3 Kettle, 3 Pump Automated-Capable E-HERMS Build

[mliptack]

I would just wire the N/O float switch in series between BCS output and SSR input. Prevents a dry-fire regardless of how/who tries to send power to it.

That was my initial thought, but I would only be able to use the float for one device, in which case I would need to put 2 floats in each kettle. My thinking is, I would like the same float to kill power to the heating element and the pump. At this point it would require human intervention to run the pump until completion (I am thinking about adding a momentary push button along with the 3-way selector for this).

With the ladder logic, I figured out a way to do it, but it probably is over complicated (and it wastes an output per device I want to have protected)

Example: HLT Heating Element Protect
Rung0 - Out0 (Wasted out) - Float DIN0 - - - - - OUT15 (SSR for Heat Element)

I would trigger Out0 in all my programs etc. and only if DIN0 is closed will it trigger power to the Heating Element. Of course the risk is accidentally triggering Out17 from the Main Control.

I just looked over your schematic and wondered the reasoning behind wiring the SSRs on same output in series?

MrNatural - You are very observant, thank you for taking the time to review the schematic and giving me feedback!

That is more of a remnant from an original design that didn't use a contactor for each element, instead, I would rely solely on the SSRs or the main contactor to kill power to the elements. For safety I decided to add the contactors, but never removed the SSRs from the design, because I already have them mounted to a heatsink in my panel.

Really there's no point in adding the additional heat of the 2 extra SSRs that serve no purpose (other than greater complexity). I think I will leave the 2 extra in place as spares, or for any other purpose that may arise.

Thanks for the questions! Cheers!
Max

 

[jowag618]

Are you in Milwaukee too?

Max

Yessir - right near whitefish bay

 

[mliptack]

Yessir - right near whitefish bay

Very cool - I grew up near UWM, but bought a house about 3yrs ago near Bay View.

 

[Mdsutton]

Joined in on a group buy for 1/2" 2-way SS Motorized ball valves today @ $25/each+s&h. Safe up to 100deg C.

Now I SHOULD have about 95% of the components needed/ordered:
Still Need 3 Pumps (probably some SS 1/2" nipples and some more SS Compression fittings to connect it all together)
Probably need a new 16ch relay board. The one I had leftover from the brew troller currently is not working with the BCS.

The end of 3 years of planning is in sight... and my tiny home office is a mess!

Where did you get the valves?
Thanks!

 

[mliptack]

The new brewtroller.com community started a group buy. Not sure what the timeline for ordering will be... but $25 each for a 2way valve is hard to pass up.

 

[mliptack]

Quick Update: Got a shipment in from bargain fittings and ebrewsupply today.

Trying to organize my panel in all different configurations to find the best layout. I think I am going to use Cat5 as signal wire to a breakout panel that would have connections for all temp probes, valves and float switches otherwise I foresee too many XLR or similar connections coming from the main panel. Plus its much cheaper to extend a few Cat5 lines than it would be for 20+ XLR/mic cables. This breakout box would be located on my brew stand, while my panel will likely be mounted on the wall of my garage near the breaker box.

Don't have any pictures of my panel layout to share, but I do have a few of the Kettles.

I have all the holes punched (excluding float valves). Just need to add a bit more plumbers tape to the threads and start to tighten them down. I still need to have some stainless tubing bent for the MLT dip tube, HLT Heat exchanger and for the BK whirlpool arm. I have a 100' spool of it in my basement, waiting.

The dining room table becomes a great place for a mock layout - My wife loves this

Cheers,
Max

 

[mliptack]

Today's Update:

I went out and bought a water heater wrench and tightened down the heating elements in the HLT and Boil kettles. I have about 25lbs of crushed grain that cannot be brewed unless I am able to piece something together (because I don't think I will have the panel done and all three kettles ready to brew with, before the grain starts to get stale).

I also added the pipe thread tape and put a wrench to most of the fittings and started a hydro test on the HLT. About 30min in I have 1 leak at the uppermost fitting.

This is the one fitting that the compression adaptor's threads were a little bit smaller, so I opted to use a washer instead of a locknut. This gave me enough length to tighten on the cam lock adaptor. However, I will have to revisit this as it clearly didn't work. I drained some water. The hydro-test continues on the remaining fittings. I'm mostly interested in the heating element.


In the first couple of pictures you will see the kettle filling.

The next couple you will see it leaking from the top weldless fitting.

The final picture you might notice in the background that I have a yeast starter on my stir plate ready for my next brew - One of my favorite yeasts - WLP002

Cheers!
Max

 

[mliptack]

12hours later (simulating a bad brew day) and the HLT is holding up. So much in fact, that just to satisfy my itch, I may take it for a spin and try to get a batch out today.

I did pull the cam-lock and washer off that top inlet, and replaced the washer with a locknut, as originally planned. Then I added a few more wraps of plumbers tape and tightened down the lock-nut a little further than I usually would, and then added the cam-lock back on. Its holding water now Because this spot won't be submerged for very long during the brew day, I won't be testing it for another 12+ hours.

I am going to do the same to my MLT kettle this morning, just because this is the kettle I will use to brew today if I choose to do so. Since it has no heating element and junction box on the outside, I feel more comfortable tossing it on top of a propane burner and cranking it up to 11, without fear of burning the paint off the box.

Since we got a few inches of snow I figure there is nothing better than brewing while shoveling a few inches of snow. My next house I am going to need water/sink and of course heat, in my garage.

Cheers!
Max

 

[mliptack]

I posted this in a separate thread, but figured I would bring the images here to keep the majority of the information in one place.

I designed my HERMS coil to be 12.75" OD and 5" tall on center. It ends up being about 30' of SS Tube.

This took me a while to draw up, the hardest part was making the in and out posts to match at the right angle to the tangent (if that makes sense).

I cheated a little bit, and a keen observer may be able to see where both in the renderings and the drawings.

Here's the other thread:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/he...us-1-2-stainless-0-020-wall-thickness-512425/

View attachment Herms Coil Final - Sheet1.pdf

 

[jcc4507fly]

Nice work!

 

[mliptack]

Nice work!

Thanks! I sent it out to a couple of places for quotes - I am interested to find out how much they will want for this...

Cheers!
Max

 

[ryane]

The new brewtroller.com community started a group buy. Not sure what the timeline for ordering will be... but $25 each for a 2way valve is hard to pass up.

......Or, you could just pick them up for 26$ shipped from this link

 

[mliptack]

......Or, you could just pick them up for 26$ shipped from this link

I will probably end up paying more and waiting longer, which in my opinion is far better than supporting eBay / PayPal.

I used eBay & PayPal extensively up until about a year ago. Needless to say, I had a bad experience as a seller. I will never sell using eBay again, I refuse to purchase from eBay and will not use PP unless there is no other option. Details are beyond the scope of this thread /rant

 

[mliptack]

Image 1: Mash Tun Dip Tube (to go into a Jaybird FB)

Image 2: BK Side Pickup Tube

 

[mliptack]

A short update:

Saturday I built my brew stand. Went with wood out of simplicity. Long term goal is to weld something up, just need to buy a welder first.

My wife and I put the temp probes together, color coded to keep everything visual.

I also got in my power-in connector. This thing is a breeze to use, easy to install and is NEMA 4 when connected. It is pretty large, the connector is rated for 80amps, at most I should be pulling a little over half of that. The connector is from LAPP USA, it's their EPIC line of connectors. The size I used was their HB16 housing. This set up can get pricey, but IMO, worth every penny.



I decided I was going to make a sub-panel to reduce the amount of ins/outs on the control panel itself. For this I debated using the same EPIC connector with a 64 pin insert in it. But for the sake of simplicity I have decided against that and instead are going to be using a 50pin D-Sub connector. For the sub panel, I looked into other NEMA rated panels, but it was difficult to find one in the size I needed. Instead I purchased a $30 Key Box - I will just grind out the few spot welds on the inside that hold the key hanger and use this for all my low voltage connections (temp, valve, float, misc DIN)

I am in a bit of a holding pattern until I get my 24 & 30mm hole punches that currently have an estimated delivery of mid-march

Until next time.

Cheers!
Max

 

[jcc4507fly]

Very nice! Can't wait until I have my panel in my hands! Hopefully next week! 🙏

Kettles in my welders hands as we speak. It's been a long time waiting. Ready to brew!!!

 

[mliptack]

I know the feeling. I bought these kettles/panel in early 2012. I brewed using one of them for the first time last summer - it will be nice to put that false bottom to use. And actually ditch the propane!

 

[mliptack]

Small update -

Since the last update I got the following items in:
Chugger center inlet pump
HERMS Coil
Mash Tun Dip Tube
Misc Stainless Hardware
Motorized Ball Valves
30 Plate Duda Chiller

Yesterday I mocked up my valve manifold, trying out a few different ways to put it all together, and make it easy to take apart.

I installed XLR connectors on each of the valves.

I pulled out the key tag holders from the key box. There were 3 spot welds that I had to grind out to remove the chunks of metal. I used JB weld to clean up rough areas and to fill in the mounting holes on the panel (not shown).

I installed the DB50 connectors on my panel and sub panel (had to get creative to mount the female to female gender changers without buying additional hardware). I was worried about using the small gauge wire with the valves (its 28 gauge wire in the DB cable I bought from Amazon which is enough for 0.2amp of power transmission, the ball valves are 80ma at 12v), but I was able to test the ball valves with the cable assembly and my worries were relieved.

I am planning on using 4ch audio snakes to help clean up all of the wiring, and its cheaper than doing individual small length cables - I picked up a few of these 4 Channel 3' XLR Snakes

Thats all I got for now. I brewed a RyePA yesterday. Put the plate chiller to use. I was able to chill 6.5-7 gallons of wort down to 52 (oops) in out ~6 minutes, this was gravity fed, I will put the pump to use next time...

 

[mliptack]

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1430535154.096710.jpg
Although it's a bit messy. I made a ton of progress.

Panel is fired up and working.
Valve manifold is assembled.
Dry tests are complete.
Adding H2O tomorrow running a few tests and if all goes well hopefully getting ~22lbs of grain wet to get some preliminary efficiency numbers.

 

[mliptack]

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1430632373.895769.jpg
Maiden brew day.
Ran a test batch to dial in the system & its efficiency.

 

[augiedoggy]

So how did it do? Run into any snags?

 

[mliptack]

Overall - I would call it a success

I don't have the BCS fully programmed yet so I made a bunch of notes and now have a good idea of all the parameters and exit conditions I would be looking for.

The way I have this designed the pumps need to be on to measure the temp. Because of this my mash temp dropped about 5 degrees before it started to correct it. (After mashing in there was an abundance of hot water under the false bottom so it would recognize a drop in temp, and turn on the pump long enough to pull a small amount of that hot water). I didn't want the mash to recirculate because it would have been heating up to my strike water temp from my HLT. Going forward I will program fresh water to go into the HLT to bring the temp down, while the MLT will recirc for at least 5 minutes until the mash temp stabilizes.

It was a long day. I started at 8am and pitched at 11:59pm. I was running tests all morning. It was actually the first day I turned on the pumps and heating elements. Since I hadn't brewed since early February I had the itch and needed to brew