About to try and brew my 1st batch, but need some help.

[woody189]

I think yer okay then.

Hop pellets are about the size of compressed pellet kitty litter (maybe a bit smaller), but they are far from granules. As for measuring the wort, you do want either a brewing hydrometer or a wine refractometer. They measure specifically sugar, while other hydrometers/refractometers may be measuring salt or other materials. There are lots of things to measure, but what we want to measure is sugar

The hops and detritus will eventually settle to the bottom of your fermenter. This is what we call trub. The other thing that will eventually start precipitating is yeast, which will make a tan layer at the bottom.

Most of the time you will get a foamy head on top of your beer after 72 hours. If this doesn't happen don't worry, just pull off the airlock and give it a sniff. If it smells harsh/acrid/alcoholic/slightly painful, then your fermentation is fine--even if you don't see visible signs at the time.

Yea, I'm gonna get a hydrometer. I didn't know that there were different types of hydrometers though, mine is definitely one meant to measure salt. I knew about the trub and everything, but the main thing that got me paranoid was that most of the videos I saw had ppl that had very clean wort with no hops mixed in.

Thanks for all the help.

 

[Malintent]

Good job Woody.. you sound like you are on the right track.

You are correct that a hydrometer measures the boyancy of water.. that is how it works. Salt and sugar will definitely contribute buoyancy differently. I use two different hydrometers. they have different scales. One reads .998 to 1.110 with a very tight scale (each line is like .002, and they are close). I use this to measure OG just before pitching yeast. My other is a beefy one with a scale of 1.000 to 1.020, with each line being .0005). I use this for highly accurate readings of FG.

One thing I learned about this hobby. If you get deeeeeep into it, spend a small fortune, and obsess over every little detail - you'll make the best beer you and your friends ever had. If you are sloppy and only half interested - you will make pretty good beer that is certainly better than the convenience store bought piss.

That in mind... get into it as much as you like... it's just fun.

 

[woody189]

So my beers been fermenting for 3-4 days now. I'm gonna pick up a hydrometer on Wed. Once the SG has leveled out for 3 days straight, I'm gonna rack to a 2ndary fermenter. I'm going to be using a 5 gallon bucket, I can't afford a carboy right now.

I plan on adding some fruit to the 2ndary, probably cherries. So now I need help with that. does this sound right?

take 5 lbs fresh cherries
freeze them
cook to 165 degrees F.
throw in 2ndary,
rack the beer.
let sit for 1 week
then transfer to another bucket

am I missing something?

 

[woody189]

I went to check on it today, and it appears as though it's not fermenting like it should be. There is over a minute in between bubbles in the airlock. I did remove the airlock from the grommet yesterday, IDK if that had anything to do with it.

 

[Malintent]

So my beers been fermenting for 3-4 days now. I'm gonna pick up a hydrometer on Wed. Once the SG has leveled out for 3 days straight, I'm gonna rack to a 2ndary fermenter. I'm going to be using a 5 gallon bucket, I can't afford a carboy right now.

I plan on adding some fruit to the 2ndary, probably cherries. So now I need help with that. does this sound right?

take 5 lbs fresh cherries
freeze them
cook to 165 degrees F.
throw in 2ndary,
rack the beer.
let sit for 1 week
then transfer to another bucket

am I missing something?

Don't do that. Cooking fruit denatures pectin and adds an unpleasant bitterness. Either buy (inexpensive @ $5 for an unlimited supply) cherry extract, or buy Oregon Fruit Puree (expensive @ about $18 a can - one use)

The only reason one would want to apply heat to fruit is to sanitize it (pasteurization)... Companies like Oregon Fruit use expensive techniques to flash pasteurize using steam so the flavor is not ruined.

 

[Malintent]

I went to check on it today, and it appears as though it's not fermenting like it should be. There is over a minute in between bubbles in the airlock. I did remove the airlock from the grommet yesterday, IDK if that had anything to do with it.

Primary fermentation is done or nearly done. The reason you are getting any bubbles at all is because the beer has absorbed some CO2 and is very slowly releasing it. You didn't break it It is REALLY hard to break beer.

Go ahead and taste it! Use a sanitized wine thief to pluck enough out to measure with a hydrometer and then drink it... it will be warm, it will be flat.. it will be GOOD though. Do that again the next day and then the next. If it reads the same, it's ready to bottle. If the SG keeps falling... leave it be till it is done.

Keep in mind that the more you open the container, the more CO2 you are releasing from within... the CO2 is your oxygen barrier that is protecting your beer from the air... and the positive pressure of the beer releasing CO2 is your protection from bacteria and such from the environment.

 

[woody189]

Gotcha. Thanks for the help. I'll post my hydrometer readings. And I'm gonna look up what the heck a wine thief is.

 

[woody189]

Okay, so my reading today was 1.012ish (8 days later)

Bad news is that this is my 1st reading ever (i just bought a hydrometer)

Good news is that the airlock isn't bubbling

IDK if it's good/bad news is that it stopped bubbling a few days after i brewed it, and it never really bubbled all that much

Am i ready for 2dary fermenter? or should I play it safe, wait 2 more days, and make sure the SG has stabilized?

 

[woody189]

oh, and it tasted like nasty beer. 1 because it was warm, 2 IDK why. It did taste somewhat like beer though

 

[japhroaig]

Did it taste kinda cloying and flat? If so, carbonation and temperature will take care of that. Or did it taste hot/cardboardy/cooked-vegetable/winey/butterscotchy/sour?

 

[Malintent]

One reading won't help much.. what's it reading now (2 days later, I guess)?

I agree with what japhroaig said.. and would ask the same Qs...

 

[woody189]

Did it taste kinda cloying and flat? If so, carbonation and temperature will take care of that. Or did it taste hot/cardboardy/cooked-vegetable/winey/butterscotchy/sour?

One reading won't help much.. what's it reading now (2 days later, I guess)?

I agree with what japhroaig said.. and would ask the same Qs...

Sorry, I've been busy. It's reading the same thing.

Idk how to describe the taste. It wasn't sweet (which I guess worries me). It tastes like beer, but it has an after taste.

I guess I should just move it over to 2dary, right?

 

[woody189]

Oh. after taking my 1st reading, I put the beer from the hydromter into a beer bottle and lightly covered it. I then took the my new reading from the bottle (so it's the same sample, it wasn't directly from the fermenter. Is that okay? I read somewhere that that's a good way to do it so you don't have to keep opening the fermenter

 

[japhroaig]

Okay, don't be worried. If it tastes dry and not sweet, tastes kinda like warm flat beer, and has a yeasty aftertaste, then Congratulations, you've made beer!! If it is kind of a yeasty aftertaste, that goes away. If it is sour, like unripe berries, that taste will only get worse. If it has a farmyard/horseblanket smell and taste, then you can just tell all your friends you made an 'Ale in the Ancient Tradition' (i.e. it's infected, but you'll drink it anyway )

 

[woody189]

Okay, don't be worried. If it tastes dry and not sweet, tastes kinda like warm flat beer, and has a yeasty aftertaste, then Congratulations, you've made beer!! If it is kind of a yeasty aftertaste, that goes away. If it is sour, like unripe berries, that taste will only get worse. If it has a farmyard/horseblanket smell and taste, then you can just tell all your friends you made an 'Ale in the Ancient Tradition' (i.e. it's infected, but you'll drink it anyway )

Lol. Okay, thanks. It's not sour at all, so I guess I'm good like you said.

Now, I'm going to buy
3-4 lbs of frozen cherries,
cook at 161 Degrees,
throw them in the bottom of 2dary fermenter
rack booze
let sit

Sound good? Or do you think I should absolutely use extract? I would just prefer to use real fruit (I would prefer even more to use fresh, but frozen will do)
It seems like everyone has a different opinion when it comes to how to use fresh/frozen fruit (i guess that's why i'm being recommended extract?
do they sell extract at the super market? or just at lhbs?

 

[japhroaig]

Here is what you need to know about using fruit.

1. It absolutely will not taste like you imagine it will taste
2. The better the fruit, the better the beverage
3. Pectin in fruit causes a haze, so you either need to be prepared or resigned to that
4. Sweet, fruity, alcoholic, fizzy beverages are actually really, really hard to get right. Dry, kinda herbal, alcoholic, fizzy beverages (like what you are planning on making) are a lot easier, but not always what you expect when going into them.

So, if you are absolutely gonna use fruit, then get the best you can. It's almost cherry season here in Oregon actually. However, for your own education I would bottle one or two 12 oz unfruited beers from that batch so you can compare.

 

[woody189]

Here is what you need to know about using fruit.

1. It absolutely will not taste like you imagine it will taste
2. The better the fruit, the better the beverage
3. Pectin in fruit causes a haze, so you either need to be prepared or resigned to that
4. Sweet, fruity, alcoholic, fizzy beverages are actually really, really hard to get right. Dry, kinda herbal, alcoholic, fizzy beverages (like what you are planning on making) are a lot easier, but not always what you expect when going into them.

So, if you are absolutely gonna use fruit, then get the best you can. It's almost cherry season here in Oregon actually. However, for your own education I would bottle one or two 12 oz unfruited beers from that batch so you can compare.

That's a good idea, but how would I ferment that? Separately that is? I'm going to have a 2dary fermenter (unfortunately a bucket, can't afford a carboy), so how would I ferment the 24 oz separately?

And how would YOU recommend using fresh fruit?

 

[japhroaig]

What an excellent set of questions

simply transfer half a liter or so to one of those small pepsi/coke plastic bottles. Not glass, since it would have a very large chance of exploding--I had a fridge that was utterly destroyed by a 'bottle bomb'. Age it in plastic right next to you secondary.

As for how I personally use fruit? Either as an accent such as the Gooseberry wheat I'm brewing at the moment, as a dry wine or mead, or a sweet drink that is campden'ed before it is finished fermenting the force carbonated.

So I guess personally I either use it as accents, or usually just make wine if I have enough excellent fruit. Luckily I have my own orchard . Bwahahaha!

 

[japhroaig]

Okay, what I'm really trying to say is this--in the cacophony of flavors in beer, the subtleties of fruit and adjuncts are easily lost. So, when designing a beer, you really have to ask yourself "what is the most defining characteristic of this addition that I want to get across to the person enjoying it".

Now, with a lot of fruit that usually IMHO is one of three things: the specific kind of acidity it has, the specific sweetness profile, and the nose. Most of the time sweetness gets almost completely erased since the yeasties love fruit juice. It takes effort and equipment to prevent that from happening, so keeping that dimension for you is likely not possible.

Acidity is something you can control though, you just need to be mindful of the variety of fruit you are using. Bing and black table cherries? Very low acid, high sugar. They will net you color and alcohol, but not a heck of a lot else. Montgomery or pie cherries? Those have some acid, you just need to balance that with your malt and hop profile--which usually takes plain ol trial and error. The aroma? Go purchase a couple of varieties at the store and start training your nose. Get a blindfold and assistant and have some fun (no, not that kind).

That's all I'm trying to say. Fruit has a wonderful palate, you just need to know what 'flavor levers' you are working with.

 

[woody189]

Okay, what I'm really trying to say is this--in the cacophony of flavors in beer, the sublties of fruit and adjuncts are easily lost. So, when designing a beer, you really have to ask yourself "what is the most defining characteristic of this addition that I want to get across to the person enjoying it".

Now, with a lot of fruit that usually IMHO is one of three things: the specific kind of acidity it gas, the specific sweetness profile, and the nose. Most of the time sweetness gets almost completely erased since the yeasties love fruit juice. It takes effort and equipment to prevent that from happening, so keeping that dimension for you is likely out.

Acidity is something you can control though, you just need to be mindful of the variety of fruit you are using. Bong and black table cheries? Very low acid, high sugar. They will net you color and alcohol, but not a heck of a lot else. Montgomery or pie cherries? Those have some acid, you just need to balance that with your malt and hop profile--which usually takes plain ol trial and error. The aroma? Go purchase a couple of varieties at the store and start training your nose. Get a blindfold and assistant and have some fun (no, not that kind).

That's all I'm trying to say. Fruit has a wonderful palate, you just need to know what 'flavor levers' you are working with.

Wow. Thanks for taking the time to write up all that info. It was very helpful, and I guess I'm just going to need to see what I like through trial and error.

But how would you add the fruit to the beer? In terms of pasteurization and stuff?

Thanks again.. you (and everyone else) have helped a lot

 

[japhroaig]

The safe way is to sterilize via heat or campden tablets, but I usually just make sure everything is clean and just add it This last time I even added some young gooseberries to my mash tun, but sometimes I like to live on the edge. I might even open-ferment while I'm doing it

 

[woody189]

So when you sterilize using heat, you just heat it up to 160 degress like they all say?

 

[woody189]

Okay. So I racked today. I racked it on top of 4 lbs of cherries.

I screwed up a little and let some yeast through the siphon and also some air a few times.

THere is about 1-2 inches of headspace in the bucket. I hope it's alright.
I'll let you know how it goes.

So how many weeks would you say I should leave it till bottling? about 2?

 

[japhroaig]

Yeah, the positive air pressure from the yeast fermenting the cherries should keep ya mostly safe.

Bottling will take a bit of finesse. 4 lbs may take more than two weeks, but basically when the SG has stabilized over the course of a week, and you like it's color and clarity, then bottle. Don't forget to prime (FSM, that was once a disaster )

Yer doing fine. Just remember you could bottle next week and it would be interesting, you could bottle in two weeks and it would be interesting, so on and so forth. Just don't make bottle bombs

 

[woody189]

Yeah, the positive air pressure from the yeast fermenting the cherries should keep ya mostly safe.

Bottling will take a bit of finesse. 4 lbs may take more than two weeks, but basically when the SG has stabilized over the course of a week, and you like it's color and clarity, then bottle. Don't forget to prime (FSM, that was once a disaster )

Yer doing fine. Just remember you could bottle next week and it would be interesting, you could bottle in two weeks and it would be interesting, so on and so forth. Just don't make bottle bombs

Cool. Thanks again.

 

[woody189]

Okay. I'm not quite yet ready to bottle, but tomorrow will be 2 weeks in 2dary. I want to make sure the SG stabilized, like you said, but I don't want to keep opening it.

Should I just take a sample, take a reading, and put it in a separate beer bottle. Then when i take my next reading, just take the same sample out of the beer bottle, then put it back in. Is that right? And then when it's stabilized, throw them in the bottles?

I just want to avoid opening my 2dary fermenter more than necessary.

Oh, and what's FSM?

Don't forget to prime (FSM, that was once a disaster )

 

[woody189]

okay. I took a reading right now, and I'm getting basically the same thing. 1.01. I'm not sure what that means, but I was under the impression the SG should have changed at least a little bit. It tasted better now though. Better, not good. It didn't have enough cherry flavor so I'm gonna leave it for another week at least.

Any pointers?

I am feeling more confident now because even though it's not ready, I think I would drink it as it is if it were chilled and carbonated.

 

[Tallmanbrewer]

So, how was it Woody? Inquiring minds want to know!!!

 

[woody189]

So, how was it Woody? Inquiring minds want to know!!!

IDK yet. Still trying to figure out what to do. Here's my dilemma...

It's been in 2dary for 16 days now. I want to give a nice cherry flavor, and also want it to be completely fermented.

I'm going on vacation for 1 week on sunday, so I have to decide whether I want to bottle before the vacation or after.

I would like to bottle now so while i'm away it could start doin it's thing in the bottle, but I don't want to rush it either. What do you think?

Basically, my options are 19 days in 2dary , or 27ish. THen bottling

 

[jonbomb]

I read through and its nice that you got through the process. I would have brought back the ingredients and bought an extract kit. My first batch I didnt even know they site existed. Good job you are in secondary!

BTW I would just let it sit for a week and bottle when you come back.