1st Boil Complete - Cincinnati Pale Ale

[Groo]

Yesterday I completed my first boil following the instructions for J. Palmer's Cincinnati Pale Ale.

It seemed to go smoothly but took a bit longer than I expected.

I started around 8:30 with the DME mixed into the water and didn't really get a boil until about an hour later. After that I waited for a hot break that didn't occur or looked differently than expected. I waited for awhile and there was never really any foam that made the egg drop soup thing that Palmer described. I did see changes in the foam type so maybe this was good enough.

After about 30-40 minutes of waiting for the hot break I said screw it and threw in my bittering hops. I didn't expect the pellets to dissolve like that but it was pretty cool. I also tasted the hops before putting them in and realized they taste sort of how they smell, the NB was a little peppery to the tongue.

I added the rest of the hops at 30 and 15, the LME at 5 minutes then I cooled in an ice bath. I had a coleman cooler full of ice and water from a party the day before so I stuck my kettle in there. It went from 160 to 70 in about 20 minutes.

I transferred the partial boil to my fermenter and added water to make 5 gallons. My partial boil was a little less than 2.5 gallons (I started with 3). I tried to mix it up well before I took my hydrometer reading and I got a 1.048 which is 3 points higher than whats listed in the recipe. I forgot to take the temp of the sample.

After that my yeast slurry was pitched, I shook it up and now I'm seeing massive bubbling 12 hours later.

Overall it seemed to go well. I didn't think my stove would take that long to boil 3 gallons. I have a couple questions though:

- Is it ok if there is a little bit of foam that is on top of the airlock lid? Also what do I do if the liquid level is below the fill line now (in the airlock)?

- It looks like there's about 4-5 inches of foam in my fermentation bucket plus there is some yeasty looking stuff pressed against the lid. Is this the Krausen?

- Any advice on my hot break? Can I just start my boil when it's boiling next time instead of waiting for a never occurring hot break?

Thanks.

It was a good time and I can't believe that beer is near.

 

[GroosBrewz]

Yesterday I completed my first boil following the instructions for J. Palmer's Cincinnati Pale Ale.

It seemed to go smoothly but took a bit longer than I expected.

I started around 8:30 with the DME mixed into the water and didn't really get a boil until about an hour later. After that I waited for a hot break that didn't occur or looked differently than expected. I waited for awhile and there was never really any foam that made the egg drop soup thing that Palmer described. I did see changes in the foam type so maybe this was good enough.

After about 30-40 minutes of waiting for the hot break I said screw it and threw in my bittering hops. I didn't expect the pellets to dissolve like that but it was pretty cool. I also tasted the hops before putting them in and realized they taste sort of how they smell, the NB was a little peppery to the tongue.

I added the rest of the hops at 30 and 15, the LME at 5 minutes then I cooled in an ice bath. I had a coleman cooler full of ice and water from a party the day before so I stuck my kettle in there. It went from 160 to 70 in about 20 minutes.

I transferred the partial boil to my fermenter and added water to make 5 gallons. My partial boil was a little less than 2.5 gallons (I started with 3). I tried to mix it up well before I took my hydrometer reading and I got a 1.048 which is 3 points higher than whats listed in the recipe. I forgot to take the temp of the sample.

After that my yeast slurry was pitched, I shook it up and now I'm seeing massive bubbling 12 hours later.

Overall it seemed to go well. I didn't think my stove would take that long to boil 3 gallons. I have a couple questions though:

- Is it ok if there is a little bit of foam that is on top of the airlock lid? Also what do I do if the liquid level is below the fill line now (in the airlock)?

- It looks like there's about 4-5 inches of foam in my fermentation bucket plus there is some yeasty looking stuff pressed against the lid. Is this the Krausen?

- Any advice on my hot break? Can I just start my boil when it's boiling next time instead of waiting for a never occurring hot break?

Thanks.

It was a good time and I can't believe that beer is near.

By the way, very, VERY cool screen name.. Are you a fan of the great Groo as well?

Now on to your questions: Although it's probably fine for a little foam to be in your airlock, if you use a blowoff assembly, you will never have to worry about it. IF the liquid in the airlock is below the fill line, wait for high krausen to be over and then top it back up. It's fine if it's a little below, but it doesn't hurt to top it back up (you are using some sort of sanitized liquid in the airlock right? Vodka or bleach, something like that?)

And yes, that sounds like yeast foam from high krausen stuck to your lid. Perfectly normal and a good sign. As for hot break, when I used to extract brew (for about 10 years) I never once worried about the hot break. I just boiled and when it got to a good rolling boil, I added the hops.

Sounds like your first brew went well! Keep it up!

 

[Yooper]

It sounds like a good brewday!

With extract, sometimes you never get a hot break. I guess it's because the extract is already processed, and it must have formed a hot break at the manufacturer. Don't worry about it- it's not important and it doesn't matter whether you have one or not. The only advantage of seeing it before you add the hops is just in case the hops cause some "nucleation points" and cause a boil over. (Ask me how I know this......) If there is a hot break before you add the hops (if one is going to happen), it's less likely to boil over later. You definitely don't have to wait for one- you can start your timer and hops addition as soon as you have a boil.

Sounds like you've got krausen all right! Try to keep the fermenter temperature at 70 degrees or a bit lower if you can. Some people use spare bathroom or bedrooms, or put the fermenter in a bin just in case some krausen sneaks out the top. If it comes out the top quite a bit, let us know and we'll tell you how to rig up a blow-off tube.

 

[Groo]

Thanks for the help.

My name is inspired by the Great Groo the Wanderer. My 2 year old just became addicted to a graphic novel that was around so it was stuck in my head. She loves the hundreds of characters Aragones draws in each cell.

Right now there is about a 1/4" to 1/2" foam bubble on the top of the airlock. It's been like that since about 10 am. Can I wipe that off with something? I filled my airlock with a starsan solution.

I found a cool spot in my home for the fermentation, I definitely use a bin next time or this time if I can find one.

 

[Yooper]

Thanks for the help.

My name is inspired by the Great Groo the Wanderer. My 2 year old just became addicted to a graphic novel that was around so it was stuck in my head. She loves the hundreds of characters Aragones draws in each cell.

Right now there is about a 1/4" to 1/2" foam bubble on the top of the airlock. It's been like that since about 10 am. Can I wipe that off with something? I filled my airlock with a starsan solution.

I found a cool spot in my home for the fermentation, I definitely use a bin next time or this time if I can find one.

Oh, star-san will bubble like that! You can leave it, or wipe it off. Next time, try using vodka in the airlock. I still use star-san most of the time, and just live with the foamy bubbles.

 

[Surly]

Nice job, wait til you taste your OWN beer. good luck

 

[Christman]

I'm glad you posted your boil results from following the instructions on the Cincinnati Pale Ale. I have everything gathered to brew my first batch ever this weekend and I plan on following the same instructions. I will let you know how my boil goes.

I was considering doing my boil with the full five gallons instead of breaking it up into the two boils per the instructions. Were you happy that you did the two boil method? Perhaps it may take an extremely long time to boil the full five gallons, so I may still do the two separate boils.

Also, I am under the impression from the instructions that the DME and the LME would be added at the same time prior to adding the bittering hops. It might be possible that there was not enough extract in the boil for there to be a noticeable hot break.

 

[Groo]

As of today the vigorous bubbling has stopped and now I'm getting some slow bubbles. The foam inside the bucket (I'm looking from the outside) has shrunk to about 1.5".

Luckily I'm out of town next week so I was planning on leaving it in Primary until I'm back. No temptation to bottle early if I'm not around. That would make it about two weeks in primary.

I'm suprised at how intense the early bubbling was and at how it changed so quickly to a mellow bubble over night. This is a very intersting process to watch.

I think a glass carboy is needed for the next batch so that a better view of the process can be had.

 

[Groo]

Christman,

In my book it says to add the DME into the cold water before the boil because it will dissolve better. Then it says to add the LME with 5 minutes left in the boil. This was taken from the chapter with the longer explanation, it may be different in the firstchapter.

In regards to doing a full boil with all 5 gallons, I'm glad I chose not to. Honestly my stove was having a hard time getting 3 gallons to boil and I'm not sure if it would have been capable of getting all 5 to that point. I would like to do a full boil but I'd have to get a new heating product in the future.

I also need a better scale to weigh out my extract and hops. Does anyone know of a good way to weigh LME without making a mess?

 

[Indyking]

Groo, I brewed the Cinccinattii PA following Palmer's instructions a week ago and my experience was very similar to yours, except the first thing I did was putting to water to boil because I knew it would take a while. After I finish preparing the materials and ingredients, the water was boiling, and then I added the DME. From there it went like you described, that is, no hot break, and no real threaten of boiling over. Palmer does make a comment in his book about extracts not causing hot break, which is not uncommon. You did a better job cooling the wort down. It took me 30+ minutes to cool my wort down to 80F, then I decided to finish cooling it to 70F by transferring it to the fermenter and adding cool water (which you have to do anyway). I was told it is OK to do that when your wort is cooler than 90-100F, hope it is really.

My fermentation started about 5 hours later and went very vigorous with lots of bubbling, but no foam in the airlock since I used water with bleach instead of star-san. I was out for 4 days after that and when I returned, bubbling activity had ceased. So, now I’m waiting for the conditioning period, at least 2 weeks.

Few differences I want to pinpoint: My OG was exactly 1.045 but I did use the temperature conversion chart that came with my thermometer. The krausen in my wort was less than you described from yours. I think that may be due to differences in the yeast. I used 1 packet of rehydrated safale S-04, which is known to ferment very quickly and clean up (conditioning) the wort well, but has the disadvantage of sometimes producing a very mild bubble gum taste, but not everybody experience that. I think that taste is caused by fermenting in higher temps. Mine is at stable 70F.

I'll let you know how it tastes in about 3 weeks!

 

[Indyking]

I'm glad you posted your boil results from following the instructions on the Cincinnati Pale Ale. I have everything gathered to brew my first batch ever this weekend and I plan on following the same instructions. I will let you know how my boil goes.

I was considering doing my boil with the full five gallons instead of breaking it up into the two boils per the instructions. Were you happy that you did the two boil method? Perhaps it may take an extremely long time to boil the full five gallons, so I may still do the two separate boils.

Also, I am under the impression from the instructions that the DME and the LME would be added at the same time prior to adding the bittering hops. It might be possible that there was not enough extract in the boil for there to be a noticeable hot break.

I think that may be a very bad idea for 2 reasons: 1- It would take it forever to bring it to boil and 2-it would take it forever to cool it down. Quick cooling down is important. Also, not sure how big your pot is, but chances of boiling over would be higher too with that much water at boil!

 

[Christman]

Thannks Groo and Indyking! I'll have to make sure I read the later chapters throughly. I think I'll go with the multiple boils for my first batch as well, I'd hate to try it all in one large boil and find out that I don't have a beefy enough burner to get the job done or that I cannot get it cooled quickly.

As for weighing the DME, I'm fortunate enough to already have a digital scale that measures to 1/10 of an ounce and is able to be zeroed out with any container on it. It was one my wife picked up a few years ago from her Weight Watchers program and we have been using it for just about every in the kitchen ever since. I would think that using some sort of deep bowl on top of a scale like that would help cut down on the mess while measuring it out.

 

[Christman]

Well... I did my brew over the weekend and everything went well up to the point where I was taking the full carboy to the basement to put it in my fermentation chamber.

I did the batch in two boils of three gallons each, which I am glad that I did because I don't think I would have been able to get five gallons cooled as quickly as I did. I was about to get the wort down to below 80°F within 20 minutes. I added the room temperature pre-boiled water the wort and pitched the yeast and I was good to go down to the basement. Unfortunately the brew did not make it that far, while in the kitchen the carboy broke and the brew flooded my kitchen. Had I not been in such a hurry to get it all cleaned up, I would have taken pics of what happened. I did get some pics of whats left of the carboy.

Needless to say, from now on I will be using buckets to ferment. I have a new one on the way as well as everything I need to try this brew again.

I did a full write up of my brew and why I think the carboy broke on me here: http://christmanzone.net/2010/09/five-gallon-party-foul-pale-ale/

 

[Groo]

Wow Christman that sucks! At least you got some beer out of it.

I was going to give a carboy a try but now I'm not sure. Maybe I will practice more with buckets.

 

[Christman]

I was going to give a carboy a try but now I'm not sure. Maybe I will practice more with buckets.

I think that I was just unlucky and that it was a freak accident. I have one glass carboy left and if I end up using it someday, I will be extremely careful.

Let us know how yours ends up turning out.

 

[fredbeard]

I was there! Oh did that surprise the hell out of us. It's one of those confusing moments where you want to be pissed but you can't really because there isn't anyone or anything to blame. I think it was a fluke, nothing more. I've been using my carboys for 5 years and have never seen anything like that.
It's a good reason to get a standing fermenter though. Try convincing the better half of that!

 

[Groo]

Just a quick update. I was going to bottle this on Sunday but when I returned home from trip and went to prepare my bottles for the next day I noticed that almost all of them were missing. Turns out someone recycled the empties that I had sitting out, thought they were doing me a favor while I was gone.

I tried to get some more bottles from my friends but it turned out they mostly had Newcastle which were clear. I finally gathered enough brown bottles and could have finished this on Monday but the stomach flu wrecked me and left me feeling like I had just chugged a whole 5 gallons of beer.

Now at least I have bottles and am looking forward to bottling this Saturday. I also bought some ingredients from my LHBS for a brown ale, I guess inspired by the Newcastle bottles that I'm not using.

 

[ShorelineThomas]

Just a quick update. I was going to bottle this on Sunday but when I returned home from trip and went to prepare my bottles for the next day I noticed that almost all of them were missing. Turns out someone recycled the empties that I had sitting out, thought they were doing me a favor while I was gone.

Oh No!

I don't quite have enough empties at the moment to bottle my first-ever batch. I'd be pretty sad if what I do have got recycled.

This reminds me of an idea I had...my former neighbor must have spent all his time drinking beer (I don't think he works for a living). Every night, I'd hear him dumping his recycling out in his bin in the alley separating our houses, must have been dozens of bottles, from the loud clashing sounds he always made. I'm tempted to swing by his place and pick up lots of FREE Brown bottles.

 

[elproducto]

What's wrong with clear bottles? As long as they are kept in a dark place aren't they fine?

 

[Christman]

Man, it sure does suck to be sick. You might be better off picking up a case of the 22 oz. to bottle with instead of buying a case of whatever and trying to drink it by then. Just a thought though, I'm sure it would work out either way.

Over in my neck of the woods, I'm making another pass at that recipe this Friday and I am really excited about it. I'll be sure to get some readings and let you know how it goes.

 

[weavil]

I had to subscribe to this thread. I'm reading Jim Palmer's book now and once I finish my Mr. Beer internship the Cincinnati Pale Ale will be my first big boy brew.

 

[Christman]

This reminds me of an idea I had...my former neighbor must have spent all his time drinking beer (I don't think he works for a living). Every night, I'd hear him dumping his recycling out in his bin in the alley separating our houses, must have been dozens of bottles, from the loud clashing sounds he always made. I'm tempted to swing by his place and pick up lots of FREE Brown bottles.

You would be very lucky if they are the twist-off style. I would have to think that if he is drinking that much beer, they would probably be of the cheaper BMC beers.

 

[Groo]

Bottled today after almost 3 weeks in primary. Man the brew smelled really good. The taste was interesting since there was no carbonation, I've never tasted a beer in this state.

On to bottling. It went smoothly with my wife filling and me capping. We knocked out 46 bottles and cleaned in about an hour. I got close to the 5 gallons out of the fermenter. The yeast didn't really budge but I cut off racking when it started to makes its move.

I took the gravity and it came out to 1.013, so that would put me around 4.8% ABV. I'm guessing my OG was bit off as explained earlier.

Overall bottling wasn't that painful of an experience, almost relaxing in a way. I'll probably drink one after two weeks and one a week until it tastes really good so I can get a good understanding of the maturation process.

 

[Groo]

After checking on one of the beers today (in the clear bottle) it seems that it is very cloudy. There's not anything floating around buy I can't see my finger on the other side of the bottle when held up to the light. The color seems pretty good for a pale ale but the clarity is weird.

Will this clear up as it conditions?

The yeast has settled a bit on the bottom. Waiting on your first brew is a killer.

 

[Christman]

I'm not sure if it will clean up during conditioning or not.

I did my second attempt at this last Friday night, it went very well and I even managed to get it all the way to the basement this time. It's down there bubbling away and hovering around 66F.

I'll update how it's looking when I go to bottle it in a couple weeks and let you know if mine is looking cloudy or not. Have you already made plans for what you are going to brew next Groo? I just ordered the mats for a Christmas Ale and I'm excited to give it a go.

 

[Indyking]

Christman, are you brewing Palmer's Cinci Pale Ale as well, like Groo is?

I think mine may be a bit ahead... 9 days in the bottle now. Mine did not look too cloudy nor clear either, just what I expected from a pale ale without secondary. The taste of it just before bottling (FG was 1.012 I think) was just great! I plan to let mine to bottle condition for about 3 weeks...

 

[Christman]

Indyking, yeah it's the same recipe pretty much. If you look back at page two of this thread, you will see why I mentioned that it actually made it to the basement to ferment this time.

I may end up racking to secondary in my one remaining glass carboy to free up my bucket fermenter to do the Christmas Ale soon. Will it really help clear it up by putting in secondary?

 

[Indyking]

Indyking, yeah it's the same recipe pretty much. If you look back at page two of this thread, you will see why I mentioned that it actually made it to the basement to ferment this time.

I may end up racking to secondary in my one remaining glass carboy to free up my bucket fermenter to do the Christmas Ale soon. Will it really help clear it up by putting in secondary?

OK. I never secondary before but I think the main purpose of it is to clean it up. For Xmas, I got a stout in the fermenter right now...

 

[Groo]

Pretty cool that we all have the same brew going almost at the same stage. My brew has cleared up a bit, it actually is looking pretty good but not perfectly clear. The main thing is how it taste anyways.

I'm going to be working on a Brown Ale, Newcastle-like recipe from the LHBS. This is going down Saturday on my new outdoor burner. My stove killed me last time by taking about an hour to boil 3 gallons then barely keeping it rolling from there. Hopefully this will cut my brew time significantly and I can hose down the mess afterwards unlike the kitchen.

Glad to hear that it made it to the basement this time, it would have sucked to lose 5 more gal.

 

[elproducto]

I bottled this, my first every homebrew last Sunday. I'm going to chill one this weekend and try it.
I have a Pumpkin Ale ready to be racked onto a spice tea, but it will be 5 weeks from being drinkable.. I need to brew this weekend so I will NEVER have to wait this long for homebrew.

 

[Groo]

Waiting sucks. They should have an instant brew for the in between times.

Here's a pic of my beer in the clear bottle. I probably just skunked it but that's ok there's 45 more!

 

[Indyking]

Waiting sucks. They should have an instant brew for the in between times.

Here's a pic of my beer in the clear bottle. I probably just skunked it but that's ok there's 45 more!

The color looks good, have you popped one open and taste it? Mine is just turning 2 weeks in the bottle now, so, some are ready to go to the fridge for a while for cold conditioning (5-7 days) and some will rest on room temp for prolonged periods (2 months) so I can check for differences. I know… I'm very patient...

 

[elproducto]

I drank my first after a week in the bottle, and 24 hours in the fridge. I want to sample it every 7 days to learn how it progresses.

Was very tasty but had minimal cabonation which I wasn't surprised. My only concern is the mouthfeel seemed a little thin. Not sure if that gets better with further carbonation or not. The hops were great and I had to force myself not to have a second! Going to try another one this weekend... I'll update.

 

[Indyking]

I drank my first after a week in the bottle, and 24 hours in the fridge. I want to sample it every 7 days to learn how it progresses.

Was very tasty but had minimal cabonation which I wasn't surprised. My only concern is the mouthfeel seemed a little thin. Not sure if that gets better with further carbonation or not. The hops were great and I had to force myself not to have a second! Going to try another one this weekend... I'll update.

I intend to do a minimum of 2 weeks in the bottle, which is up today , plus 5-7 days in the fridge for cold conditioning because I learned with my previous brews that it makes a lot of difference. There are significant improvements in the clarity and taste. This was my first extract brew. Before that, it was just non-boil coopers kit beers. Seriously, the noncarbonated pre-bottled wort tasted better than any of my previous non-boil kit beers.

 

[Groo]

I'm going to pop one in the fridge for a day or two since it's been bottled for a week. Like elproducto, I'd like to see how it changes over time. I'll probably end up using 6 as test bottles and conditioning the rest for 2 months.

We'll see how that goes. I think getting the pipeline started probably allows you make better brew since you don't always have the itch to pop one open.

 

[Indyking]

I popped one open yesterday, after 2 weeks carbonating at 68-70F. I was skeptical when I heard from a friend that the Palmer's CPA is almost an extract clone for Sierra Nevada pale ale but now after tasting mine I completely agree! It tasted somewhat similar, but less fruity and perhaps a bit lighter, though not thin at all. Hops predominate the flavor and the malt sweetness turned out just right for my taste.

Bellow is a picture of it.

Anyway, compared to all my previous brews (all from canned and pre-hoped kits), this looks way better, I mean, waaaaaaaaaay!

2 things: Palmer's recommended amount of corn sugar for carbonation weighted 3.8 gr, but I decided to use 4 gr because I like it a little more carbonated. Worked great! When I was bottling, the whole piece of plastic wrap I was using to cover the sanitized bottling bucket felt inside the wort and stayed there almost the entire process because I didn't notice until the end. I was just a bit afraid that would have contaminated it, but apparently not. :rockin:

 

[Groo]

Wow, Indyking that's a nice big head!

I popped open one that I had put in the fridge for two days.

First off, it got really hazy once it was popped in the fridge. I think this was because it took me a bit to chill it down. Once I figured it out it dropped to 70 real quick.

Upon opening the bottle, the aroma was nice and strong of pure hops. I poured it in the cop and only got about a 1/4" of head, sort of funny how puny it was. Even funnier was how the tiny foam disintegrated after I took a photo.

On the first sip it was Cascades right away, followed by some bitterness and then I got a bit of malt. The aftertaste was like a green apple jolly rancher, (now I know what a "green" beer tastes like). The mouthfeel was very sharp, I think some extra carb time will help with this. Overall it tasted really good and I think it will taste great in a couple more weeks. What a relief that it turn it out like crap!

Does carbing longer make the bubbles bigger or just the overall head?

Also picked up a free mini-fridge at work. Going to work on a fermentation chamber when I get some time and cash!

 

[elproducto]

OK, I drank one after 2 weeks in the bottle. Still not much carbonation, had about half an inch which dissapated quickly.

My big concern is it tastes watery for some reason. It has nice flavor and bitterness, I practically chugged the thing it was so smooth.. but it just tasted watery.

What are the causes for watery beer? Too much water in the boil?

 

[Yooper]

OK, I drank one after 2 weeks in the bottle. Still not much carbonation, had about half an inch which dissapated quickly.

My big concern is it tastes watery for some reason. It has nice flavor and bitterness, I practically chugged the thing it was so smooth.. but it just tasted watery.

What are the causes for watery beer? Too much water in the boil?

Watery beer has several causes- from not enough malt in the recipe to lack of carbonation.

I'm betting in this case the watery mouthfeel is because of the lack of carbonation.

 

[elproducto]

Watery beer has several causes- from not enough malt in the recipe to lack of carbonation.

I'm betting in this case the watery mouthfeel is because of the lack of carbonation.

Thanks Yooper, can I expect better carbonation with time?