1st time mead-maker w/ sulfer smell

I was hoping you guys had some insights/advice on this situation... I am not sure how concerning it is. My mead, now 8 days old, has a light sulfur aroma. It started at 1.080, and is at 1.002 today... I did taste it (didn't drink it), and found it to be surprisingly pleasant, but there is a sulfur smell. I have read that red star cote des blancs is associated with some sulfur smells, but I am a little concerned because I put an air lock on it as soon as I pitched the yeast. I shook the hell out of it before hand (several times) and added plenty of nutrient... anyway, as a newb, I have some questions:

1) is it a bad idea to use an airlock in primary???... as I have read it seems like it needs the air during primary... is this correct???

2) what steps, if any, should I take to rectify this smell (should I rack it back and forth between 2 jugs a few times splashing it around as I do, to aerate it???

...or will that only work before the fermentation has slowed ... mine does not have far to go... 1.080 to 1.002 in 8 days). I noticed a slight sulfur odor a couple days in, but thought it was normal...

3) will h2s ruin a batch in the sense that is is unsafe to drink, or just unappealing???

4) also... when is it "safe" to start drinking the waste from hydrometer readings (as I understand, immature mead will make one sick)???

5) what to use in airlock... water, vodka, something else???

please tell me how to avoid this issue in the future, or point me in the right direction...

more info on batch:

mr_y82 said:

Good deal.. I was getting nervous... brewing my first batch of mead (1 gallon) and the air lock is going nuts, but no foam like all my beers... I had some unfiltered honey in this, but mostly filtered..., saving 12 nice pounds of unfiltered for a full size batch after I get the hang of mead... Don't guess that should take too long after 20 batches of brew!

Here's what I used... I kept it simple... correct me if wrong, I'm still learning..

3.5qts well water

2lb sourwood/wildflower/random local honey mix

1/8 palisade hops (left over from brew... I have some heather tips for a full size batch... any advice on herbal additives? I bought Stephen Buhner's book on sacred and healing beers, with the psychotropic ones too of course... looking forward to experimenting with beer, mead, and wine)

1pack (5g) Cote des Blancs (dry wine yeast)

1tbs yeast nutrient (accidentally added tbs, directions say tsp... oops. guess the extra will settle out.)
simmered but not fully boiled for maybe 30 minutes... only had to skim a little, skimmed most hops out between 5-15 minutes into the boil... then added yeast nutrient. racked, aerated, left overnight, gave it another good shake, pitched yeast @ 80 degrees F, swirled it in a little and left it. Got active pretty quick (just pitched yeast this morning and now the airlock is bubbling along like it would with any good brew).

OG 1.080 (11%)

hoping to age it to a slightly dry, but with a touch of sweetness... I went easy on the honey because I wanted a little quicker reward with my first batch... I have stockpiled quite a bit of homebrew to hold me over!

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oops... silly typo in title (someone feel free to fix it!!!).

another question; at what point should I rack to secondary in the future??? when fermentation is very slow, or when the gravity is a little higher (say 1.020)??? should I go ahead and rack this one to secondary even though it's only been 8 days, since the SG is 1.002???

extra info: 80F pitch, 76F ferment (should I try to get it a little cooler???)

Well sulphur smells are usually associated with stressed yeast - especially with nutrient hog yeasts (and no I can't say about the one you've used - redstar isn't available here).

I would boil a teaspoon or 2 of bread yeast in a 100 mls of water (bring to boil and simmer for 5 or 10 mins). Once its cooled, I'd stir it in well, then give it a couple of days to see if the sulphur smell has gone.....

You've done just fine so far.

I betcha in a few months of aging, you won't smell sulfur anymore.

I use starsan in my airlocks, but a lot of people use vodka. Don't use anything you wouldn't want to get sucked back in.

I transfer to secondary when it's reached (or nearly reached) the FG. Then rack/top-up every time there's a fair amount of trub on the bottom.

4) Not true, drink it whenever you want to. I drink all my hydro samples.

^d*mn... wish I had not poured that golden liquid down my drain... I always drink my beer along the way... Thanks for the info both of you!

fatbloke, I may wait a little while (rack to secondary tonight) and see if it goes away... otherwise I will try your method!

I've always used water in my airlocks for beer... never had an infection... guess I should switch to vodka!!

should I avoid using an airlock right away in the future and just keep it covered? if so, at what point do I add an airlock? after a few days when fermentation slows?

anyone want to tackle those other questions I asked? specifically is h2s "dangerous" in the sense that it is unsafe to drink mead/wine that produced it, or is it just unappealing?

I plan on reading the entire FAQ (thanks hightest) tonight... then I can see if I still have questions... I am sure I will think of some as I get into MEADHING!!

this looks like a good resource too: http://www.utahpagans.org/MeadLecture.htm

H2S is not dangerous but it can really ruin your mead. Sulfur compounds, if left alone, my convert into form that are more difficult to remove (disulfides). This batch probably isn't quite done, as it should finish with a gravity below 1.000. A good splash racking and treatment with 1 grams of yeast hulls (or the boiled yeast the FatBloke mentions) might help to clear it up. If it is still stinky when fermentation completes, you may want to treat with copper.

To prevent the sulfur in the future you should consider a few things including, keeping the fermentation temp down for Cote des Blancs (preferably below 70 F), and providing a yeast energizer (tan powder) in addition to yeast nutrient (DAP - white crystals). The autolyzed yeast in the energizer provide micronutrients such as pyridoxine and pantothenate that are needed to prevent H2S production.

Usually we suggest keeping mead under airlock after the 1/3 fermentation point. Prior to that the yeast do need exposure to oxygen in order to grow properly.

MedsenFey said:

-----%<----- (or the boiled yeast the FatBloke mentions)-----%<-----

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Ha ha! If I could get yeast hulls, then I'd use them Medsen, except they're like rocking horse turds over here (a bit like DAP, FermaidK, GoFerm, etc etc etc)....

Rhino farts? Rocking Horse turds? When did this hobby get so frightening? ;-)

^hehe... I didn't realize when I started!

medsen, fatbloke... I took your advice... being naturally inclined to getting ahead of myself (maybe doing anything yet was getting ahead..?) I didn't let the boiled bread yeast (no hulls on hand) cool as much as I should have, so I compounded the mistake by topping with nice cool non-sterilized well water... I guess I figured if 4 gallons of the stuff doesn't hurt my homebrew, surely the mead can handle it... I hope I don't regret it, but I guess I'll relax and have a homebrew (as Papazian would suggest...)... the new belgian pale ale turned out nicely anyway! I did sit the mead jug in the sink with some cool water to bring the temp down... was at 77... had the air off due to some mouse invaders...

medsen... I have been reading a lot SINCE I started my first batch... so I see how spot on all your suggestions are and I plan on heeding the advice when I start my 1 gallon sourwood soon.

Is it okay for me to use my carboys for the primary, will it get enough O2??? I prefer not to put it in plastic... but I really don't want to FUBAR my big orange blossom batch, so I'd like to feel confident about it.

What yeast (if any) work fairly ideally at 72-74F??? 71B, 1116??? I might have trouble finding a cooler spot.

I guess after brewing for almost a decade, off and on, I should just relax and let it be... I've probably made bigger mistakes... well, I did stand in a 5 gallon wave of pungent wheat beer in my dad's cellar as my carboy slipped out of my fingers and hit the concrete blocks below... just a couple inch drop was PLENTY... I can barely drink wheat beer to this day... ... it was putrid as it rotted, can't clean out all crevices in that porous concrete...(but the cellar might be good for the mead...).

73ºF is about 23ºC. According to the Lalvin website all of their yeasts except the D-47 work at that temperature.

At 72-74F, you can probably use most yeast, but D47, Cote des Blancs, Uvaferm 43, and Montrachet are some that are more likely to get stinky at room temp. If you need to ferment above 75 F, I'd favor K1V or D21.

You can ferment using a carboy as primary, but you need to allow plenty of headspace so that you can open the container and swirl or stir to provide aeration. If you have it too full, you'll have an MEA and have the fun of mopping your ceiling. I find a bucket, the bigger the better, is the way to go.

Do people aerate after fermentation has begun? I've been following the Schramm directions, which indicate aeration only before airlocking. It's worked for me...

huesmann said:

Do people aerate after fermentation has begun? I've been following the Schramm directions, which indicate aeration only before airlocking. It's worked for me...

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You should aerate until the mead is about 1/3 done, then keep it airlocked and no longer aerate.

Thanks guys... As slow as my fermentation is, I hope I didn't do any damage with the splash racking... time will tell!

Medsen, when you say swirl to aerate, do you mean keep it going in one direction and don't slosh intentionally, or do you want to agitate it a little better??? let me know if I'm being too picky... I just prefer to do this right. Also not sure what MEA means (sounds messy!), but I will head your advice on the headspace.

I do plan on using this other pack of cote de blancs with my small sourwood batch, then I plan on sticking with the strains you guys suggest. I picked fairly randomly after reading the descriptions in the william's catalogue..

I have this batch sitting in cool water since I am not running the thermostat right now (trying to take care of the mouse problem in the ducts... d*mn rodents!)... it is cooler now than it has been the whole time, sitting at just around 72F... I guess I might have to use this strategy with the sourwood too (from the get go)... I will replace the water if it heats up a little during the day... might even add a little ice (if that is okay!!!???) to keep it in 65-70F range...

I promise I am reading and trying to absorb a lot of info... I got a little ahead of myself by only reading Papazian's short excperts on mead in "the joy of homebrewing," and buhner's book on sacred and healing beers (an excellent book, but not really a how to guide per se...). I appreciate everyone's patience and willingness to help... I look forward to learning a lot more here and translating it into good mead. If you guys chase me off I will have to check out the gotmead forum!!!

Thanks again all... I'll be back!

mr_y82 said:

Medsen, when you say swirl to aerate, do you mean keep it going in one direction and don't slosh intentionally, or do you want to agitate it a little better??? let me know if I'm being too picky... I just prefer to do this right. Also not sure what MEA means (sounds messy!), but I will head your advice on the headspace.

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MEA - Mead Eruption Accident
Swirling/stirring/sloshing all work to aerate the mead. I personally favor a whisk and a strong right arm!

good, so I'll get it there and get it good... no half-hearted, hesitant swirling...

Thanks for clearing up the acronym... I gathered it was some type of undesirable explosion of sorts... I have a friend who recently tried to brew an 8+% beer with his carboy filled, to the neck... needless to say he had quite an interesting blowoff experience! He was able to rescue most his beer from near disaster.

I will leave you guys alone on this subject for now, but expect some updates on the batch in 3 to 6 months...

Yooper said:

You should aerate until the mead is about 1/3 done, then keep it airlocked and no longer aerate.

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Hmph...curious. I thought you didn't want oxygen to get at your mead, hence the whole airlock business.

Also, what exactly does it mean to aerate til 1/3 done? Swish it around every day? Every hour?

1/3 done means when the gravity has dropped 1/3 of the amount you expect for the complete fermentation. If you start at a gravity of 1.090, you'll be at the 1/3 fermentation point (sometimes called the 1/3 sugar break) when the gravity hits 1.060.

You need aeration to provide oxygen to the yeast early in the course of fermentation. The oxygen stimulates the yeast to produce more sterols in the cell membranes. This allows the yeast to be more resistant to alcohol, and it allows them to divide a greater number of times to achieve a higher biomass. Without some exposure to oxygen, you have a high risk of incomplete fermentation. Aerating at least once a day during the first 1/3 of fermentation is often recommended. After that point, keeping it away from oxygen becomes important.

I think the water bath might be killing my strip thermometer

It is still currently giving the temp, but the part that has been underwater, while still sticking, is developing some light/white areas around the temps that "move" or change when I press or rub across them...

anyone know if william's thermometer strips will keep working properly if submerged??? they say waterPROOF... http://www.williamsbrewing.com/STRIP-THERMOMETER-P538.aspx

EDIT: NEVERMIND ON THAT QUESTION... SEARCHING REVEALED THE ANSWER... IMAGINE THAT!

I am going to cover this one in packaging tape... and hope it is not too late for it...

So far it seems the smell has been corrected... maybe it would have self-corrected, maybe not... I appreciate the help and wanted to let you (Medsen and Fatbloke) know that the steps you suggested may have saved my first batch of mead!!!... time will tell... It's sitting in a water/ice bath now maintaining a temp of 68 or below... wish I would have kept it there during the more critical stages... I might have to age this stuff for a decade!!!

Thanks!

Looks like the packaging tape was either too late or doesn't work... I might fully enclose one in tape before taping it on next time... alas, now I am just letting my glass thermometer sit it the bath with the mead... it's works, so I'll chalk that wasted 3 bucks up to experience...

Getting ready to do another secondary racking on the mead. It's been 6 weeks since I did the bread yeast thing, and this stuff is already impressively clear (I can read the small print on beer labels through the gallon jug). Once we took care of the mouse problem I was able to keep the temp at 72 w/out a water bath. I haven't noticed any activity at all and I expect the SG is basically stable and I know it's below 1.

The lower temp is most important during the primary phase, correct? After activity has become super slow, a higher temp won't cause as much harm, right??? What about after it's bottled... would 76F degrees be a problem for bottled mead???

I have some big brown grolsh bottles... I has been wondering if it wouldn't be better for the mead to be out of the clear jug in a couple months, instead of continuing to bulk age it in clear glass. I have it sitting in a bucket in the darkest part of the house, but it still gets some light... I was also considering adding a cup of vodka when I bottle, thoughts???

Trying to get to a stout and two more 1 gallon batches of mead soon... then the big one.

I didn't get my equipment set up quite right and I was far from a noiseless siphon... stirred up a little yeast too, but managed to leave most of it. I just hope I didn't introduce too much O2, don't know how bad that is compared to beer... I have read it's good to release CO2, so maybe I can put a positive spin on it.

I took a reading... was actually .004 higher than my first reading at the tail end of primary... must be due to temp difference.... I added a 1/2 cup 100 proof vodka and 1/2 cup h20 to fill up the carboy... I figure it's about 11%, and it actually tastes pretty good 2 months from start... so I am looking forward to tasting it after it ages. It was super clear, but dark due to my honey choice... a little cloudy after racking.

as of january 2012 (4 months since production) this is at 11% and has a very pleasing taste... has been stable and clear for a long time and I think I can bottle it anytime... been busy making back to back to back batches of beer lately, and trying to forget about the mead for a while so I can reap the rewards of patience.

Tasted good in march... tasted good this past weekend when I bottled it... dry, but not overly so... 12%ish .996... looking forward to it down the road.

I put it in Fischer (french) swing top bottles... hope that is okay for upwards of a year+... funny story... while I was washing bottles outside I dropped one from at least 3 feet... it bounced of a rock into the grass and I figured it was history... can't find a mark on the bottle, but the rock (granite) had a line of chalky dust from the impact... that's a good bottle.