All Grain Ale FG Prob

[BigRedDog]

Hey all, I am back on the brewing wagon after a 10 hiatus.. I brewed Sierra Nevada clone.. 28lb grain bill for 10 gal batch.. I'm new to the Brewzilla and accidentally started the new step in my profile. So my mash started heating up to 170. I caught it about 167 but it took a bit to drop it.. The plan was to mash at 155.. I'm using the Rapt pill for the first time..

My planned starting gravity was 1.059... according to the pill was 1.060.. My ferment temps were pretty steady.. 2 degree variance with my pump and cooler.. I'm in Aruba so ambient temperature here is always warm. final gravity is 1.021.. which is high I know.. but the according the pill the alcohol is 5.66.. dead on with the recipe.. the fermenter is still bubbling every 30 seconds or so but the gravity hasn't moved for days.. advice????

 

[Sammy86]

Hey all, I am back on the brewing wagon after a 10 hiatus.. I brewed Sierra Nevada clone.. 28lb grain bill for 10 gal batch.. I'm new to the Brewzilla and accidentally started the new step in my profile. So my mash started heating up to 170. I caught it about 167 but it took a bit to drop it.. The plan was to mash at 155.. I'm using the Rapt pill for the first time.. View attachment 852940
My planned starting gravity was 1.059... according to the pill was 1.060.. My ferment temps were pretty steady.. 2 degree variance with my pump and cooler.. I'm in Aruba so ambient temperature here is always warm. final gravity is 1.021.. which is high I know.. but the according the pill the alcohol is 5.66.. dead on with the recipe.. the fermenter is still bubbling every 30 seconds or so but the gravity hasn't moved for days.. advice????

Welcome back to the obsession. Patience is what I would suggest. Wait another three days, maybe take a gravity sample the old fashion way to verify FG and then if its stable, package in your preferred manner.

 

[BigRedDog]

Thank you... I'll be patient.. the old fashioned way matched the pill.. you wouldn't pitch any more yeast though?

 

[BigRedDog]

any thoughts I why the pill says my ABV is 5.66.. matching the recipe when it looks like I created some unfermentable sugars...

 

[hotbeer]

There are other reasons why you might see bubbles after fermentation is complete. So trust your hydrometer to tell you and just accept it's those other reasons for the bubbles in this case.

I use a raptPill too. I've calibrated it once or twice, but like refractometers, it seems to be off on the final gravity. Whether that's because of the alcohol that throws of refractometers or some other mechanism, even just resting on the side of the fermenter, I don't know and really don't care. The pill is just for relative measure. I'm going to check with a glass bulb hydrometer anyhow at bottling time.

So you are concerned that your FG went too low? Or am I misunderstanding. I'd say part of the answer might be how much caramel malt you used or other malts that might create more unfermentable sugars. As well the brand of caramel malt or any other malt might matter. At any rate, wait till you check it with a bulb hydrometer before getting concerned if you hit your numbers or not.

Your average temp for the ferment isn't but a degree or two higher than what I ferment at. I've got a beer in the FV now that is sitting at 1.014 SG for the last 11 days. It was just two malts. 2 row Rahr Pale and some Breis Carapils to give it that little be higher SG. Usually I'm down in the 1.010 ± .002 range with beers that are lower in Carapils or don't have any at all.

 

[redrocker652002]

I don't know anything about the Raptor Pill, but mirror what was said about patience. I was the worst when it came to waiting for my beer to finish, but after a few years, I have now found that waiting and doing it when my schedule allows makes it a much nicer brew day and a much better experience. I have not found that waiting a few days or even a few weeks has had much impact on my beers. I have brewed the Sierra Nevada clone recipe from Morebeer and I ended up with a FG of about 1.012 I think.
Funny thing, my brew yesterday I lost my temp a bit and started I bit high at 156 or so for about the first 5 to 10 minutes of the mash. I ended up with an OG of about 1.062 instead of 1.056 that it should have been. You just made me think about that and wonder if the initially high temp for that 10 minutes or so caused the higher OG. Either way, good luck and have fun. You still made beer, it just might be a bit sweeter than the original, which may not be a bad thing either. LOL

 

[mac_1103]

any thoughts I why the pill says my ABV is 5.66

I know nothing at all about the Rapt Pill, but my only thought is that the the readings it's giving you can't possibly all be correct. If the FG is correct then the ABV is lower. If the ABV is correct then the FG is lower.

As to the mash temp/unfermentable sugars issue, adding more yeast won't help. Unless it's a diastatic strain, and I wouldn't do that. I guess you could add a little alpha amylase. Not glucoamylase though, unless you want to drop you FG to 1.000 or less.

 

[hotbeer]

Oh, I missed that about your ABV. While you say your OG is 1.060. Note that your pill is going by that spike where it shows 1.062 or 1.063.

Which by the calculator on Brewer's Friend says will be 5.51%ABV using the 1.063 for the OG

https://www.brewersfriend.com/abv-calculator/

Close enough to 5.66 for my purposes. There are different ways to calculate ABV. And none guarantee that is actually your correct ABV.

 

[BigRedDog]

There are other reasons why you might see bubbles after fermentation is complete. So trust your hydrometer to tell you and just accept it's those other reasons for the bubbles in this case.

I use a raptPill too. I've calibrated it once or twice, but like refractometers, it seems to be off on the final gravity. Whether that's because of the alcohol that throws of refractometers or some other mechanism, even just resting on the side of the fermenter, I don't know and really don't care. The pill is just for relative measure. I'm going to check with a glass bulb hydrometer anyhow at bottling time.

So you are concerned that your FG went too low? Or am I misunderstanding. I'd say part of the answer might be how much caramel malt you used or other malts that might create more unfermentable sugars. As well the brand of caramel malt or any other malt might matter. At any rate, wait till you check it with a bulb hydrometer before getting concerned if you hit your numbers or not.

Your average temp for the ferment isn't but a degree or two higher than what I ferment at. I've got a beer in the FV now that is sitting at 1.014 SG for the last 11 days. It was just two malts. 2 row Rahr Pale and some Breis Carapils to give it that little be higher SG. Usually I'm down in the 1.010 ± .002 range with beers that are lower in Carapils or don't have any at all.

I had 22 lbs of briess pale 2 row, 2 lbs caramel 60l and 1 lb carapils I took the gravity reading with a glass hydrometer and it pretty much matched the pill at 1.020... I'm concerned my final is way too high. I don't every remember getting bubbles in the airlock 14 days into fermentation.. at least not every 20-30 seconds.. I live in Aruba so I can everything I order takes weeks to get here.

 

[BigRedDog]

Oh, I missed that about your ABV. While you say your OG is 1.060. Note that your pill is going by that spike where it shows 1.062 or 1.063.

Which by the calculator on Brewer's Friend says will be 5.51%ABV using the 1.063 for the OG

https://www.brewersfriend.com/abv-calculator/

Close enough to 5.66 for my purposes. There are different ways to calculate ABV. And none guarantee that is actually your correct ABV.

Thanks.. If I take the spike out and use 1.060 with a final of 1.021 it tells me it's 5.11 ABV.. so I'm guessing my initial high mash temp created a much of unfermentables. don't understand the bubbles every 20 seconds though.. fermenting the complex sugars still.. all be it very very slowly?

 

[BongoYodeler]

Looking at your output I would say fermentation is done as SG hasn't moved in the past 5 days or so, regardless of bubble activity. I have a couple Rapt Pills and I quickly learned not to view the SG readings as absolute. (If calibrated correctly the temperature output is pretty spot-on though, at least I find mine is). But that said, I would trust the output, as seen above, to tell me three things: where in the fermentation process the beer is at, the near real-time temperature, and when active fermentation has completed. When taken together, this should tell you when the beer is ready to be packaged. At the conclusion of the beer reaching FG I typically give it a few more days to a couple weeks or more, depending on the style. Upon kegging or bottling I'll take a hydrometer reading to get my actual FG and abv. Sometimes it matches closely with my Pill and sometimes it's off a bit. That's fine, because for me the Pill's most import function is displaying temperature and fermentation progress. *Plus if you have a "fermentation chamber" and a Rapt Temperature Controller the Pill's temperature output is the temperature probe for the controller.

 

[hotbeer]

If the bubbles are a very recent thing, then perhaps the fermentation is going again. But also, that might be a indication of infection taking hold since the SG has been so stable for so long.

But if the bubbles have been going on for more than a day, I'd assume it's something else and not worry about the bubbles. If the beer is clear and clean enough for you, bottle or keg it.

Your amount of Carapils will definitely give you higher FG. And your amount of Caramel plus the Carapils puts you at 12% of the total. I don't know what ratio of fermentable to unfermentable Caramel might bring. But that along with not knowing if the pill is correct for the FG will leave me still unconcerned about anything. It'll still be beer that is close enough for home use.

Quickly putting numbers in my beer software says you should have wound up around 1.015 FG. But I used yeast with 75% attenuation.

Is this the same recipe amounts that you used prior and obtained other results?

 

[mac_1103]

Yeah, what yeast?

 

[BigRedDog]

first time with this specific recipe.. my

Yeah, what yeast?

US-05

 

[hotbeer]

first time with this specific recipe.. my

And that brings up the question what were the other yeast you used?

Comparing all the differences in the similar recipes might let you figure out what might be the reason this one seems to have stopped at a higher FG.

Though until you measure the SG with a glass bulb hydrometer, I wouldn't take the raptPill's value as the actual FG.

You did say this was your first use of it didn't you?

And again, it'll be beer.

 

[mac_1103]

US-05

It really does seem like the accidental ramp up of the mash temp was the problem, especially if that happened close to the start of the mash.

 

[BigRedDog]

And that brings up the question what were the other yeast you used?

Comparing all the differences in the similar recipes might let you figure out what might be the reason this one seems to have stopped at a higher FG.

Though until you measure the SG with a glass bulb hydrometer, I wouldn't take the raptPill's value as the actual FG.

You did say this was your first use of it didn't you?

And again, it'll be beer.

I did with a glass bulb hydrometer.. it matched the pill 1.020.. FG

 

[BigRedDog]

It really does seem like the accidental ramp up of the mash temp was the problem, especially if that happened close to the start of the mash.

yes.. very start.. I was mashing in when I noticed the temp rising..