9-9-9

[Yuri_Rage]

I vote we brew on or about 8/8/8, while we're enjoying the previous year's batch.

 

[Kaiser]

i
i'm kinda thinking i'd just drop the melanoid and aromatic malts, up the munich a bit and go for a true triple-decoction mash...make a day of it. hopefully i'll have my process down by then. looks like it's time to do another hefeweizen and get some practice in!

Depending on what kind of Munich you are using (light or dark), if you go over 15 % for this beer I would start getting worried about it still being a blonde. I'd cap it at 15% dark munich. Keeping the Aromatic and Melanodin out is fine. Aromatic is supposed to be a stronger munich anyway.

I brew an Oktoberfest with 80% Pilsner and 20% dark Munich and the beer would basically a stonger version of that. The amount of Munich would stay the same and the pilsner is increased to up the OG.

Kai

 

[Jamo99]

No lagering capabilities here

 

[Soulive]

No lagering capabilities here

Me neither but I'll make it work if its within club rules...

 

[Jamo99]

So what's the plan for us without lagering equipment? A Kolsch yeast around 68F-70F?

 

[Madtown Brew]

i'm kinda thinking i'd just drop the melanoid and aromatic malts, up the munich a bit and go for a true triple-decoction mash...make a day of it. hopefully i'll have my process down by then. looks like it's time to do another hefeweizen and get some practice in!

Depending on what kind of Munich you are using (light or dark), if you go over 15 % for this beer I would start getting worried about it still being a blonde. I'd cap it at 15% dark munich. Keeping the Aromatic and Melanodin out is fine. Aromatic is supposed to be a stronger munich anyway.

I brew an Oktoberfest with 80% Pilsner and 20% dark Munich and the beer would basically a stonger version of that. The amount of Munich would stay the same and the pilsner is increased to up the OG.

Kai

Agreed. I think that the darkening effect of decoction will cause it to be not-so-blonde. I even think that dark Munich would be too much, unless you cut the amount some. Northern Brewer lists Durst Dark Munich @ 15.5 L, which (at 20%)puts the beer in the ~9 SRM range, by my figurin'.

 

[Kaiser]

This is what 20% dark Munich and 5 min mash-out decoction boil look like in a 13 *P (1.052) beer:

I wouldn't mind that color for the DoppelBondeBock.

Kai

 

[Madtown Brew]

This is what 20% dark Munich and 5 min mash-out decoction boil look like in a 13 *P (1.052) beer:

I wouldn't mind that color for the DoppelBondeBock.

Kai

No doubt it looks good....

<runs to pour a beer to quench the salivating thirst>

not sure I'd call it a "blonde" though.

 

[Soulive]

I wouldn't mind that color for the DoppelBondeBock.

Kai

A-friggen-men, assuming we decide to go with doppleblondebock...

 

[Kaiser]

not sure I'd call it a "blonde" though.

I hear you. Let's settle on 10% dark munich or 20% light munich. Or we go all blone by only using Pils. But I'm afraid that this may not result in an interestig enoug beer.

Kai

 

[Yooper]

I think we need some munich. All pils malt wouldn't be complex enough to qualify for the dopplebock.

 

[Soulive]

Can we set the ruling on yeast? Obviously the doppelbock is favored, but what about the Kolsch yeast?

 

[Kaiser]

If we go by the German definition of Bock and Doppelbock, as stated by the tax law, the yeast doesn't matter the only thing that matters is the starting gravity. For a Bock it needs to be >= 16*P (1.064 SG) and for a Doppelbock it needs to be >=18*P (1.072 SG). Though you may get a different charcter, you can also use ale yeast for a Bockbier, though I have not seen a Koelsch at bock strength. The Sticke Alt should qualify as a bock, though It's not called that. Bocks are southern German beer styles and the only top fermenting southern beers are wheats. This might explain why there aren't any Koelsh or Alt bocks.

Kai

 

[Soulive]

If we go by the German definition of Bock and Doppelbock, as stated by the tax law, the yeast doesn't matter the only thing that matters is the starting gravity. For a Bock it needs to be >= 16*P (1.064 SG) and for a Doppelbock it needs to be >=18*P (1.072 SG). Though you may get a different charcter, you can also use ale yeast for a Bockbier, though I have not seen a Koelsch at bock strength. The Sticke Alt should qualify as a bock, though It's not called that. Bocks are southern German beer styles and the only top fermenting southern beers are wheats. This might explain why there aren't any Koelsh or Alt bocks.

Kai

I agree with the wheat aspect. I would go the weizenbock route but I don't think it'll work. Perhaps just an appropriate yeast, ramped up via starter after starter...

 

[Madtown Brew]

I hear you. Let's settle on 10% dark munich or 20% light munich. Or we go all blone by only using Pils. But I'm afraid that this may not result in an interestig enoug beer.

Kai

I think we need some munich. All pils malt wouldn't be complex enough to qualify for the dopplebock.

Definitely agree. Heck, I used close to 40% vienna and 10% munich in my version and I still don't think it was "complex" enough.

 

[Rhoobarb]

I'd drop the Melanoidin malt and go with Munich over Vienna. Of the two, Munich malt has more melanoidins. The darker the grade of Munich, the stronger the melanoidin content. Using Melanoidin malt will put it too over the top, IMHO.

 

[z987k]

yeah for us without lagering capabilities, would wlp029 work out ok, or should we go with a nottingham/us-05 for a clean neutral ferment?

 

[Brewpastor]

I say that we let the yeast be determined by the brewer and go with two options. I don't want to not lager when I have the ability, but don't want others left out who can't lager. I suggest the 833 and whatever kolsch people prefer.

As for the malt discussion, I agree with dropping the Aromatic and the Melanoidin and share the concern over keeping some complexity in the beer, particularly if people are not decocting. I like the 10% dark Munich or 20% light munich suggestion and would lean more towards the 20% light. I would also consider a blend of the 2, maybe 15% light and 5% dark. This would both boost the color and add complexity.

 

[shunoshi]

I'm hoping to have lager capabilities by this fall, so I'll probably be in for this one. I need to make myself one of those Igloo cooler mods Yooper has since I don't see a fridge/freezer in my near future.

As for recipe, I'll leave it in the hands of BP. The 8-8-8 seems to be turning out just fine.

 

[jacobyhale]

Yeah, I'm definitely in as well. Guess I have 8 months to get my lagering equipment.....as if I actually needed another excuse.

 

[korndog]

yeah, I guess it's time to get a lagering chest. I like the Doppelbock idea; drink Paulaner Salvator regularly. Count me in too.

 

[DeathBrewer]

"Paulaner Salvator"

supposedly, they make it so dark by boiling it for a day...no dark malts involved. interesting idea!

 

[korndog]

"Paulaner Salvator"

supposedly, they make it so dark by boiling it for a day...no dark malts involved. interesting idea!

interesting. I hadn't heard that. I prefer it over Celebrator, but they are pretty interchangeable.

 

[Kaiser]

supposedly, they make it so dark by boiling it for a day...no dark malts involved. interesting idea!

This is interesting b/c it tastes to me as if they use all dark Munich for that beer. Boiling for a day would ruin the head retention of the beer by coagulating to many of the proteins. But I could be wong on this.

Kai

 

[korndog]

This is interesting b/c it tastes to me as if they use all dark Munich for that beer. Boiling for a day would ruin the head retention of the beer by coagulating to many of the proteins. But I could be wong on this.

Kai

Well, I can tell you that there is not much of a head on this beer. An aggressive pour gets you about a finger, and it's gone in seconds.

 

[DeathBrewer]

This is interesting b/c it tastes to me as if they use all dark Munich for that beer. Boiling for a day would ruin the head retention of the beer by coagulating to many of the proteins. But I could be wong on this.

Kai

i read it somewhere, i think in one of my brewing books...i'll let you know if and when i find the source...

 

[mrfocus]

Well, I can tell you that there is not much of a head on this beer. An aggressive pour gets you about a finger, and it's gone in seconds.

I concur. 1 1/2 at the most.

 

[sirsloop]

Belgian Trippel!

9% ABV, 9 SRM, 27 IBU

 

[Kaiser]

i read it somewhere, i think in one of my brewing books...i'll let you know if and when i find the source...

I'll really have to taste this beer again and see what the head retention is like. But yes, it has a very strong and distinct aroma that may more be the result of long boiling than dark base malts.

Kai