Any Mexican lager suggestions?

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Yeah, gives me something to think about.

I've used Hallertauer and Tettnang, and the beers were fine, but I knew the hops weren't quite right (for a Negra Modelo, IMO, it doesn't make them bad choices). I was thinking Saaz next. But again they might be "fine, but not right".

I bought some bottles of Negra Modelo recently, I'll have to have a clear palate before the next one and really think about what I'm tasting.

 

[Broothru]

My go to Mexican lager recipe for a 10 gallon batch:

7 lb. Pale 2 Row
4 lb. 6 row
7 lb. flaked corn

Mash at 150f

1.5 oz. Hallertau Mittelfruh at 60 min.
1.5 oz. whirlpool for 15 minutes

Imperial que Bueno Lager yeast

ferment at 50f

This was based on a Pacifico recipe I found online a few years back.

I used WLP-940 starter from an out of date Pure Pitch, augmented with a sachet of Cellar Science Mexican lager. Both of them are supposedly propagated from Modelo’s house yeast. It took a while for the fermentation to get started, and when it finally did it took a full 13 days from yeast pitch to Final Gravity.

It slowed considerably towards the end but rebounded with the temperature raised for a D-rest. Finally attenuated to 74% and 5% ABV. It tastes really good, but it lost a lot of the corn adjunct flavor/aroma kick that I was looking for. Only 4.5% of the grain bill, so I probably should have added a touch more.

Oh well, I might add a little Saaz terpene to spice things up a bit.

 

[jdubdvdt]

60-65% pilsner
20% flaked corn
15-20% vienna

14ibu total
about 10.5ibu from Liberty at 60'
about 3.5ibu from Liberty at 5'

mash low, like 148F

ferment WLP940 at 50F for 5 days, then 66F for 10 days.


Liberty or Mittelfrueh should be used for this. I use Liberty since it is slightly higher AA and an American hop.

 

[Broothru]

60-65% pilsner
20% corn
15-20% vienna

14ibu total
about 10.5ibu from Liberty at 60'
about 3.5ibu from Liberty at 5'

mash low, like 148F

ferment WLP940 at 50F for 5 days, then 66F for 10 days.


Liberty or Mittelfrueh should be used for this. I use Liberty since it is slightly higher AA and an American hop.

Mine was a little more "ambitious":

43.5% BestMalz Pils
34.8% 2-row Brewer's Malt
8.7% Vienna
4.3% CaraHell
4.3% Flaked Maize
4.3% acidulated

Liberty 3.3 IBU FWH
Saaz 6.8 IBU :15 min.
Sterling 10.2 IBU :15 min.
Liberty 0.5 IBU :20 min whirlpool @ 70C
Sterling. 0.3 IBU :20 min whirlpool @ 70C

WLP-940 starter fermented @ 50F/Cellar Science Mexican Lager co-pitched

OG. 1.046
FG. 1.008
ABV 5.0%
IBUs 21.1
SRM 3.5

I'll know better how it turned out after it conditions for a bit longer and gets fully carbed up, but so far it's looking pretty good. I'm just a little bummed that it seems to have lost most of the hints of corn, probably getting blown off by the fermentation. That's why I'm considering dosing with some Saaz distilate, just to add a little umph to spice it up.

 

[jdubdvdt]

Mine was a little more "ambitious":

43.5% BestMalz Pils
34.8% 2-row Brewer's Malt
8.7% Vienna
4.3% CaraHell
4.3% Flaked Maize
4.3% acidulated

Liberty 3.3 IBU FWH
Saaz 6.8 IBU :15 min.
Sterling 10.2 IBU :15 min.
Liberty 0.5 IBU :20 min whirlpool @ 70C
Sterling. 0.3 IBU :20 min whirlpool @ 70C

WLP-940 starter fermented @ 50F/Cellar Science Mexican Lager co-pitched

OG. 1.046
FG. 1.008
ABV 5.0%
IBUs 21.1
SRM 3.5

I'll know better how it turned out after it conditions for a bit longer and gets fully carbed up, but so far it's looking pretty good. I'm just a little bummed that it seems to have lost most of the hints of corn, probably getting blown off by the fermentation. That's why I'm considering dosing with some Saaz distilate, just to add a little umph to spice it up.

I edited my post I meant to say flaked corn. I think if you use some grits you will get more corn flavor from what I've heard.

Worth a shot

 

[Yesfan]

I brewed another "Mexi-lager" over the weekend after being happy with the last two I did. I thought I had some Vienna left to do another Atlantico beer (NB's Pacifico clone) as I really like that kit. I had to sub some 2row instead. My grain bill was:

Pilsen - 57.4%
2 row - 24.6%
Munich - 9.7%
Flaked maize - 8.2%

Chinook 0.5oz at 45 min
0.5 oz each of Citra and Motueka at 10 min.

Pitched CS Baja slurry at 72F. I had activity around 4 hours later. I did make a big starter from the slurry and this beer looks like it may be already finished after two days. I've fermented with CS Baja once at 74F by accident (failed pressure ferment) and the beer still turned out fine. This beer is still pretty cloudy, so if the FG is low enough, I may try to crash it at 50F for a few days since my kegerator is currently empty. Then I'll just rack to a keg and bring the temps down to serving temperature for another week before tasting.

I know it's not true to style, but what the hell. I've read where Motueka can give off a lime flavor, so figured why not hop it up a bit near the end of the boil.

 

[jdubdvdt]

I kegged my split batch of Mexican Lager over the weekend. One with WLP940 and the other with CS Baja.

I let the CS Baja go an extra 36 hours on gelatin in the fermenter before transferring - didn't have time to do both at the same time.

Pulled a small lowly carbonated sample and I don't want to speak too soon, but CS Baja impressed me. I don't want to say too much until they have time to lager at least a couple weeks.

 

[Broothru]

I did a recent Mexi-lager with a co-pitch of WLP-940 starter and a sachet of Baja. The 940 was a 1st generation propagation from an out-of-date Pure Pitch. Since both yeasts are purportedly Modelo house strain, I wasn’t worried that one yeast would outcompete the other.

Fermentation turned out well, no surprises. It’s lagering right now, so no final judgement yet. But the last sample before kegging was very promising.

 

[jdubdvdt]

Baja is pretty clear at 24 hours after transfer to the keg. Carbonated a little bit overnight, but I had to have a sample.

 

[pvpeacock]

It's funny, because my son who likes to surf in Mexico asked me to make a Mexican Lager. My initial thought was, "why would I do that when you can just buy it at the store." But he piqued by interest, so I found a recipe and brewed a 10 gallon batch which turned out great. My sons and their friends and our neighbors tell me it is one of their favorites, if not their favorite of my beers. Who would have thought.

 

[jdubdvdt]

It's funny, because my son who likes to surf in Mexico asked me to make a Mexican Lager. My initial thought was, "why would I do that when you can just buy it at the store." But he piqued by interest, so I found a recipe and brewed a 10 gallon batch which turned out great. My sons and their friends and our neighbors tell me it is one of their favorites, if not their favorite of my beers. Who would have thought.

Haha, I thought the same way, but now with Modelo going up in cost and my enjoyment of draft beer I will stick to making this one.

 

[Halfakneecap]

Living in australia, imported beers don't always travel well. Corona i find hit and miss. A good one is lovely, most are meh. I did try Victoria a while back, it was really nice. Tecate, well, the price gives away the quality, and i'll drink it on half price wing and beer night haha. Pacifico is also good if fresh, but often meh

WLP940 is a glorious lager yeast i think. I haven't made many with it, but all of them were really good. Have an amber lager with it lagering now ( not drinking til Sept ). Looking forward to tasting.

 

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I found a recipe

I'm curious what yeast and hops were used?

 

[jdubdvdt]

and 1 pack of cellar science baja at 54 degrees for 2 weeks with a 3 days at 68 for DAR.

i lagered it for 4 weeks but it came out really good.

btw this yeast was the cleanest lager yeast i have ever used. its too clean it contributes zero flavor to the beer IMO. it works well for american and mexican lagers not german.

My initial perception of my split batch is similar. Trying to not say too much until they have lagered for a few weeks.
I current prefer the Baja batch.

 

[dmtaylor]

My initial perception of my split batch is similar. Trying to not say too much until they have lagered for a few weeks.
I current prefer the Baja batch.

IF there are any noticeable differences in the finished beer, either in the aroma/flavor or in the final gravity stats, etc., I'm very curious to learn about it. Thanks.

 

[jdubdvdt]

IF there are any noticeable differences in the finished beer, either in the aroma/flavor or in the final gravity stats, etc., I'm very curious to learn about it. Thanks.

I bittered with Liberty and then did a 5 minute addition of Zumo and Liberty. The Zumo is supposedly citrus more like lime and I wanted to try it where a lot of people use Moteuka to get similar flavors. This was a complete split batch after chilling the wort. They were put in the same chamber so the only variable is the yeast.

I have only done two small samples of each and both were immediately at kegging.
Initial feedback is limited as a result.

• WLP940 is either accentuating the Zumo hops or there are some fruity flavors from the yeast. Almost tastes like apple to me. I did some searching on the internet and I have seen others pick up this flavor, but not super common that people can detect ethyl hexanoate. If it is ethyl hexanoate it will likely dissipate with aging. I get similar flavors (apple) from WLP860, but WLP860 really accentuates malt compared to 940.
• WLP940 has a slight alcohol flavor. Possibly too crisp for low ibu? not sure.
• The Baja is letting the Liberty hops shine making the beer taste and smell more noble.
• The Baja appears to have the grain front and center (I am using Barke Pils and Barke Vienna).
• Not much from the flaked corn which is to be expected.

I should have more better feedback this weekend. I will bring some to my homebrew club and see what they think and I will have some with my inlaws.

 

[jdubdvdt]

Split preference at my local homebrew club meeting.

Interesting that half detected the Zumo hops in Baja and the other half detected it more in the 940.

The consensus is the 940 is very crisp.

The owner of our local shop was surprised that he picked Baja as the one tasting most like a true Mexican lager. Although he said for sitting poolside he preferred the 940 (yeast accentuating the Zumo).

Honestly, I wouldn't be upset with either moving forward. If I had Baja sitting around I'd likely pitch that before buying a liquid yeast. If I had 940 and it wasn't fresh I'd probably use Baja if I didn't have time to make a starter. If I had some fresh 940 I might just use that since Baja can wait.

 

[Halfakneecap]

Split preference at my local homebrew club meeting.

Interesting that half detected the Zumo hops in Baja and the other half detected it more in the 940.

The consensus is the 940 is very crisp.

The owner of our local shop was surprised that he picked Baja as the one tasting most like a true Mexican lager. Although he said for sitting poolside he preferred the 940 (yeast accentuating the Zumo).

Honestly, I wouldn't be upset with either moving forward. If I had Baja sitting around I'd likely pitch that before buying a liquid yeast. If I had 940 and it wasn't fresh I'd probably use Baja if I didn't have time to make a starter. If I had some fresh 940 I might just use that since Baja can wait.

Don't you need 2 packs of baja? ( 5 gal ). If i needed 2 packs, im more inclined to stick with 940. Am tempted. Not great reviews all around for Cellar science though.

 

[jdubdvdt]

Don't you need 2 packs of baja? ( 5 gal ). If i needed 2 packs, im more inclined to stick with 940. Am tempted. Not great reviews all around for Cellar science though.

Yes. The pitch rate requires 2 per 5 gallons. I still think there is value in Baja since 2 packs of Baja is still cheaper at $3 each and has a longer shelf life than liquid yeast.

Everyone has different drivers in brewing. Personally I did not mind spending a little extra for the liquid yeast. Unfortunately, my closest homebrew shop is 45 minutes to an hour each way. With young kids I cannot prioritize that trip for some liquid yeast.

I will likely for the foreseeable future keep Baja on hand. I keep a lot of dry yeast at my house and way too much liquid yeast from batches I forgot I was going to make.

 

[Halfakneecap]

Yes. The pitch rate requires 2 per 5 gallons. I still think there is value in Baja since 2 packs of Baja is still cheaper at $3 each and has a longer shelf life than liquid yeast.

Everyone has different drivers in brewing. Personally I did not mind spending a little extra for the liquid yeast. Unfortunately, my closest homebrew shop is 45 minutes to an hour each way. With young kids I cannot prioritize that trip for some liquid yeast.

I will likely for the foreseeable future keep Baja on hand. I keep a lot of dry yeast at my house and way too much liquid yeast from batches I forgot I was going to make.

I guarantee i'll cave in and try it haha. I'm likely to forget to keep some of my starter to make more starters and run out of 940 haha

 

[jdubdvdt]

I guarantee i'll cave in and try it haha. I'm likely to forget to keep some of my starter to make more starters and run out of 940 haha

That is how it usually happens for me. I also forget to bank yeast all the time, but I did buy a bunch of 400 series Omega yeasts to keep on hand since no one else has GMO yeast like that. I will need to remember to spend the time to just build starters to make the banks for them.

I made my Festbier last night and forgot to make a starter until last night. Seems silly, but the yeast was 5 months expired, but I buy basically any expired yeast from my local shop when he needs help getting rid of them. He sells them for very cheap when I buy his whole lot of expired yeast.

Thanks for reminding me I need to order more tubes and syringes.

 

[jdubdvdt]

Ok, been about 3 weeks or so in the keg.
Crystal clear for both of them and have been for awhile. (Condensation only on the glass).

I prefer the wlp940. It's more crisp and has a je ne sais quoi that makes it feel more like an authentic Mexican lager.

I do see the purpose of Baja. I will use Baja in a pinch and for many other light lagers. It's definitely muting some flavors that 940 does not mute.

Next is an Omega vs Baja test.

 

[Halfakneecap]

View attachment 882750

Ok, been about 3 weeks or so in the keg.
Crystal clear for both of them and have been for awhile. (Condensation only on the glass).

I prefer the wlp940. It's more crisp and has a je ne sais quoi that makes it feel more like an authentic Mexican lager.

I do see the purpose of Baja. I will use Baja in a pinch and for many other light lagers. It's definitely muting some flavors that 940 does not mute.

Next is an Omega vs Baja test.

Yum! i think 940 is worth the effort of starters. I do use and like S189 and S23, for my usual rice lagers but 940 is, i feel, just another level up for character, even though i'd describe it as clean.

I'm a week off my first beer in 2 months. With a keg of amber lager ( 940 ) that's been lagering for 6 weeks. Can't wait! Im interested as i had to ferment it 12-13c instead of my usual 10c for 940.

 

[Broothru]

View attachment 882750

Ok, been about 3 weeks or so in the keg.
Crystal clear for both of them and have been for awhile. (Condensation only on the glass).

I prefer the wlp940. It's more crisp and has a je ne sais quoi that makes it feel more like an authentic Mexican lager.

I do see the purpose of Baja. I will use Baja in a pinch and for many other light lagers. It's definitely muting some flavors that 940 does not mute.

Next is an Omega vs Baja test.

Beautiful looking beer! Mine (fermented with 940 and Baja) has been peacefully lagering for nearly a month, but because of an issue I’ve had with the keg losing pressure, I’m letting it sit just a little bit longer.

It looks like the pressure issue is under control, and the last sample was clear like yours but hadn’t displayed that magnificent head. It had very nice lacing. Just lacked that towering foam head. Pressure has been steady for two days now, so I think the keg has reached equilibrium. Bottling day for the comp is a week from next Wednesday, and I’m curious but reluctant to tap it too early.

 

[jdubdvdt]

Yum! i think 940 is worth the effort of starters. I do use and like S189 and S23, for my usual rice lagers but 940 is, i feel, just another level up for character, even though i'd describe it as clean.

I'm a week off my first beer in 2 months. With a keg of amber lager ( 940 ) that's been lagering for 6 weeks. Can't wait! Im interested as i had to ferment it 12-13c instead of my usual 10c for 940.

I was thinking of using the Baja in a rice lager, but wondering if 940 would be the right choice since its got that beautiful crisp finish.

Beautiful looking beer! Mine (fermented with 940 and Baja) has been peacefully lagering for nearly a month, but because of an issue I’ve had with the keg losing pressure, I’m letting it sit just a little bit longer.

It looks like the pressure issue is under control, and the last sample was clear like yours but hadn’t displayed that magnificent head. It had very nice lacing. Just lacked that towering foam head. Pressure has been steady for two days now, so I think the keg has reached equilibrium. Bottling day for the comp is a week from next Wednesday, and I’m curious but reluctant to tap it too early.

I can't wait to see yours and let me know how the co-pitch worked. I am wondering how the flavor turned out.

The beer that inspired me to make a mexican lager is the Stone Buenaveza - buddy of mine had a glass and now this will be my mexican lager glass.

 

[jdubdvdt]

I am going to provide one more update here before I do the unthinkable.

The Baja makes a great beer and so does the 940. The big difference is two things that I have noticed... Baja mutes some of the character of the grain and the hops. 940 still wildly accentuates the hop flavors and gives some fruitier esters. The finish of Baja is crisp, but when you take a sip of 940 it is a night and day difference. 940 is exponentially more crisp than the Baja.
I performed a semi-blind (because I know the variable) triangle test and can identify the odd beer out each time. I attempted the test about 10 times

Now I am going to mix the two kegs together to make a singular 5 gallon keg to take to a tailgate this weekend.

 

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I performed a semi-blind (because I know the variable) triangle test and can identify the odd beer out each time. I attempted the test about 10 times

That's pretty cool!

I know it isn't back-to-back but do you recall how Omega faired, 113? You mentioned 400 Series so maybe you didn't try 113.

Omega's the one that's available from my semi LHBS and so I sometimes wonder if I should use an alternate brand (Omega is great overall but this particular yeast is indeed important to get right and I've never compared).

 

[jdubdvdt]

That's pretty cool!

I know it isn't back-to-back but do you recall how Omega faired, 113? You mentioned 400 Series so maybe you didn't try 113.

Omega's the one that's available from my semi LHBS and so I sometimes wonder if I should use an alternate brand (Omega is great overall but this particular yeast is indeed important to get right and I've never compared).

I have not tried the Omega version on my own, but I have some that my buddy brewed with our recipe. Only difference will be his water profile and process. I am planning a split batch of the Omega OYL 113 vs Baja here as soon as I can knock out my last few competition beers. I believe 113 will behave similarly to 565. I guess that would be a better side by side, but MAYBE I can do that in the early spring. I have some 113 sitting here expiring now. Haha.

 

[jcampbell197]

I did one recently just to use up some ingredients. Instead of flaked corn, I used a bag of Santitas corn chips. It turned out decent, but I think in the future, I'll go back to the flaked corn. Mine had hardly any head retention and I'm sure that was from the oils used to make the chips. It was a novel idea at the time that I probably won't do again, but the beer wasn't bad. I finished the keg, so that's saying something.

I like Pacifico a lot, but noticed that beer lacks good head retention too. I want to do a version of that but with mine having a rich creamy head to it.

I just taste tested my last iteration vs Pacifico and its not a clone but its very close following is the recipe the Carahell was a game changer for me

 

[Yesfan]

I just taste tested my last iteration vs Pacifico and its not a clone but its very close following is the recipe the Carahell was a game changer for me

I'll have to give that a try. Thanks for posting it!

 

[tracer bullet]

Carahell

Interesting, I always felt it would be a bit redundant w/ having a lot of Vienna.

 

[kylewag]

I just taste tested my last iteration vs Pacifico and its not a clone but its very close following is the recipe the Carahell was a game changer for me

That recipe is almost identical to a Mexican lager that I brewed earlier this year.

 

[Broothru]

I just taste tested my last iteration vs Pacifico and its not a clone but its very close following is the recipe the Carahell was a game changer for me

Here's my 'generic' Mexican lager that I brewed for a comp:

Best Malz Heidelberg pilsner - 43.5%
2-row Brewer's Malt - 34.8%
Vienna - 8.7%
acidulated 4.3%
CaraHell - 4.3%
Flaked Maize - 4.3%

Liberty (FWH) - 3.3 IBU
Saaz (15) - 8.8 IBU
Sterling (15) - 10.2 IBU

ABV - 5.0%
IBU - 21.3
SRM - 3.5

White Labs WLP-940, followed with a seconday pitch of Cellar Science Baja dry yeast

Beer turned out great. Crystal clear, light, clean, mild hops and slight corn aroma. Judging was yesterday, but results and scores haven't been released yet. It was one of six beers I entered. Fingers crossed for favorable comments and good scores.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Here's my 'generic' Mexican lager that I brewed for a comp:

Best Malz Heidelberg pilsner - 43.5%
2-row Brewer's Malt - 34.8%
Vienna - 8.7%
acidulated 4.3%
CaraHell - 4.3%
Flaked Maize - 4.3%

Liberty (FWH) - 3.3 IBU
Saaz (15) - 8.8 IBU
Sterling (15) - 10.2 IBU

ABV - 5.0%
IBU - 21.3
SRM - 3.5

White Labs WLP-940, followed with a seconday pitch of Cellar Science Baja dry yeast

Beer turned out great. Crystal clear, light, clean, mild hops and slight corn aroma. Judging was yesterday, but results and scores haven't been released yet. It was one of six beers I entered. Fingers crossed for favorable comments and good scores.

Why so low a % of Maize?

 

[Broothru]

Why so low a % of Maize?

I was looking to avoid a heavy corn taste/aroma, and ended up under-shooting what I wanted to achieve but actually ended up with something I liked better. Next time I intend to use malted corn instead of flaked maize, which I hope will enhance the corn aroma without overpowering the flavor, or ending up too sweet (or alcoholic).

Coincidentally, right now I’m enjoying a beer from Troeg’s brewery in Pennsylvania that is an American lager with Mexican lager nuances and a hint of salt and lime. Kinda’ like ‘gringo’ beer crossed with a Margarita. It’s exceptionally pleasant on this late summer afternoon. SWMBO’d and I will be visiting the brewery later this week. We’ve been there before several years ago and are looking forward to the return visit.