Another P-J Diagram: BIAB 5500W Single Vessel Single Pump, Illuminated Switches

[P-J]

I am looking at doing a build very similar to this. But, my access to a 240V is kind of limited without pulling out the stove and wiring there. So in the mean time I am planning on running off a 120V GFI protected socket. (This should be fine, since for now I am only doing 2.5 gallons.) However, I would like to plan for the future and have everything wired up so that I can use 240 in the future and just have to swap out the element.

My question is can I wire up my control panel according to the diagram below, using a 120V, 2000W element. The SSR and contractor would be 240V, so when I do want to move to 240 I can just run the second hot line to contractor.

(Edit: Sorry for the hijack.)

I think you would be fine but please do not my word for it. Let's wait for P-J to chime in.

John

Yes it can be done that way without issue.

 

[frieed]

I realize this is an old thread, but many people will use it as a reference for new systems.

One important point to be aware of on this circuit. If you are running in PID control mode (i.e. the contactor is closed) and turn off the heating element using the using the PID controller (I am guessing it probably has a manual on/off button) then the wire to the element that does not go through the SSR is still live and touching it and anything grounded (possibly your brew kettle, brew stand frame, controller box, etc) will provide a path for current and provide yet another way to test you GFCI...

To prevent this, add a second SSR in series with the other contactor input, and wired to the same controls as the first.

I would put two indicator lights on the heater side of the contactor. One from each output to neutral. With on SSR, the non SSR side would glow continuously while power is applied while the one on the SSR side would go on and off with the heating element.

why not replace the contactor with a manual DP switch? still has the issue above, but "should" be cheaper.

John,

You have it right with your last illustration.

Here is an updated drawing for you.
(As always, click on the image for a full scale diagram printable on Tabloid paper 11" x 17")



P-J

 

[ShakerD]

I realize this is an old thread, but many people will use it as a reference for new systems.

One important point to be aware of on this circuit. If you are running in PID control mode (i.e. the contactor is closed) and turn off the heating element using the using the PID controller (I am guessing it probably has a manual on/off button) then the wire to the element that does not go through the SSR is still live and touching it and anything grounded (possibly your brew kettle, brew stand frame, controller box, etc) will provide a path for current and provide yet another way to test you GFCI...

To prevent this, add a second SSR in series with the other contactor input, and wired to the same controls as the first.

I would put two indicator lights on the heater side of the contactor. One from each output to neutral. With on SSR, the non SSR side would glow continuously while power is applied while the one on the SSR side would go on and off with the heating element.

why not replace the contactor with a manual DP switch? still has the issue above, but "should" be cheaper.

Umm I am confused isn't that the point of the illuminated switch number 1 and the contactor? Of course I am nothing close to an electrician.

 

[P-J]

Umm I am confused isn't that the point of the illuminated switch number 1 and the contactor? Of course I am nothing close to an electrician.

That is it exactly.

Another point:

and turn off the heating element using the using the PID controller (I am guessing it probably has a manual on/off button) then the wire to the element that does not go through the SSR is still live and touching it and anything grounded will provide a path for current

You should never be messing with the wiring inside the controller unless it is unplugged - i.e. totally powered down & disabled. With the controller properly built and enclosed there is no issue.

 

[seatbelt123]

I want to do something similar to this but without the illuminated switches in order to cut costs. Two questions:

1. Using non illuminated switches doesn't change the wiring diagram, right?
2. What type of switch do you recommend?

Thanks!

 

[P-J]

I want to do something similar to this but without the illuminated switches in order to cut costs. Two questions:

1. Using non illuminated switches doesn't change the wiring diagram, right?
2. What type of switch do you recommend?

Thanks!

Switch #1 would be this: www.grainger.com - NKK-Toggle-Switch-2TPF6 - DPST
With the use of this high amp switch the contactor can be eliminated as both phases of the 240V are switched on or off.
The illuminated switches do not have the current carrying capability for the element and a contactor must be used in that situation.

Switch #2 & #3 would be this: www.grainger.com - POWER-FIRST-Toggle-Switch-2VLN5 - SPST

I hope this helps you and - BTW - if you have problems figuring out the diagram change, please let me know.

P-J

 

[seatbelt123]

Switch #1 would be this: www.grainger.com - NKK-Toggle-Switch-2TPF6 - DPST
With the use of this high amp switch the contactor can be eliminated as both phases of the 240V are switched on or off.
The illuminated switches do not have the current carrying capability for the element and a contactor must be used in that situation.

Switch #2 & #3 would be this: www.grainger.com - POWER-FIRST-Toggle-Switch-2VLN5 - SPST

I hope this helps you and - BTW - if you have problems figuring out the diagram change, please let me know.

P-J

Nice! Thanks for the quick reply. I think I can figure out the diagram. This will definitely reduce the cost of the build.

 

[P-J]

Nice! Thanks for the quick reply. I think I can figure out the diagram. This will definitely reduce the cost of the build.

You are more than welcome. I hope your build goes well.

P-J

 

[ekjohns]

This thread is perfect for me! Thanks to the OP, the posters, and most of all P-J you ROCK!

 

[zgja2]

Hey PJ. Can you re-post the original diagram? It will not display for me. Thanks!

 

[ThreeDogsNE]

I hope you get a reply, but I wouldn't hold your breath. P-J hasn't been seen on this site since 7/23/2015. Prior to that he was posting that he had COPD and didn't expect to live much longer. His work is in part archived elsewhere.

 

[ThreeDogsNE]

Perhaps you will find what you need in this archive, collected by someone else, and found near the end of this thread: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/list-of-pj-electrical-diagrams.382286/.

The archive: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B3vePHEj1uiCTDNPRGZnTkUweUk

 

[doug293cz]

Hey PJ. Can you re-post the original diagram? It will not display for me. Thanks!

If you provide specifics of just what you want in your controller, I can set you up with a design - either one I have already done, or a new one that meets your requirements.

Edit: Here's a design I did recently that meets the requirements in the thread title:

Brew on