheld-Meter-Probe/dp/B00AM20JI4/ref=sr_1_10?dchild=1&qid=1598367660&refinements=p_89:Oakton&s=industrial&sr=1-10

Since you had an issue with this meter which one would you recommend for homebrewers?

Thanks

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

Since you had an issue with this meter which one would you recommend for homebrewers?

Thanks

To be fair, others have not had my issue. I was going to order a Milwaukee 101 when the mis-priced Oakton jumped out at me.

 

[TallDan]

All ph meters (that i know of) are going to recommend storage in storage solution. It's comes with the territory.

 

[mbg]

I read that also. And I even tried it. I speculate that dry storage was what may have led to the demise of my Apera pH60, but I really can't say for sure. Maybe I can revive it with a good acid cleaning of the probe and a 12-24 hour soak in the potassium chloride solution. All I know is that it is currently nigh on impossible to calibrate, and when I think I finally have it calibrated it won't hold the calibration at all. I can't even get it to hold calibration long enough to take a single mash pH reading as it stands now. There does not appear to be any glass damage on the probe though.

I got about 2 years of service from it before it wound up in the predicament it's in now.

In the mean time I replaced it with one of these, when I saw it on Amazon.com for only $78. No sooner did I receive mine than they bumped up the price a whole bunch.
https://www.amazon.com/Oakton-pH-Handheld-Meter-Probe/dp/B00AM20JI4/ref=sr_1_10?dchild=1&qid=1598367660&refinements=p_89:Oakton&s=industrial&sr=1-10

@Silver_Is_Money & others I finally pulled the trigger on the PH60. I see Apera says store in 3M KCL solution. I've seen it mentioned that 3M KCL is just potassium chloride solution. Do you purchase the 3M or do you make your own. If the latter can you please tell me how?

Thanks

 

[BrewMan13]

Don't know if this is any help, but I have this meter, and I use this for storage & calibration solutions: 8oz. pH Calibration Buffer Solution Kit (pH 4.00 & 7.00), plus 4oz. 3M KCL Storage Solution for pH/ORP Electrodes: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific
I store it in KCL whenever it's not in use. I calibrate roughly once a month, but have found that I get 'better' results when I don't calibrate the same day I need to use it. I've had to change the probe once, and it was easy.

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

I'm considering ordering a new probe for my Apera pH60. That way I'll have two pH meters, and if both give me close readings I'll feel pretty confident as to the correctness of the readings.

 

[mbg]

Don't know if this is any help, but I have this meter, and I use this for storage & calibration solutions: 8oz. pH Calibration Buffer Solution Kit (pH 4.00 & 7.00), plus 4oz. 3M KCL Storage Solution for pH/ORP Electrodes: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific
I store it in KCL whenever it's not in use. I calibrate roughly once a month, but have found that I get 'better' results when I don't calibrate the same day I need to use it. I've had to change the probe once, and it was easy.

@BrewMan13 Thanks for the link!

When you store the meter how much KCL solution do you use? My new unit doesn't have any standing liquid - look like just droplets all over the storage cover.

Mike

 

[BrewMan13]

@BrewMan13 Thanks for the link!

When you store the meter how much KCL solution do you use? My new unit doesn't have any standing liquid - look like just droplets all over the storage cover.

Mike

Not very much; there's a fill line on the cap. It can't be more than a couple mL.

 

[BrewMan13]

I'm considering ordering a new probe for my Apera pH60. That way I'll have two pH meters, and if both give me close readings I'll feel pretty confident as to the correctness of the readings.

Somewhere in the literature that comes with it, there's actually a recommended probe replacement timeline. I wanna say it's like every 18 months.
I got wacky results for a couple batches before I realized this was the problem.

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

@Silver_Is_Money & others I finally pulled the trigger on the PH60. I see Apera says store in 3M KCL solution. I've seen it mentioned that 3M KCL is just potassium chloride solution. Do you purchase the 3M or do you make your own. If the latter can you please tell me how?

Thanks

ASBC says the industry standard is 3.5 molar KCl for probe storage, which is a bit different from Apera's advice.

The weight of 1 mole of KCl (its Molecular Weight, MW) is 74.5513 grams per Mole.

3 times the MW in grams dissolved and made up to 1 Liter in DI water (or distilled if deionized isn't available) would be a 3M solution, and 3.5 times the MW in grams when made up to 1 Liter in DI water (or distilled) would be 3.5M.

It should be quite easy to make your own. It would likely do no harm at either extreme of concentration or you could probably just split the difference and make a 3.25M solution.

Edit: A fully saturated solution of KCl at room temperature is 4.56M, so when you see it crystallizing out, it has evaporated to where it is 4.56M. Any additional evaporation must be accompanied by the presence of crystals falling out of solution.

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

Somewhere in the literature that comes with it, there's actually a recommended probe replacement timeline. I wanna say it's like every 18 months.
I got wacky results for a couple batches before I realized this was the problem.

Sounds like a new probe is exactly what I need then. Who has them at the best price?

 

[BrewMan13]

Sounds like a new probe is exactly what I need then. Who has them at the best price?

Don't know about best price, but I just got it at amazon: https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B01GA9EI3E/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[mbg]

Used my PH60 for the first time this past Saturday. My initial cal didn't go well but was probably user error (7.0 went well but 4.0 was jumping all over the place). Seems you really need to stir things up to make sure you wet the sensor and have no air bubbles. I was shooting for mash pH of 5.2 and measured 5.26 so not too bad.

Sorry - have a couple more questions:

1) Not a question - FYI found Apera has formula for KCL solution in the manual.
2) My PH60 came with three calibration solutions - 7.0/4.0/10.01. As brewers do we just cal with 7.0 & 4.0?
3) How many cals can you get with the cal fluid? Don't want to skimp but also don't want to waste. (I called Apera on two occasions and was told 10 times by one rep but another said maybe 5 on 7.0 but only 3-4 for 4.0 & 10.01.)

Thanks
Mike

 

[VikeMan]

2) My PH60 came with three calibration solutions - 7.0/4.0/10.01. As brewers do we just cal with 7.0 & 4.0?

Unless you plan to measure anything with a pH greater than 7, I'd recommend skipping the 10.01 (assuming your meter will let you).

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

I concur, and it will let you. I believe that the buffers should not be reused more than a scant few times each. And for best precision, not reused at all.

 

[logdrum]

I've taken to making a fresh buffer from powder for each brew day.

 

[mbg]

I've taken to making a fresh buffer from powder for each brew day.

I looked at the powders they offer at Amazon but do the 4.00, 6.86 and 9.18 work on the PH60? (Apera includes 4.0, 7.0, and 10.01 liquid in the kit)

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

There should be powders available for 4.01 and 7.01 pH buffers.

 

[logdrum]

The ones I got were 4.0 7.0 & 10.xx, looks like they're not available atm.