Allagash Curieux Clone

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dogbar

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I wouldn't sweat it. You could always try pitching a little bit of both pouches instead. Or pitch some from the fresher of the two, figuring that one will have a higher cell count anyway.
 

chichum

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Well it's bottled and I've already drank about 15 of them. My god this beer is good (and strong! 9.2%). It's not exactly like the Curieux but it's pretty damn close. I made a mistake when I first brewed it and forgot to put 3lbs of the extract in. I ended up adding it about a week later and I'm wondering if that has anything to do with it. I'm still trying to figure out what's off about it. The sweetness is right and the amount of bourbon seems right. Regardless, this is, by far, my favorite beer that I've made to date. I have already brewed a new batch to get it on it's way. Thanks to everyone for their help!

 

chichum

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The one I made is an extract - the one I just brewed a few days ago was all grain. Here you go (all item numbers are for midwest supplies):


Allagash Curieux Clone
Note: this is for a half mash using malt extract. For a full mash, add the 13lbs. of Pilsner
Malt grains and 1lbs of Carapils and seep for 60 minutes.

Bring water to 149 degrees for the mash
Add the 0.5lbs of Carapils
Seep for 45-60 minutes at 149f
Remove the mash and bring the mixture to a boil
At first boil, add 9.3lbs malt extract
Bring to a rolling boil
At first boil, add 0.5oz tettnang and 1oz of hersbrucker
After 30 minutes, add 0.25oz of tettnang and 0.5oz of hersbrucker
After 45 minutes, add the 1lbs of corn sugar
After 50 minutes, add 0.25oz of tettnang and 0.5oz of hersbrucker
After 60 minutes, remove and cool

70 f for fermentation week 1
78 f for fermentation week 2
70 f for fermentation weeks 3,4

Put in the primary fermenter
Soak the cubes in Jim Beam for 1 month.
After 30 days, dump the JB from the container and put fresh Jim Beam in.
After 60 days, put the wort in the secondary
After 90 days, add 2.5oz oak cubes (discard the JB first) to secondary. Also, put new JB in
with the last 0.5oz chips.
After 111 days, add the last 0.5oz of cubes AND the JB it’s soaking in into the secondary.
After 120 days, bottle the beer

INGREDIENTS:
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13 lbs pilsner malt [13lbs x 3315x]
1 lbs Carapils [1lbs x 3009B]
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OR
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9.3lbs Pilsner Malt Extract [9.3lbs x M3007]
0.5lbs Carapils [0.5lbs x 3009B]
--------------

1lbs corn sugar [1lbs 7553]
1oz tettnang [1 x 1556]
2oz hersbrucker [2 x 1523]
Yeast: 1 smackpack of Belgian Ardennes, and one of WLP550 [1 x ACT3522, 1 x WL550]
3oz of Hungarian medium toast oak cubes in Jim Beam [1 x 8244x]
5oz priming sugar [1 x 7540]
 

jabergess

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Just a follow on to my post. Though my FG was extremely low at 1.000 and tasted rather dry at the time, now that I've bottled it and let it sit, it is delicious! One of the best Belgians I believe I've made! It has a nice complex flavor and has won over some people that normally are very picky about their beers. Yay! OG was 1.070 so that makes this a 9.15% beer. It is extremely clear and has that thicker mouth feel I associate with a Belgian. I'm not sure what I would do differently with this one...other than maybe get a higher OG and FG.



Oh just a side note...I took the yeast from this one and dumped a "Kitchen Sink Imperial Stout" on top. Tasted great out of primary and should just get better in secondary. I split a 10 gallon batch and put the other 5 gallons over Irish Ale yeast. It is very interesting to note the taste differences. The Belgian yeast mix is having a heyday with all of that sugar in the Imperial Stout. Beer is a good 4% higher than the one on the Irish Ale yeast (9% versus 13%!). If it turns out like I think it will, next time I make this Allagash Curieux Clone I'll follow it with the Imperial Stout again and dump all 10 gallons on top the yeast!
 

dogbar

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Man, on the re-brew this was great going into secondary. Nice and dry after I made the recipe adjustments.

Unfortunately, my new LHBS doesn't sell oak cubes, just chips, and somewhere between two and three weeks I think the oak went over the top. It's still not carbed so we'll see how it develops, but ... ack.
 

jabergess

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Oh man, that sucks! I hope with aging the oak will mellow some, it usually does. My opinion - stock up on oak cubes from Morebeer or Northern Brewer.
 

dogbar

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Agreed on all counts. I was hoping to have this ready for a competition by the end of October. We'll see.
 

dogbar

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Lesson, again, on chilling out and letting things come together. I really should know that by now.

Oak level is fine in the keg. It has a slightly less refined character to it, though, which I'm attributing to chips vs. cubes.

Ordered cubes for the next batch today :)
 

mhot55

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I made this batch yesterday, using both Belgian Ardennes (3522) & WLP500 (or 550, can't remember) with separate starters. What ferment temps did you use. I know with many Belgian styles, they start off around 67* then after 2 days are ramped up a few degrees every day until they hit 75,80, heck even 85*. This gets the yeast pitching in all their flavors and helps attenuation. Also, considering how strong this is, how long have you guys let it age?.....I plan on using 1-1.25 oz oak cubes for max of 2 months.
 
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1Mainebrew

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I fermented at a room temp of 70 and did not use temperature control I just let it self rise. I would stick to a month on the oak. Have fun and make great beer!
 
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1Mainebrew

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I left it in primary 2 months, kegged it and left it at room temp for 2.5 months and then chilled it and drank it. It aged really well. I think it peaked with the last pour so the longer the better with my experience. Enjoy!
 

chichum

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I made this batch yesterday, using both Belgian Ardennes (3522) & WLP500 (or 550, can't remember) with separate starters. What ferment temps did you use. I know with many Belgian styles, they start off around 67* then after 2 days are ramped up a few degrees every day until they hit 75,80, heck even 85*. This gets the yeast pitching in all their flavors and helps attenuation. Also, considering how strong this is, how long have you guys let it age?.....I plan on using 1-1.25 oz oak cubes for max of 2 months.
Check out post #165 to see how I did it. I have the whole schedule and temperatures in there.

Jeff
 

Wreckoncile

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I just had this beer for the first time last week at a fancy steakhouse for my first wedding anniversary. Loved it and would've ordered a second bottle if not for the already high enough ABV and pricetag ($35 at said high end steakhouse).

I will be trying to brew this sometime in the near future. But being a rookie brewer (just bottled my second brew), I'll have to wait until I get a few more styles out of the way and I can get purchase a second carboy (the idea of not being able to brew something for a full two months while waiting for my carboy to clear is simple heresy). The greatest part will be when I tell my swmbo "remember that beer that I got on our anniversary that cost $35? Well, I just made five gallons of it for only $10 more."
 
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1Mainebrew

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Wreckoncile said:
I just had this beer for the first time last week at a fancy steakhouse for my first wedding anniversary. Loved it and would've ordered a second bottle if not for the already high enough ABV and pricetag ($35 at said high end steakhouse).

I will be trying to brew this sometime in the near future. But being a rookie brewer (just bottled my second brew), I'll have to wait until I get a few more styles out of the way and I can get purchase a second carboy (the idea of not being able to brew something for a full two months while waiting for my carboy to clear is simple heresy). The greatest part will be when I tell my swmbo "remember that beer that I got on our anniversary that cost $35? Well, I just made five gallons of it for only $10 more."
Happy anniversary!
 

mhot55

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Just kegged this one after 8-9 weeks on bourbon soaked oak cubes. Put around 1-2 oz of fresh bourbon into the keg also. Carbing up to 3.3 volumes of CO2. Gonna try to be real patient and let it sit another month or 2 before drinking. But it tasted real good going into the keg. I'll post when I drink
 

dogbar

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My second batch came out a little hot/rough so I've been giving it some more time to age out. Just took a sample out of the lagering fridge and it's ready. It'll be on next.

Just started soaking the cubes for the next batch :)
 

mhot55

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Pulled first draft- this is awesome. Very similar to the original from what I can tell, bit didn't do side-by-side comparison. To recap- ferment for 3-4 weeks in primary (letting temp ramp up to 75 or so), racked onto 1.5 oz oak cubes (soaking in bourbon for a month) for 8-9 weeks. Then kegged and added a splash of fresh bourbon- maybe an ounce. This one is around 9% ABV yet is smooth. No alcohol burn; the Belgian flavors profile and that of the bourbon melded beautifully. Among the top 5 I have ever made. Thanks for recipe and all the input.
 
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1Mainebrew

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You're welcome! Gotta love a good ole allagash clone!
 

dogbar

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Batch #2. It's taken longer to get to peak, but we're there now.

Camera adds 10 Lovibond, as usual.

image-2523474014.jpg
 

Strongbad52

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Mainebrew, I am going to be brewing this on Saturday. Did you dump both yeasts in the same starter or did you make two separate ones?
 

jabergess

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And I did two separate starters and then dumped them one behind the other in the wort. I don't think it really matters....
 

Strongbad52

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Thanks for the quick replies, I was getting sorta worried. The smack pack has swelled and I have the wlp550 in about 1500 ml of starter. I guess I will just so another 600 ml of starter and dump in the smack pack.
 
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1Mainebrew

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Thanks guys! I ended up using a single starter with both yeasts about 1500 mls total. It was CRAZY the amount of yeast that starter made. Yeast was all over the vessel, all over the counter top, flowing down the cabinet door and on the floor. Simply put, it was the most rockin' starter in my brewing career!
 

jabergess

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I'm buying the stuff today to do this one again. Despite my extremely low FG, it was one of the best beers I've made. I'm not certain I would change a thing. I need to get the oak cubes on the bourbon!
 

wickdawg

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Am glad I found this thread. I have a 5 gallon Balcones blue corn whiskey barrel that is just sitting in my house at I need to use this thing ASAP. This might have pushed me over the edge to brew this up to have this fall/winter.
 

jabergess

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This time I did a little something different. I kept back 1 gallon of the batch before adding oak cubes and bourbon. I'll mix the gallon with the 4 gallons that have been aged on the oak and bourbon at bottling. I don't know what difference this will make but I was curious. Funny, I said in the previous post I wouldn't change a thing. Ah such is the prerogative of a homebrewer to change her mind!
 
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1Mainebrew

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This time I did a little something different. I kept back 1 gallon of the batch before adding oak cubes and bourbon. I'll mix the gallon with the 4 gallons that have been aged on the oak and bourbon at bottling. I don't know what difference this will make but I was curious. Funny, I said in the previous post I wouldn't change a thing. Ah such is the prerogative of a homebrewer to change her mind!
Actually sounds more authentic to the real Allagash MO.
 
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1Mainebrew

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This time I did a little something different. I kept back 1 gallon of the batch before adding oak cubes and bourbon. I'll mix the gallon with the 4 gallons that have been aged on the oak and bourbon at bottling. I don't know what difference this will make but I was curious. Funny, I said in the previous post I wouldn't change a thing. Ah such is the prerogative of a homebrewer to change her mind!
Hows it coming this time around?
 

jabergess

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It's even better! I find it to be sweeter tasting - less dry. Probably because of the lowered amount of oak. It is also a tad lighter in color. (I did a side by side comparison with one of the few remaining original bottles) As it ages it should get even smoother, assuming it will be allowed to age! :D
 

bolus14

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Putting this on the need to brew list, might be one or two a head of it though
 

bolus14

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Checked with LHBS and grains and hops are good to go, since they don't stuck much Wyeast I asked if the could order 3522 for this week and all they had was WLP500 so 550 is on their order for this week too, both should be there Thursday! Since it seems the combo of these two strains is a major piece to this I wasn't willing to substitute due to their stock like I've had to on about half the beers I've made so far.

I'm thinking of using Jim Beam Devil's Cut in place of regular Jim Beam, any thoughts? It has a sweeter, more vanilla like flavor to me. Name the brew "The Devil's Cut Tripel" or "The Trident."
 

bolus14

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Wondering if anybody has info on Chichum timeline post, post #165. Is that accurate or have others racked to secondary(or left in primary), added oak cubes, and bottled at different times?
 
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