GrowlerMonkey
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Yeah we really need to work on this one. I'm just waiting on the 2014 crop of nelson sauvin to show up, and I will be actively involved with this thread.
I brewed this last Saturday(Oct. 18th) dry hopped 2 days ago. samples are promising and color is very close
I'm not doing the 48*, 2 week dry hop; but rather a 5 day warm dry hop.
Hope to have this in the keg next weekend
PS - 2014 nelson is available at farmhouse brewing supply
I'm not doing the 48*, 2 week dry hop; but rather a 5 day warm dry hop.
My Nelson hops are on the way. Attached is the recipe I'll be brewing.
*Notes*
Water Profile should be close to San Diego
Calcium: 58 ppm
Bicarbonate 139 ppm
Magnesium 23 ppm
Sodium 88 ppm
Chloride 100 ppm
Sulfate 176 ppm
Alkalinity 114 ppm
I'll be using Lactic Acid to adjust mash pH into the 5.4 - 5.5 range and prevent sparge water from extracting tannins.
Recipe Type: All Grain
Yeast: Wyeast American Ale 1056
Yeast Starter: Yes
Additional Yeast or Yeast Starter: NA
Batch Size (Gallons): 10.5
Original Gravity: 1.069
Final Gravity: 1.014
IBU: 50
Boiling Time (Minutes): 90
Color: 5 SRM
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 10 - 12 days, 65 F
Additional Fermentation: (Dry Hop) 2 weeks at 48F
Tasting Notes: NA
(My recipe's grist weight is scaled for 83% efficiency)
Fermentables:
Single infusion mash, 1 hour @ 150F, batch sparge
UK 2 Row Pale Malt - 15.5lbs (63.27%)
UK Maris Otter - 3lbs (12.24%)
Rye Malt - 2.5lbs (10.2%)
Flaked Rye - 2.5lbs (10.2%)
Mild Ale Malt - 1lb (4.08%)
Hops:
Pacific Gem 14.6AA - 1 oz -FWH (24 AAU)
Nelson Sauvin 12.5AA - 1 oz -30 min (15 AAU)
Southern Cross 12.5AA - 0.5 oz - 15 min (5 AAU)
Nelson Sauvin 12.5AA - 1 oz - 5 min (4 AAU)
Southern Cross 12.5AA - 1 oz - 5 min (4 AAU)
Dry Hop:
5 oz ea/Nelson Sauvin & Southern Cross 14 days @ 48F
*Mild Ale malt is just Cargill's version of Dextrine malt. At 4% of grist all it will do is add a hint of body and near-balance the dryness of the 20% rye.
Have not got around to brewing this.
That is a lot of rye, nearly 30%. Just be prepared for that...
Someone on reddit posted this recipe. Seems like they got it from someone who got it from Pat. The amount of hops seems way too low though. Comes out to about 30 IBU which seems pretty low.
http://www.reddit.com/r/Homebrewing/comments/2ukkbo/who_needs_alpine_when_you_can_brew_nelson/
Nelson 1.069/1.016 (5 Gal) - He originally gave me the commercial recipe, so I scaled it down exactly from that and this is why the numbers are odd for 5 gallons. This recipe is spot on though. I doubt you could tell the difference between the beers if you ferment with good temp control and a proper pitch of Chico...
Grain Bill
- 8.316 lbs. - 2 Row Pale Malt
- 1.708 lbs. Maris Otter
- 2.562 lbs. Weyermann Rye
- 0.854 lbs. Carafoam or Carapils
- 0.546 lbs. Acidulated
Hop Schedule
- FWH Southern Cross 9 grams
- 30 Min. Nelson Sauvin 6 grams
- 15 Min. Southern Cross 9 grams
- 5 Min. Nelson Sauvin 18 grams
- 5 Min. Southern Cross 12 grams
- Dry hop Nelson Sauvin 65 grams and Southern Cross 53 grams (7 days after transfer to secondary for 14 days, rouse twice in 2 weeks, early and late.)
Yeast
- White Labs California Ale Yeast (WLP001) - 1800 mL starter Mash/Sparge/Boil
Mash at 150° for 90 Min. Sparge as usual. Boil for 90 minutes so as not to scorch the wort. Cool and ferment at 68°
The acidulated is almost 4% of the grain bill. Do you know if it's just used to adjust the PH or is it part of the recipe?
In this style of beer the acidulated is only for pH adjustment. You will need to scale your use according to your water requirements.
The flaked rye is too high though, especially with that much dextrin malt.
. 20% total
Grab some SC from Yakima valley hops. Pretty cheap too.Get your recipe square with around 20% total rye content. My estimate was close to 50/50 flaked/malted.
Alpine Nelson also seemed dry to me so maybe a lower mash temp and less dextrine malt would be in order, but I could be confusing the rye characteristics with the actual FG of the beer. Hard to be certain unless you brew it.
I'm almost certain I won't brew this. I had plans to but sourcing S. Cross locally and going through the ordeal with getting rye has kinda soured my intentions. Plus I really didn't LOVE this beer.
There are many other wonderful examples of Nelson Sauvin beers out there. I'm sitting on 3 lbs. of those hops and should probably start brewing something with them... Probably a Societe Pupil clone...
Yes, they use 10% rye malt and 10% flaked rye. I've had Alpine Nelson and the rye is prominent. 30% would be excessive IMO especially if you're looking to clone this.
Where did the 10%/10% split info come from?
I sorta kinda posted this already.This is the supposed recipe from Pat at Alpine:
(Circa 2011, so YMMV. "They use an addition of flaked rye nowadays and the first hop addition is Exp 05250.")
Nelson 1.069/1.016 (5 Gal) - He originally gave me the commercial recipe, so I scaled it down exactly from that and this is why the numbers are odd for 5 gallons. This recipe is spot on though. I doubt you could tell the difference between the beers if you ferment with good temp control and a proper pitch of Chico...
Grain Bill
8.316 lbs. - 2 Row Pale Malt
1.708 lbs. Maris Otter
2.562 lbs. Weyermann Rye
0.854 lbs. Carafoam or Carapils
0.546 lbs. Acidulated
Hop Schedule
FWH Southern Cross 9 grams
30 Min. Nelson Sauvin 6 grams
15 Min. Southern Cross 9 grams
5 Min. Nelson Sauvin 18 grams
5 Min. Southern Cross 12 grams
Dry hop Nelson Sauvin 65 grams and Southern Cross 53 grams (7 days after transfer to secondary for 14 days, rouse twice in 2 weeks, early and late.)
Yeast
White Labs California Ale Yeast (WLP001) - 1800 mL starter Mash/Sparge/Boil
Mash at 150° for 90 Min. Sparge as usual. Boil for 90 minutes so as not to scorch the wort. Cool and ferment at 68°
The plot thickens...Alpine confirmed they only use flaked rye and they do use acidulated malt.
Alpine confirmed they only use flaked rye and they do use acidulated malt.
FourSeasonAngler said:I've been studying that video. Here are some facts:
1 sack of Weyerman Carabohemian *edit- later learned this to be Carafoam
1 sack of Simpson's Maris Otter
3 sacks of Rolled Oat flakes
3 five gallon pails of unidentified grain
2 6 gallon pails of unidentified grain
(4 of which (two 6gal & two 5gal) are "identified as Rye" at one point in the video *but could be misleading)
Base malt 2 row *unspecified quantity
OG 1.065
ABV 7.0%
with a total grain bill of approximately 850lbs.
10 Bbl system
25 Bbl fermenters out back (for Nelson as stated in the video)
They brew twice to get 12 Bbl from each batch.
Batch size: ?
Pulled house yeast off of yeast cake from 4 to 5 day old batch of Nelson.
Added Clarity ferm before adding yeast to wort
FWH: NZ hop variety (unspecified) 2.0 qts pellets *all I could see was volume*
2nd hop addition after 60 minutes: 1 qt. Nelson Sauvin + Whirlfloc
3rd hop addition at 75 minutes: 1 qt. Southern Cross + Yeast Nutrient
4th hop addition at (90 ? ) min: 3 qt. Nelson Sauvin + 2 qt. Southern Cross
Then flameout/knockout.
Cool & O2 wort/transfer to 25Bbl fermenter.
Ferments 7 to 10 days.
Then cold crash & remove yeast cake.
Dry hop w/ (2) 5 gallon buckets of unidentified hops for 2 weeks *circulated*
That would go against what is presented in the video. How did you learn of this confirmation?
From the video it is known:
If they are only using flaked rye, then the 3 sacks is not enough and there is an imbalance in the grist as shown and as reported.
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