Anyone haerd of these new Yeasts from Mangrove Jack's (New Zealand)

[stpug]

Everything still looks OK. No signs of an infection or anything. So I might go ahead a re-pitch tomorrow night. I'll have 5 gallons a week apart I suppose. I was just really wanting to see what the differences would be for these yeasts and I had had high hopes for the Mangrove Jack. Oh well, as long as the 34/70 treats me right I'll proabably stick with it.
I really like to convienience of dry yeast and wanted to experiment with the dry lager strains before I decided what to use as my go to.

I think you can safely say it won't be MJ M84

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

100 Hours and still nothing. Whats going on here? 34/70 is going gangbusters.

Crazy, I know. I didn't get activity until about 92-94 hours, and that was after warming up to about 58 degrees.

I'll never use it again. Back to 34/70 for me.

 

[mblanks2]

I think you can safely say it won't be MJ M84

It definitely will not.

I'll never use it again. Back to 34/70 for me.

That will be my plan as long as it turns out well.

 

[Gmulerulz]

Anyone have issues with Workhorse Yeast at temps lower than 68. I have had three beers I used this yeast on taste flat after bottling and one Oktoberfest that I pitched on a cake that came out excellent. I'm suspecting a bad capper but I wonder if this yeast needs a higher fermenting temp. That or my bottling conditioning temp of 68 is too low and I just need to walk away from the beer for a few more weeks. One was a simple 1.050 ale that has been in bottles 2 months and still tastes green. I made a mistake and bought into the hype of these yeasts and didn't take it easy to make sure they worked for me. Now I have 3 two case batches that aren't fit yet for drinking. This is messing with my pipeline and has me swearing off MJ Workhorse yeast. As a disclaimer the New Castle Brown yeast makes an excellent Northern Brown Ale which I managed to drink way to quickly but the Workhorse except for the Oktoberfest I did is bumming me out. By the way all of my brews were AG BIAB.

 

[Gitmoe]

Did a split 10G Nut Brown Ale batch with the British Ale and the Burton Union. The British came out nice but the Burton Union was a homerun. The character and depth are phenomenal. Perfect profile for the recipe I created. Fermented both side by side at 67 degrees which is on the lower end for both strains. Wanted them to be as clean as possible.

 

[djt17]

Anyone have issues with Workhorse Yeast at temps lower than 68. I have had three beers I used this yeast on taste flat after bottling and one Oktoberfest that I pitched on a cake that came out excellent. I'm suspecting a bad capper but I wonder if this yeast needs a higher fermenting temp. That or my bottling conditioning temp of 68 is too low and I just need to walk away from the beer for a few more weeks. One was a simple 1.050 ale that has been in bottles 2 months and still tastes green. I made a mistake and bought into the hype of these yeasts and didn't take it easy to make sure they worked for me. Now I have 3 two case batches that aren't fit yet for drinking. This is messing with my pipeline and has me swearing off MJ Workhorse yeast. As a disclaimer the New Castle Brown yeast makes an excellent Northern Brown Ale which I managed to drink way to quickly but the Workhorse except for the Oktoberfest I did is bumming me out. By the way all of my brews were AG BIAB.

I used the Workhorse, fermented at 60°. Just kegged 2 days ago, sample was tasty.

 

[Gmulerulz]

Can't wait until I can start kegging, cause the more I think about my carbing issue the more I want to blame the capper for not giving me a proper seal on the bottles. Nothing else makes sense to me since others have had decent success and my OG and FG readings have been spot on.

 

[oxpajama]

So far M02 seems to perform like the yeast description, high floculation (ignoring the orange juice haze), I'll report an FG and tasting notes when I rack. Used 1/2 tsp yeast nutrient even though MJ says M02 has nutrient in the package. Fermentation was steady, pitched at 68*, peak fermentation was at 76* for a few hours until I cooled it back down to 73*.

Racked to secondary today. Gravity reads 1.004, smells sweet and fruity, no sulfur. Tastes tart, a little yeast bite still, fruity and hey, No Barf!

This reached 76*f at one point so M02 seems to have a generous temp range.

 

[mblanks2]

163 hours and the MJ M84 has finally started working. High krausen at 184 hours. It's really going to be interesting to see how these two turn out. I'm really glad I decided to wait on the re-pitch. At least now I can see what flavor differences there are.
I won't use this yeast again due to it's lag time, but it's turning out to be an interesting experiment to say the least.

 

[beersk]

Crazy, I know. I didn't get activity until about 92-94 hours, and that was after warming up to about 58 degrees.

I'll never use it again. Back to 34/70 for me.

Same here. In fact, I don't think I'll be using any Mangrove Jack's yeast again. Too many beers under attenuating - with pure O2, rehydration, low 150's mash temps, etc. Just not happening, it's bizarre and frustrating. 34/70 is a pretty awesome dry lager yeast.
I'm drinking an oatmeal stout now that finished at 1.023 on a repitch. Brew in a bag mashed at 154F for 60 minutes, no heat added, didn't lose much temp. Pitched a jar of Newcastle Dark Ale harvested yeast, shook to aerate...couldn't believe it was so weak. It didn't even take off super quickly. I'm not using that stuff again. I know the yeast packet says it's selected to not over attenuated, but jesus man...it under attenuates...

 

[stpug]

Up till now, I've used US West Coast, British Ale, and Burton Union. I'm actually seeing much higher apparent attenuation than I'd expect. In some cases, I planned on the FG to be a bit higher.

US West Coast: Pale Ale, OG 1.058, FG 1.010, AA ~82%, mash 153F, lag 32hr at 63F with sachet, yeast is very complementary/neutral
British Ale: Cream Ale, OG 1.047, FG 1.010, AA ~78%, mash 150F, lag 18hr at 64F with sachet, good mouthfeel, subtle yeast flavor
British Ale: Amber Ale, OG 1.068, FG 1.011, AA ~84%, mash 151F, lag ~20hr at 61F with 120ml slurry, excellent mouthfeel, boldness of beer outshines subtle yeast flavor
Burton Union: ESB, OG 1.055, FG 1.012, AA ~77%, mash 152F, lag 15hr at 64F with sachet, some light fruit and mineral esters, nice maltiness remain

Overall, I'm pleased with the three strains I've used so far. The US West Coast in the Pale Ale was a perfect choice - it really worked out well. Also, the British in the Amber Ale works very well together. The cream ale either could have been fermented cooler (high 50s) or use a different yeast; it's still a good beer but when such light characteristics the yeast comes forward more than I had hoped. The ESB is pretty good but it's only 19 days old so the jury is still out on this one - I like it and it's fairly British in yeast character.

 

[roastquake]

Stpug, From 2 browns and one PA with Burton Union, I found that they are all cleaner after about a month. They all tasted green for a few weeks, but last night I was very impressed with, and proud of, my N. English brown

 

[MacrosNZ]

Right so I've had both the Bo Pils and Hefe yeasts stall on me now so won't be using them again any time soon. The M07 ale does produce a super delicious cream of 3 crops cream ale though..

 

[NZLunchie]

Right so I've had both the Bo Pils and Hefe yeasts stall on me now so won't be using them again any time soon. The M07 ale does produce a super delicious cream of 3 crops cream ale though..

hope the 2 pilsners I brewed last week don't stall! Used 2 sachets of bo pils per batch. Here's hoping...

 

[NZLunchie]

well, they both bubbling away so i'm happy so far......

 

[oxpajama]

Hey guys, watch this

On 9/22 I put together this Orange juice cider, IMO you have to use better ingredients to have a better end product. Organic juices taste fuller/sweeter, and more flavorful to me.

2.5 gal organic apple juice
1 gal organic orange juice
1/2 oz med toast American oak chips in primary
Mangrove Jack's M02 Cider yeast, rehydrated, hit must with O2
one tap yeast nutrient
OG 1054
11/8 FG 1004
average fermentation temp was 73*
couple weeks ago I added 1/2 oz sweet orange peel to secondary to enhance citrus character.

Yesterday I tried out my new carbonater cap, cranked it up to 35 psi and shook. The chilled sample is quite clear, tart, very spritzy, the flavors are light, not a ton of citrus but its there. The apple comes through on the finish, and I'm getting some nice soft fruity esters from M02, but this is sour first, might could use half lb of orange blossom honey in the keg.

No weird fermented OJ flavors here to speak of, it does need some sweetness to balance it out, the oak seems nonexistent.

 

[Brewtah]

Here is a short re-cap on my experiences with Workhorse yeast.
12/29/13 brewed a RIPA. OG 1.062. Fermented @ 60f. I used 2 pkg of yeast. There was a 12 hour lag in the start of visible fermentation. 1/6 gravity was 1.020 and HUGE yeast rafts. Warmed up to 72f for a day and then back down to 64f. 1/16 gravity 1.014, very cloudy small yeast rafts. This was my expected OG. I decided to cold crash. I know it may tick off a point or 2, I am ready to have this one done.

This yeast acts differently than I expected. Unless the beer turns out really, really good and clears well, I probably won't use again. I will post again after it is carbed and ready to go.

 

[milldoggy]

I did one with workhorse, I noticed it fermented for days, while my US05 stopped showing co2 activity a lot earlier. I have not checked gravity, will report back my findings. Hope to rack this weekend

 

[stpug]

I got hit by the (ridiculously) low attenuation bug using MJ Newcastle Dark Ale yeast. The same bug that bit beersk a few posts back. I brewed a 1.038 mild that finished at 1.016, and that was using 7 oz invert sugar and a small percentage of dark malts. Calculation: ~57% attenuation

The beer itself tastes fine if not a little thin. It does not taste under attenuated or sweet; in fact it tastes very NOT sweet, surprisingly. The yeast flocculates very well - too well. Good brewing practices were followed throughout: aerated with O2, rehydrated yeast, lag time was short - under 12 hours, fermentation chamber at 64F allowed to rise to 68F, brought to 71F room temp when temp dropped to 67F and allowed to remain at 70s for 7 more days, crash cooled.

I had mashed high at 156F since I was looking to have some body to the beer and didn't want it to finish sub-10. Turns out, MJNDA can't eat sugar with any complexity to it whatsoever. BTW, I've mashes at 156F a few times before without this kind of reaction from the yeast. I suspect a 150F mash would have ended maybe 4 points lower.

Moral of the story: When using this yeast, set BeerSmith yeast properties to 64-70 attenuation, mash very low, consider a sugar addition, be prepared for your beer to finish a bit higher than expected.

Aside from the attenuation issue (which is hard for me to look past), the yeast itself worked very quickly and the beer tastes very nice. There is a fair amount of non-sweet maltiness remaining in the beer especially when you consider it's a full 5 gallon batch with 6 lbs of grain . Since I've only had a sample it's hard to really tell the yeast character, but I do feel like I sense some dark fruit characteristics but they are subtle and work with the beer flavors. As a comparison, Burton Union gives pronounced yeast character to it's beers. The final ABV in right around 2.9% so you can even let your kids try without feeling terrible

 

[JKaranka]

I forgot my numbers with the Newcastle Dark Ale but I'm sure I was getting an attenuation around 65%. Tasted really good, though, plenty of chewy malts. Did you rouse the beer at all? Maybe the strain flocculates a tad too easily and needs to be brought back into suspension.

 

[stpug]

I forgot my numbers with the Newcastle Dark Ale but I'm sure I was getting an attenuation around 65%. Tasted really good, though, plenty of chewy malts. Did you rouse the beer at all? Maybe the strain flocculates a tad too easily and needs to be brought back into suspension.

No, I didn't. I didn't catch the FG until it was kegged. It might have helped; I'll have to be a little more proactive when using new strains in the future. The two times I've roused yeast in the past there's been no change of gravity after several days, so I'm not a huge fan of it considering I have to open my bucket and allow all of the headspace to exchange air with the environment.

I'll be using some of the slurry on a southern english brown in about a week and have made adjustments to my recipe to account for it's performance on this batch. I've lowered the mash from 153 to 149F, and elongated the mash time. I plan on letting the temperature climb up to about 71F at which point I'll try to keep it here for 7 days, and not allow it to slip down at all. Unfortunately, I don't want to add any simple sugars to this batch so the lower mash temp change might result in negligible attenuation change, but I'm hoping it will help along with the fermentation temp increase.

What were some of the details on your 65% AA batch? I'd be perfectly happy with 65% using this yeast.

 

[JKaranka]

I'm moving house and I lost all my notes when I put things in storage a couple of months ago... if you're going for a mild, most British milds include some invert sugar, regular sugar or corn meal / flaked corn. I still think this is due to the low attenuation yeasts. And this is a lot of well known breweries supposedly using or having used adjuncts in mild: Brains, Brakspear, Bass, Batemans, Barclay Perkins, Boddingtons, Courage, Fullers, Hook Norton, Marstons, Theakstons, Thwaites, Whitbread.

 

[reefriot]

I keep and use the Burton and Belgian strains around all the time. I like them better than the Safale yeast and just won a 12pack of them at our clubs raffel. I guess ill be brewing more belgians soon!

 

[Hello]

I'm about to brew a blackberry wheat with Burton Ale. The only thing I wish I knew was the % of attenuation I could expect. Every single site spec lists "high" but that doesn't tell me enough. I like to know these things.

 

[stpug]

My experiences with Burton Union are:
77%AA, 152F mash, 90% base, 10% crystal
74%AA, 152F mash, 90% base, 5% crystal, 5% roast

In BS, I use a 72-76%AA range for BU and my estimates have been within a point of FG. I think you could safely expect about 75% and you'll hit really close. HTH!

 

[one-L]

Just used the West Coast in a 2 Hearted Clone. Almost 48 hours to really get cranking. OG was 1.063, transferred to keg after 3 week primary and its down to 1.008, slightly lower than I would like and its a bit thin. Its been in the keg since last Friday. Sample was alright. Perceived bitterness was higher than batches I have done with 05, aroma and flavor are still coming around. Still super cloudy after a week in the keg but may partially be from dry hops. Ran this higher than I would 05 just to see how it tolerated, probably fluctuated 68-72ish. I normally run 05 in the low 60s with great results but was worried about low attenuation. Some fruity esters but nothing too extreme. Going to let this sit for a couple of weeks and come back to it and see how it melds.

 

[PeteNMA]

I just fermented 10 gallons of English pale ale using M07 and M79 for each five gallon bucket.

The M07 took off a bit quicker but both finished around the same time. Mash was 14lb Maris otter and 4lb dark Munich at 152 for an hour, OG came to 1.052.

Both yeasts finished at 1.010 within a point of each other, the M79 is a lot toppier, but both flocked down very well after a day at 4c wort temperature. Not quite as hard as WLP007 but I only lost about a cup of beer to the yeast, the cakes in the buckets were very well packed.

Ferment ran around 67-69f, no diacetyl flavor or funky esters going on for me.

So far very happy, I'll definitely be trying some of their other varieties


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

 

[stpug]

Here are several data points for several MJ yeasts. The first beer listed under each strain was pitched from a rehydrated original sachet, successive batches were pitched from harvested slurry (no starter used since they were reused quickly).

US West Coast: (fermented low- to mid-60s)
Cream Ale, OG 1.047, FG 1.008, AA 82%, mash 150F, 4.4% sugar, no crystal, no roast
Black IIPA, OG 1.081, FG 1.017, AA 78%, mash 153F, 5% roast, 5% crystal
Pale Ale, OG 1.057, FG 1.011, AA 80%, mash 152F, 7% crystal
Amber Ale, OG 1.067, FG 1.015, AA 76.5%, mash 155F, 19% crystal
Pale Ale, OG 1.058, FG 1.010, AA 82%, mash 153F, 12% crystal

British Ale: (fermented low-60s)
Cream Ale, OG 1.047, FG 1.010, AA 78%, mash 150F, 5% sugar, 30% corn/rice
Amber Ale, OG 1.068, FG 1.011, AA 84%, mash 151F, 1.5% roast, 14% crystal

Burton Union: (fermented mid- to upper-60s)
ESB, OG 1.055, FG 1.012, AA 77%, mash 152F, 10% crystal
N Brown, OG 1.061, FG 1.015, AA 74%, mash 152F, 5% crystal, 5% roast

Newcastle Dark Ale: (fermented upper-60s to low-70s)
Mild, OG 1.038, FG 1.016, AA 57%, mash 156F, 7% sugar, 12% crystal, 4% roast, ferment temp <=68F
S Brown, OG 1.046, FG 1.015, AA 66%, mash 149F, 21% crystal, 3% roast, ferment temp <=72F, roused and heated to 75F


My impression of these yeasts is as follows.

US West Coast is a fantastic yeast, fairly neutral, very lightly fruity, doesn't strip away the residual sugars quite like US05 does. Overall a great strain for most ales. Huge potential for various styles.

British Ale ferments very fully and cleanly (no fruity, no residual sugar) - too cleanly at times. This strain was much more neutral than USWC. I also picked up on a production of "higher alcohols" (i.e. vodka-like) even though it was fermented from 60-62F. It wasn't solvent or acetone, but just a bit vodka-like. The yeast was okay but my overall impression was that I didn't love it. I will try it again in the future but I'm not rushing to do so . I'll definitely mix up my mash schedule and fermentation temp next time to see how it works out.

Burton Union turned out to be a solid British yeast with plenty of unique character. There is no denying it's contribution to the beer. I have a hard time putting words to the yeast character but it was almost pear/apple mixed with some nutty/woody/cask-like character. It was a decently high attenuator for a British strain and contributes a fair amount of character to the final beer. I WILL use this one again and again. I'm think a stout or porter would pair well with the yeast character. Mash high if you want to keep some residual sugars around.

Newcastle Dark Ale deserves the warning of "FORMULATE YOUR BEER ACCORDING TO IT'S SUPER-LOW ATTENUATION POTENTIAL". This strain should have an advertised range of 55-67% AA. If you can formulate your recipes around it's attenuation levels then this is turning out to be a nice yeast. It definitely has some dark fruit character but it's not too pronounced at all, and it doesn't strip away your residual sugars but it's doesn't leave the beer cloying either. My english mild has some plum/prune-like subtleties and for only 57% AA you would think it was sweet but the beer tastes really balanced. My southern brown has some generic subtle dark fruit with just a hint of dark cherry on the finish, and again is not too sweet at all (especially considering the amount of crystal I used). I was actually aiming for more residual sugar than I'm getting but only sampled about 10oz so far so there's still hope. Newcastle works FAST! (24-36 hours and it's 95% done)

Sidenote on Newcastle:
I'm planning a blended yeast ESB with Newcastle (75%) and US05 (25%) because I think the newcastle could produce a nice ESB but I'd like a bit better attenuation (70-74%), and both yeasts will work well up to around 70F without getting into any off characteristics. With the newcastle working fast to create the ester profile, I'm think the us05 will simply clean up most of the residual sugars left untouched by NDA. I'll report back when I get around to brewing this one up.

 

[Espressomattic]

The burton union is the best hands down. It is the one I use most frequently. It adds aovely classic pe ale taste. Some fruity esthers with a touch of sulpher.

It always takes 2 days to get going for me by when it does it goes mental. Clears very very well.

Currently have a pale ale fermenting as I type using British goldings and fuggles with the burton yeast

 

[JKaranka]

I think that Newcastle / US05 combo sounds good. For what its worth, I had the West Coast start fermenting in 12 hours. The recipe had 2 pounds flaked maize and 4 pounds of each maris otter and lager malt. Had a protein rest and two mashes, the first low and the second high (62c and 68c). Maybe the simple sugars helped it out.