Canning starter wort

Canning is a proven method for long-term storage with proven techniques - and that's the reason that I employ a pressure cooker when canning wort. While I recognize that botulism is a minimal risk, to say that there isn't one is disingenuous.

That being said, I primarily employ my pressure cooker to make sterile media for slants and plates. If I'm investing time and energy to build a yeast bank, I want to be insured of the purity of my strains. On a related note, lightly hopping the media will make it more conducive to growing yeast and not bacteria.

conpewter said:

Also there are around 100 cases of botulism in the US every year... that's pretty rare. 85% of those are cases with babies since their digestive tract is not acidic enough to kill the botulism spores, adults are just fine with ingesting the spores (and it happens all the time).

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Statistics mean nothing if you are the one that makes the list.

Whatever the risk, I'm just making sure that everyone who reads this post knows that a risk exists and can then make an informed decision about how to proceed.

Tom

HarvInSTL said:

I have been doing mine for 30-40 minutes @ 10psi. Am I doing it wrong?

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Not sure if there is an approved National Center for Home Food Preservation method for canning wort, but I can mine at the same time/pressure as canning beef or chicken stock:
20 min @ 11 psi for pint jars, 25 min @ 11 psi for quart jars

The psi required is dependent on your altitude, and the gauge-type of your pressure canner (dial-gauge or weighted-gauge):

Altitude (feet) Weighted Gauge(psi) Dial Gauge(psi)
0-1,000....................10..........................11
1,001-2,000..............15..........................11
2,001-4,000..............15...........................12
4,001-6,000..............15...........................13
6,001-8,000..............15...........................14
8,001-10,000.............15..........................15

Figbash said:

Statistics mean nothing if you are the one that makes the list.

Whatever the risk, I'm just making sure that everyone who reads this post knows that a risk exists and can then make an informed decision about how to proceed.

Tom

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I have stated over and over that there is a risk, but only if you are canning it by boiling (only) and storing at room temp. If you put it in the fridge/freezer then there is no risk.

the type of toxin involved cannot be formed at temperatures less than 50°F (10°C).

The point of the statistics is that unless you are an idiot or a baby you are not going to get botulism. Most people know that if a can (or jar) is damaged or bloated that they shouldn't eat/drink it. Apparently there are about 15 people each year that don't think like that.

Also most people that do canning know that a low acid food needs to be either pressure canned, or stored in the fridge/freezer or there is a possibility of botulism.

I freeze the wort immediately after a 60 minute boil and it has hops in it as well. I then re-boil the wort in the flask before using it for a starter. This procedure has no risk of botulism toxicity.

conpewter said:

I have stated over and over that there is a risk, but only if you are canning it by boiling (only) and storing at room temp. If you put it in the fridge/freezer then there is no risk.

the type of toxin involved cannot be formed at temperatures less than 50°F (10°C).

The point of the statistics is that unless you are an idiot or a baby you are not going to get botulism. Most people know that if a can (or jar) is damaged or bloated that they shouldn't eat/drink it. Apparently there are about 15 people each year that don't think like that.

Also most people that do canning know that a low acid food needs to be either pressure canned, or stored in the fridge/freezer or there is a possibility of botulism.

I freeze the wort immediately after a 60 minute boil and it has hops in it as well. I then re-boil the wort in the flask before using it for a starter. This procedure has no risk of botulism toxicity.

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+1 I do the same!

I think most people here are missing the point that it is the botulism toxin that will make you sick, not the spores. We ingest the spores all the time but they cannot reproduce inside the body. The problem is when there are spores present in food for a long time they will develop the toxin (for example, in the can of food/wort) and when you pop the can and eat the food directly, you are at risk of getting sick. if you were to always boil the food after opening the can the temperature will destroy the poison that will make you sick but NOT the spore, but killing the spore doesn't matter as long as you are sure there will be no toxin present.

So.

1. If you won't be heating to kill any toxin, make sure there are no spores (i.e. heat the food to 245dF or whatever it takes to kill the spores)

2. if you are heating the food to a temp that will destroy the toxin, then it doesn't matter if the spores are killed or not.

I freeze my wort, and always boil before I make a starter. I do this because I can boil in my flask (on my gas stove) and it is a 1-step way of sanitizing everything that the yeast will touch at the same time. If i was to can my wort in a pressure cooker, i would still need to then sanitize and clean the flask and the tinfoil before adding the wort and yeast.

Spine said:

I freeze my wort, and always boil before I make a starter. I do this because I can boil in my flask (on my gas stove) and it is a 1-step way of sanitizing everything that the yeast will touch at the same time. If i was to can my wort in a pressure cooker, i would still need to then sanitize and clean the flask and the tinfoil before adding the wort and yeast.

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To me that defeats the purpose of premaking starter wort. If your going to thaw, and boil, then you might as well just boil some extract.

If you pressure can then you're only doing the work once.
My jars are in the pantry at room temperature waiting to be dumped directly into a sanitized flask.

Just my 2 cents.

Plan9 said:

To me that defeats the purpose of premaking starter wort. If your going to thaw, and boil, then you might as well just boil some extract.

If you pressure can then you're only doing the work once.
My jars are in the pantry at room temperature waiting to be dumped directly into a sanitized flask.

Just my 2 cents.

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If you are making it from extract I agree. I collect the wort left in my tubing and in the hops (squeeze out the bag etc.) and freeze that. I don't have to worry about being sanitary with it since it will be re-boiled later.

I like to heat sanitize everything anyway so I'd probably be boiling something in that flask before putting wort and yeast in it.

Plan9 said:

To me that defeats the purpose of premaking starter wort. If your going to thaw, and boil, then you might as well just boil some extract.

If you pressure can then you're only doing the work once.
My jars are in the pantry at room temperature waiting to be dumped directly into a sanitized flask.

Just my 2 cents.

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Well for me DME or LME is much more expensive compared to grain (I buy it by the 50lb sack) so when I make a batch, after whirlpooling I siphon off the good wort for my batch and then the remainder I siphon to a separate container where i strain out all of the trub. This remainder wort is what I freeze and then use for future starters. Basically nothing goes to waste in my operation and it's been working well for me so far.

When I make the starter, I just thaw out some wort, put it in my erlenmeyer flask and then boil it for 15m to sterilize the flask, wort and tinfoil for the top. I put the whole thing in the sink with some cold water and then put the yeast in. Super simple and there is no measuring or pressure cooking.

Mike

When I pressure can my wort, sometimes as much as 1/2 of it boils over into the pan and out of the jar. What am I doing wrong?

Plan9 said:

To me that defeats the purpose of premaking starter wort. If your going to thaw, and boil, then you might as well just boil some extract.

If you pressure can then you're only doing the work once.
My jars are in the pantry at room temperature waiting to be dumped directly into a sanitized flask.

Just my 2 cents.

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I don't know about you, but I was never able to handle extract (dry or liquid) without making a sticky mess. By freezing quart-sized blocks of starter wort, all I have to do is chuck it in the 'wave or on the stovetop to thaw and boil, then chill and onto the stirplate. Yes, it's more work when preparing the starter, but much less equipment is required. I like not having too much stuff, and a pressure cooker, while a useful tool in a lot of ways, isn't something I'd consider essential in my kitchen.

I don't bother making starter-specific wort. I just make an extra gallon of beer from a batch in the 1.035 to 1.050 range, and freeze it in quart tupperwares after the boil. No extract required, no extra work, and it doesn't take up THAT much space in the beer freezer.

lamarguy said:

I recently canned a case of 1.040 wort and it came out quite dark and had a lot of hot break material in the jars after the canning process.

I'm planning to skip the boil next time and go straight from mash to canning. I'm hoping this will help avoid the overly dark wort. Probably not, but it's worth a shot.

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Why are you mashing for starter wort? Do you use a brewing opportunity for canning purposes as well? The reason I ask is that I just use pils dry extract.

smellysell said:

When I pressure can my wort, sometimes as much as 1/2 of it boils over into the pan and out of the jar. What am I doing wrong?

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I'd bet you are opening the canner to soon after you are "done" canning it. I always just let mine cool on it's own. Once my little safety poppit goes down I open the lid. Then I take the jars out, tighten the lids more, and then turn upside down to cool to room temperature. If you open the lid to soon, it makes the stuff inside boil and makes a mess. The object is to not boil anything and let the pressure work for the process. The pressure holds down the boil and allows for a cleaner "in jar" sterilizing. I had the same thing happen trying to can pumpkin for pies. I put a wet towel on top of the canner to hasten the cooling process... big no no for jars, but ok for actual cooking of foods. Now I know to let it take it's time.

Also for another tip, let about an inch to an inch and a half of space at the tops of the jars. Hope this helps.

WortMonger said:

I'd bet you are opening the canner to soon after you are "done" canning it. I always just let mine cool on it's own. Once my little safety poppit goes down I open the lid. Then I take the jars out, tighten the lids more, and then turn upside down to cool to room temperature. If you open the lid to soon, it makes the stuff inside boil and makes a mess. The object is to not boil anything and let the pressure work for the process. The pressure holds down the boil and allows for a cleaner "in jar" sterilizing. I had the same thing happen trying to can pumpkin for pies. I put a wet towel on top of the canner to hasten the cooling process... big no no for jars, but ok for actual cooking of foods. Now I know to let it take it's time.

Also for another tip, let about an inch to an inch and a half of space at the tops of the jars. Hope this helps.

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Thanks! I've been running cool water over the lid to help cool it off like I always saw my mom do. Guess I'll try just letting it cool on it's own now.

JVD_X said:

Why are you mashing for starter wort? Do you use a brewing opportunity for canning purposes as well? The reason I ask is that I just use pils dry extract.

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To make it worth my time, I can 5 gallons of wort in a session.

All grain is just cheaper than buying extract. So, I brew a 5 gallon batch of low gravity wort (with minimal hops) and can it. I only have to do this once or twice a year, depending on how much liquid yeast I go through.

This is an old thread, but certainly the most comprehensive I've found by miles compared to other canning threads, so I figured I'd add to it instead of making yet another new thread.

Using many of these tips, I bought a pressure canner and canned up ~11 gallons of starter wort from grain successfully. Total cost for materials (just grain, really) was $10.92. That's a huge savings over DME for me, and I now have starter wort on hand at the crack of the jar. Here's some tips for anybody considering doing it yourself. You could certainly use DME, but then I think you lose half of the utility and are only shifting the boiling time away from starter day onto canning day.

Use some brewing software to design the batch:
- Select the cheapest grain available, usually plain 2-row malted around 2L.
- Design for 1.040 pre-boil gravity using your own equipment profiles.

Plan volumes accordingly:
-Mason jars are volume rated to the top rim, but you can only fill them ~80% for pressure canning.
- A 12-jar case of Quarts ($10) holds 2.4 gal. A 12-jar case of Pints ($8) holds 1.2 gal.
- Conversely, a gallon of wort fits exactly into 5 Quarts, or 10 Pints, or a combination of 4 Quarts and 2 Pints.
- 4 Quarts and 2 Pints is a good ratio because it's allows for both sizes in whole cases (2 cases Quarts + 1 case Pints = 6.0 gal)

Select the right jars for your situation:
- Both regular (narrow) and wide-mouth jars work fine for canning starter wort.
- Narrow mouth jars are slightly easier to pour thin liquids with because they taper down at the jar mouth, making them great for kids or the elderly.
- Wide mouth jars are easier to store tall things in (pickles), remove thick or densely packed things (jelly).
- It's best to buy all jars with the same size to only have to keep 1 size lid on hand. Choose one, if you can work it.
-- Quarts and pints come in both wide and narrow versions.
-- Pint-and-a-half (uncommon and not very useful) and half-gallon (uncommon, but very useful for storing grains) only come in wide mouth versions.
-- Half-pints and and the three smaller jelly jar sizes only come in narrow mouth versions.
-- I would not recommend canning in half-gallons jars (potentially unsafe) or in jars smaller than pints (wasting your time).

Boiling the starter wort:
- Why bother?
- It's already going to be cooked at 250F anyway.
- Skip this step. Can straight from the tun.

Selecting a canner:
- If you buy the 23 qt model on Amazon (Presto 01781), it will work out-of-the-box using the included 15# weight and dial gauge.
-- If you ever want to use it for things other than starter wort, you'll want to buy the 3-piece (5#/10#/15#) weights (Presto 50332).
-- It's not much larger, only taller, only a few $$ more than the 16 qt, and can pressure can twice as much per run. Get this size!
-- To stack double the amount of pint my stacking, buy a second rack (Presto 85707) to prevent jar breakage.
- If you buy the 16 qt model from Walmart (Presto 01745), it comes with the 3-piece weight, but does not have a gauge.
-- It still works, but you can't watch the pressure build on the gauge and it only holds half as much wort.
- Note, with either model, you can fit fewer wide-mouth pints than narrow-mouth pints. I didn't find this to be an issue for me, personally.

Using the canner:
- Read the manual! Do a practice run with only water, no jars, and be prepared for the canner to oxidize inside (turn blackish).
- When filling jars, use only fresh lids and only tighten the ring to finger-tight -- just tight enough to hold the lid on and prevent spillage.
-- Over-tightening will prevent a good vacuum seal, the lid will still be popped outward, and you'll need to re-process that jar or use immediately.
- Always fill the canner to the lowest mark (3 quarts) if using either model listed above, then add jars.
- Follow the directions. Cook for 15 minutes at 15# (250F).
- Allow the canner to cool of its own accord! Do not try to speed it by venting steam or using cold water baths.
- Change out the water in the canner each time. It can get acidic and smell gross after more than one use.
- Use canning lifter or canning tongs to move hot jars and place in a safe place to cool. They stay hot for approximately an hour.
- Don't try to speed the jars cooling down! Don't tighten the rings for 12 hours. You may remove them if you prefer to re-use them.
- After at least 12 hours have passed, remove the ring, and wipe down the jar to remove any stray sugars if you don't want ants.
- You can store with or without rings.

Here's my successful runs so far - 4 cases of Quarts and 1.5 cases of Pints (10.70 gal of 1.039 - 14# 2-row at 82% mash eff), and an extra 1.5 cases of Priming Sugar pints. Took two days because I tried to use the smaller Walmart canner. Went way faster once the larger Amazon one arrived. 10.70 gallons of 1.039, ready for instant starters.



Good luck! Maybe if somebody finds this helpful someday, toss me a Like.