Sparge Arm or Loc Line?

Hi guys I am brewing tomorrow for the first time on my RIMS build. I have a copper sparge arm that is attached to a loc-line that sprinkles water on the bed.




The manifold has a s*itload of holes throughout the bottom. With the lid setup I made, heat retention will not be an issue (IMO) which I think is the biggest argument amongst those who do not use sparge arms. I am using it anyway since I spent the time to build it.

I have been reading conflicting stuff.

I know SABCO uses a hose and actually swirls the surface water...is this a better approach..is it proven that sparge arms do not yield great results?

Is it any better than building a copper manifold that rains water down on the grain bed?

I'd like to know your thoughts on this....I brew tomorrow for the first time and have the loc-line...I could go either way.

Thanks
Joe

I answered you in the other thread too.

You will get the same end result with both, there is no difference. You may have a hotter sparge and grain bed without using the sprinkle method, though you have a lid, so who knows.

Bottom line, there is no net gain in sprinking, so it is an unnecessary piece of equipment to have, a sprinkler... when it yields nothing. It wont benefit you, especially when you can just use your RIMS return line for double duty.

One could add all sorts of things to ones rig that do nothing, but I dont see a point.

I totally understand. I watched the SABCO demo video and they have a 1/2" plastic line sumberged in the corner of the mash. It is creating a whirlpool effect within the MLT.

At one time did you have a sparge arm?

What made you change?

Just do it. Whatever you choose will work and you will only know by trying it. Next brew switch it up if you want to experiment. It seems every time I brew I change something and so far the end result is beer.

Just be sure not to use the sparge arm if you are circulating the mash. Those holes wont deal with husks very well.

I do not use a sparge arm, I think it is unnecessary.

ILOVEBEER said:

I totally understand. I watched the SABCO demo video and they have a 1/2" plastic line sumberged in the corner of the mash. It is creating a whirlpool effect within the MLT.

At one time did you have a sparge arm?

What made you change?

Click to expand...

I did have a sparge arm.

I switched because I was losing too much heat when sprinkling water, and when I built the HERMS I already had the 1/2" return line to the MLT, and really didnt want a redundant return for the sparge. Really, there was no need to have (2) methods of placing water/wort back in the MLT ya know?

Totally understand. My main concern is during the initial circulation through my heat exchanger up into the sparge arm and back into the MLT it will clog...that is what I am afraid of. I was considering doing a quick vourloff into a pitcher until it came out clean, then connecting the silicone feed hose to the QD...then starting the mash recirculation.

What do you think?

ILOVEBEER said:

Totally understand. My main concern is during the initial circulation through my heat exchanger up into the sparge arm and back into the MLT it will clog...that is what I am afraid of. I was considering doing a quick vourloff into a pitcher until it came out clean, then connecting the silicone feed hose to the QD...then starting the mash recirculation.

What do you think?

Click to expand...

I would NOT run the recirc through the sparge device at any point... trust me. You do not want to do this.

Just so I am clear....the sparge arm is just that a final rinse arm with holes that only WATER runs through?

I am still learning the lingo so I apologize.

During my MASH recirculation what do I use then? Do I use only the Loc-Line with the 1/2" opening?

I thought the manifold I built was for the entire MASH and SPARGE process....does it look like the MASH will clog it?

ILOVEBEER said:

Just so I am clear....the sparge arm is just that a final rinse arm with holes that only WATER runs through?

I am still learning the lingo so I apologize.

During my MASH recirculation what do I use then? Do I use only the Loc-Line with the 1/2" opening?

I thought the manifold I built was for the entire MASH and SPARGE process....does it look like the MASH will clog it?

Click to expand...

Sparge arm is ONLY for the sparge with clean water. If you use it while recirculating during the mash, you will likely clog it, and you do NOT want that problem on your first brew.

Use the Loc Line with the 1/2" opening for the RIMS recirc. and Id personally use it for the sparge, but that is up to you bud, it is your rig.

+1 for Pol's response. The husk material and mash junk that will flow through the line during circulation WILL clog your sparge arm holes causing a generally unenjoyable first AG day. Just use the 1/2" Locline opening and position it so it creates a gentle swirling on top of the mash just below the liquid level.

For me, I fly sparge, so then I just run clean sparge water through the same hose at the same height while draining from the bottom of the false bottom. Others will have to chime in for how they batch sparge.

I will be joining this club soon and wondering where you guys are getting that flexible blue and orange thing at?

My sparge ring has 1/8" holes, false bottom has smaller holes, pretty hard to clog things up with that scenario. One small piece of grain somehow made it through last time. I just don't see it as a problem. In my case before the ring use I found uneven mash temps in the keggle due to the hot recirculated wort coming on one side of the keggle. The ring solves that problem.

humann_brewing said:

I will be joining this club soon and wondering where you guys are getting that flexible blue and orange thing at?

Click to expand...

McMaster Carr has Lockline

I have the "Whirly" sparge arm thing and it is a pain in the a$$. I fly sparge and only run clear water through it. I only use it because I bought it and it has sort of become a joke every time I brew. I really don't see any benefit. The whole point of the sparge arm is to avoid disturbing the grain bed while introducing sparge water. If you follow common practice, you have 1-2" of water above the grain bed during the sparge. So, as Pol has said "gently" adding water into the layer above the grain is just as effective as "sprinkling" without the disadvantage of cooling your sparge water. However, if the water gets low in your mash and you expose the grain, I think the "sprinkling" is a good thing.

That being said... If I were you, I'd probably SPARGE with the arm you built. With the lid, you may not have a temp problem. If your temp drops, I'd eliminate it next time around. I definitely would NOT recirculate your mash through it though.

Ed

Ohio-Ed said:

I have the "Whirly" sparge arm thing and it is a pain in the a$$. I fly sparge and only run clear water through it. I only use it because I bought it and it has sort of become a joke every time I brew. I really don't see any benefit. The whole point of the sparge arm is to avoid disturbing the grain bed while introducing sparge water. If you follow common practice, you have 1-2" of water above the grain bed during the sparge. So, as Pol has said "gently" adding water into the layer above the grain is just as effective as "sprinkling" without the disadvantage of cooling your sparge water. However, if the water gets low in your mash and you expose the grain, I think the "sprinkling" is a good thing.

That being said... If I were you, I'd probably SPARGE with the arm you built. With the lid, you may not have a temp problem. If your temp drops, I'd eliminate it next time around. I definitely would NOT recirculate your mash through it though.

Ed

Click to expand...

A simply piece of foil placed on top with small holes poked in it prevents most channeling of sparge water. Sparge line lined up to hit the center of the foil works great for me.

I did my first AG brew last night and it was a great success. I ran into a few snags that were minor and easily fixed.....mostly inexperience with this machine I built and it's little nuances.

Anyway, I made a raspberry wheat. I initially posted because I was concerned about my copper sparge arm I made becoming clogged once the first mash recirculation went through it. I have 50+ pinhead size holes throughout. I decided to avoid any clogs I drilled a 5/16" hole in each corner toward the bottom. My HLT sits above my MLT and BK and gravity feeds strike water through the same copper tubing attached to the heat exchanger. I experienced MINIMAL heat loss thanks to the $8 lids I purchased.

BK then MLT (shown) HLT above both

I found if I ever had any issues with what appeared to be a clog in the very beginnings of the mash...I closed the valve at the bottom of the heat exchanger (pump still running) and opened the valve from the HLT for a few seconds...the clean hot water dislodged whatever was in there and blew it out the 5/16" holes in the corners. No issues at all.
:rockin:

Glad to hear it was a success

Congratulations on your first AG!!
Glad all went well.

Thank you...I sliced the hell out of my pinky cleaning out my keg fermenter...aside from that I think it went pretty awesome....I did find myself talking to myself alot trying to figure problems out....good thing noone was watching

I like to keep it simple and use the Sabco method if just resting a silicon hose on top of the grain bed during mash, and then doing the same with sparging.

I leave the MLT lid on during mash but then usually have it off for most of the sparge.

Works great. In my last 4 batches I hit slightly above 90% efficiency. My Pliny the Elder clone 2 days ago got 93%.

Mash recirc:





Kal

Would someone care to explain to me HOW one figures out their efficiency output of their system please?

Thanks

ILOVEBEER said:

Would someone care to explain to me HOW one figures out their efficiency output of their system please?

Thanks

Click to expand...

Good software either has (or has the means for you to enter) information on the recipe/grains. It'll do it for you.

Kal