Why Wyeast?! Why?!!!

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msharki

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I've had an ale fermenting for 3 weeks now using Wyeast American Ale II, it's at FG, but I had to move it for a few hours from my 70 degree upstairs to my 60 degree basement. The stupid yeast stopped! I've had it back upstairs for 16 hours now and it's still dormant. What can I do? I've now had 3 bad experiences with Wyeast going dormant and I wasn't able get it going again. One didn't start at all, one fermented partially then stopped and now this. I can't lose this brew. I have 50 dollars in raspberry puree alone in it....
 
I don't get it? You've been fermenting for 3 weeks, it's at FG, you moved the fermenter for a few hours and it's still at FG?
 
What are you trying to blame wyeast for? You said it fermented for 3 weeks and is at FG, that means it fermented completely. The yeast went dormant because there was no more sugar left to eat.
If your going off airlock activity, thats your problem.
 
Doesn't sound like there is anything to complain about if it reached FG. Bottle and enjoy.
 
JonM said:
Not to be a jerk, but is this the batch you mentioned here where people told you that you need to make a starter with Wyeast smack packs?

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f163/why-my-wyeast-garbage-317517/

On your next batch, make a starter the size recommended by the Mr. malty online calculator and I think you'll be nicely surprised at how well the yeast does.
Click to expand...

So from this linked post and the original post I take it the OP has no clue how to use a hydrometer and thinks the air lock is a measurement tool. Sounds like someone needs to read some beginning brewing books
 
billybrewer09 said:
what are you trying to blame wyeast for? You said it fermented for 3 weeks and is at fg, that means it fermented completely. The yeast went dormant because there was no more sugar left to eat.
If your going off airlock activity, thats your problem.
Click to expand...

+1
 
I'm not sure why everyone is being such asses about this stuff. I was under the impression the brewing community would be more helpful instead of just criticizing. I DO know how to use a hydrometer as I used it to check my last brew that didn't work out. This yeast just stops working when it gets the slightest bit colder.

As for the comments about it hitting final gravity (yes it did) but it's not like you never have any airlock activity again. It had some, I placed it in the basement for a few hours to get it out of the way for some things I needed to do and now there is no activity. My worry is that I will bottle it and it won't carbonate. THAT'S IT.

P.S. Beginning brewing books? Until using Wyeast I've had every single brew turn out perfectly fine using either safeale or white labs. This time I brewed three in a row using Wyeast and I had a problem with all of them. Why wouldn't I blame the yeast?
 
they aren't trying to be dicks, they're just trying to understand what the problem is.

I never keg or bottle unless airlock activity has been stopped for awhile. And a lot of people on here will tell you that airlock activity isn't even a good measure of active fermentation. Even if it has stopped, there is still enough yeast in suspension to carbonate the brew. I throw my primaries in the fridge to cold crash before I bottle, and I've never had a problem with them not carbing.
 
When the yeast stop working at fg it's because there are no consumable sugars left, not that they died. It will bottle carb just fine. People are responding this way because you were extremely unclear in your original post.
 
dawgmatic said:
they aren't trying to be dicks, they're just trying to understand what the problem is.

I never keg or bottle unless airlock activity has been stopped for awhile. There is enough yeast in suspension to carbonate the brew. I throw my primaries in the fridge to cold crash before I bottle, and I've never had a problem with them not carbing.
Click to expand...

Thank you. That is definitely the type of answer I was looking for. I've just never had a brew without activity before. I've left them in for well over 3 weeks before (especially with some of my higher gravity brews) and never has one stopped having activity.
 
Wolfhound180 said:
When the yeast stop working at fg it's because there are no consumable sugars left, not that they died. It will bottle carb just fine. People are responding this way because you were extremely unclear in your original post.
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Thanks. Sorry about not being more clear. I just wonder though what happened with my other batch. Obviously the yeast was fine for a while. It fermented and then halted. I checked the gravity every day for a week and it wouldn't budge and it was still nowhere near FG. I tried agitating, temp fluctuation, yeast nutrient and adding table sugar. The end product was just slightly higher gravity and still no activity.
 
Just realize that the airlock activity is not giving you valid information. Your hydrometer is telling you that it is at FG as you've presumably taken readings over a few days and have the same number. That's what's important. You moved the carboy which probably caused a bunch of the air to escape so therefor it's probably equalized with the air outside of the carboy.
 
When the beer hits FG the yeast is dropping out of suspension and going dormant. Airlock activity after this point is simply CO2 coming out of solution due to pressure and temperature changes in the environment surrounding the fermenter. As Revvy is constantly reminding folks, "airlock activity is not an indicator of fermentation".

I guess the conclusion of this thread is: your beer is done, there's nothing wrong with the yeast if it fermented your beer to your desired FG.

As for your other brews and their higher FGs, look elsewhere: proper aeration, mash temps, thermometer calibration, etc.
 
Lots of things going on here. What do you consider your "FG" to be? If your beer is still fermenting and your airlock still going when you bottle you may be setting your self up for bottle bombs. Your air lock is never a good fermentation indicator. Always wait until your beer stabilizes for at least 3-4 days with NO activity before you bottle.

In regards to Wyeast, There website recommends using a starter on all there yeast strains. Its helps for a healthy yeast and less off flavors. It will also help with moderate temp fluctuations when you have more yeast going and cleaning up after each other. Every strain of yeast is different and will act different in all situations. If your process is solid you will not have any problems.



BTY - What kind of beer uses that much raspberry puree???
 
msharki said:
I'm not sure why everyone is being such asses about this stuff. I was under the impression the brewing community would be more helpful instead of just criticizing. I DO know how to use a hydrometer as I used it to check my last brew that didn't work out. This yeast just stops working when it gets the slightest bit colder.

As for the comments about it hitting final gravity (yes it did) but it's not like you never have any airlock activity again. It had some, I placed it in the basement for a few hours to get it out of the way for some things I needed to do and now there is no activity. My worry is that I will bottle it and it won't carbonate. THAT'S IT.
Click to expand...

I think you were getting RTFM kind of answers because you weren't clear on what your concern was. You simply stated that the beer hit FG and then the yeast went dormant, which is well pretty much what we all expect.

There will still be enough yeast left to carb when you add priming sugar at bottling.

msharki said:
P.S. Beginning brewing books? Until using Wyeast I've had every single brew turn out perfectly fine using either safeale or white labs. This time I brewed three in a row using Wyeast and I had a problem with all of them. Why wouldn't I blame the yeast?
Click to expand...

I don't know your process, nor which wyeast was used, but I can tell you that people use Wyeast every day without problems. If I had to guess, I'd say that the problem, if any exists is in your process. Either fermenting at wrong temperature, or more likely under pitching.

Tell us more about what your concerns are, and your yeast process from start to finish and people can more likely help.
 
Bottle it, it's done. If it has fermented for 3 weeks, there is no activity in the airlock and you are at, or very near expected FG then the yeast has done it's job. The yeast are still there, they just don't have anything else to consume and convert, producing co2 in the process. Adding the priming sugar will give them that food source. I would be a lot more concerned with one that would not stop fermenting....it almost always means infection and usually means dumping it.
Having said that, I have never used wyeast and only made a few starters, just when the recipe said to. There are those who advocate it every time and others who have made starters for years and now never do it because the yeasts are better and more cultivated for diffrent applications. It comes down to personal preference, switch to a brand you are comfortable with and always follow their directions.
yeasts are like gravity...its everywhere and works everytime....well, most of the time anyway..
 
Wow, this is definitely more comments than I expected. I'll try to answer them. I'm pretty much satisfied that if I bottle this one it will be fine, so we can close that one. JonM: this one is pretty much spot on with FG. It was my last one that stuck in the middle. JoeBronco, you asked what I considered FG to be... I use Beersmith 2 so I just try to hit the OG of the recipe that I designed and measure for the projected FG Beersmith gives me. As for the amount of raspberry puree.. I was trying to get a product similar to Samual Smiths Organic Raspberry Ale. It's extremely fruit forward, and unfortunately raspberry is expensive. It has 6.2 pounds in it. Someone else mentioned bottle bombs. So far (out of the 8 batches of beer I have brewed) I've never had a bottle bomb or an over carbonated bottle. I think that's pretty much it. I'll bottle this batch and I think I'm going to just use White Labs from now on. I was just interested in the different strains that Wyeast had. In my opinion, it just seems very tempermental.
 
BigRob said:
When the beer hits FG the yeast is dropping out of suspension and going dormant. Airlock activity after this point is simply CO2 coming out of solution due to pressure and temperature changes in the environment surrounding the fermenter. As Revvy is constantly reminding folks, "airlock activity is not an indicator of fermentation".

I guess the conclusion of this thread is: your beer is done, there's nothing wrong with the yeast if it fermented your beer to your desired FG.

As for your other brews and their higher FGs, look elsewhere: proper aeration, mash temps, thermometer calibration, etc.
Click to expand...

This.

If you're at your FG while the airlock is still gassing then move it to a colder room, the available CO2 may stop gassing out of solution. Colder liquid will hold more dissolved gas. I'm guessing this is what happened in your case.
 
Bamsdealer said:
This.

If you're at your FG while the airlock is still gassing then move it to a colder room, the available CO2 may stop gassing out of solution. Colder liquid will hold more dissolved gas. I'm guessing this is what happened in your case.
Click to expand...

Yeast dropping out of suspension when at FG with a decrease in temperature is a desirable feature.

Go Wyeast, Go!
 
msharki said:
Wow, this is definitely more comments than I expected. I'll try to answer them. I'm pretty much satisfied that if I bottle this one it will be fine, so we can close that one. JonM: this one is pretty much spot on with FG. It was my last one that stuck in the middle. JoeBronco, you asked what I considered FG to be... I use Beersmith 2 so I just try to hit the OG of the recipe that I designed and measure for the projected FG Beersmith gives me. As for the amount of raspberry puree.. I was trying to get a product similar to Samual Smiths Organic Raspberry Ale. It's extremely fruit forward, and unfortunately raspberry is expensive. It has 6.2 pounds in it. Someone else mentioned bottle bombs. So far (out of the 8 batches of beer I have brewed) I've never had a bottle bomb or an over carbonated bottle. I think that's pretty much it. I'll bottle this batch and I think I'm going to just use White Labs from now on. I was just interested in the different strains that Wyeast had. In my opinion, it just seems very tempermental.
Click to expand...

Before you decide to change yeast I would suggest to learn more about yeast. I would think the opposite to be the problem. If you have yeast still fermenting after 3-4 weeks I would think that would be a problem. Sounds like the Wyeast yeast did their job perfectly. Once your beer hits FG they're done, other than cleaning up their mess

Adding fruit is commonly done in a secondary prior to a yeast finishing fermentation. Did you follow this procedure?
 
I'm not sure White Labs will fix your FG problems, ensuring you have the proper cell count of viable yeast for the batch you intend to ferment would go a long way in preventing stuck fermentation.

Regardless of the statements on the websites and packaging, vials and smack packs are giving you less than recommended cell counts (Dry Yeast is too if rehydrated improperly/not rehydrated).

You should be making a starter for the majority of your brews. It's pretty simple, you don't need fancy lab equipment, just a growler, malt extract and some tinfoil. Tons of threads around here with info on making starters.
 
BigRob... Wyeast, Whitelabs, safale and just about every other yeast company SUGGEST you to use a starter either on the package or on the website. I know both wyeast and WL have a "how to" on there website. I agree with you that it doesn't take a rocket surgeon to figure this out, just hard headed people refuse to see it.
 
I think part of the blame rests on Wyeast and White Labs. I know when I started brewing a few years ago the packages clearly implied you should just pitch the vial/smackpack into cooled/aerated wort, up to 1.060 I believe.

There's a lot of conflicting information and marketing talk out there for a newer brewer to absorb and sift through. As well as the ever present poor advice/old wives tales from LHBS employees and brew-buddies when it comes to yeast.
 
BigRob said:
I think part of the blame rests on Wyeast and White Labs. I know when I started brewing a few years ago the packages clearly implied you should just pitch the vial/smackpack into cooled/aerated wort, up to 1.060 I believe.

There's a lot of conflicting information and marketing talk out there for a newer brewer to absorb and sift through. As well as the ever present poor advice/old wives tales from LHBS employees and brew-buddies when it comes to yeast.
Click to expand...

Well OP said his brew reached FG so there is not a problem with the yeast just his misunderstanding that yeast is suppose to keep producing co2 after they quit working.

But I do agree IMHO that more yeast is needed than what is stated by the yeast companies.
Although, there are plenty of brewers that make good beer just pitching 1 pack into a 1.060 wort or sprinkling 1 pack of dry yeast into their wort. If they only knew they could make "better" beer, pitching more yeast
 
Its funny you use 1.060 wort... That is the key gravity that wyeast uses to say that if you go above 1.060 you need a starter.

The Activator™ package contains a minimum of 100 billion cells in a yeast slurry.. The Activator™ is designed to directly inoculate 5 gallons of standard strength ale wort (1.034-1.060 SG) with professional pitching rates. For lagers, we recommend inoculating the wort at warm temperatures (68-70°F/ 20-21°C), waiting for signs of fermentation, and then adjusting to the desired temperature. Alternatively, for pitching into cold conditions (34-58°F/ 1-14°C) or higher gravity wort, we recommend increasing this pitching rate. This can be achieved by pitching additional Activator™ packages or by making a starter culture. Please see the Pitch Rate section for additional information.
Click to expand...
 
OP, I'm concerned with your fermenting process. Healthy yeast generally will be done after 3 weeks. If you are getting stuck fermentations and slow fermentations then it could very well be that you are under pitching. A packet of dry yeast (according to Mr malty, which I recommend you Google and use) 1 11 gram packet is usually enough for most beers. Not to beat a dead horse, but airlock activity is all but useless. I think you may benefit from doing more research on yeast care.
 
I'm with everyone else here.

1.) Do some research before you go pointing fingers.

2.) Your yeast (on this batch at least) seems to be working as expected.

3.) A ten degree change might seem insignificant to you but can you imagine what that would be like to a tiny little yeast cell?!?!

4.) Don't be so defensive towards peoples responses to your posts! If you are receiving harsh criticism it is likely because you are either doing something out of the ordinary (something that you shouldn't be doing) or, in this case, complaining about a non-issue (something that you shouldn't be complaining about).

The greatest asset of this home brew "community" is the ability to gain knowledge from other brewers. Use every bit of criticism that comes your way constructively! Your beer sounds like its totally fine and your yeast has preformed exactly the way that everyone here would expect it to (which should be a hint that nothing is wrong).

If I were to post a thread right now complaining about Citra Hops being too intense because I just brewed a batch with 25 oz of Citra and then dry hopped with 6 oz of Citra would you jump down my throat and tell me that I went WAY overboard? ABSOLUTELY YOU WOULD!!!

I'm not trying to be a d*ck but 9.9 times out of 10 the problems that arise on HBT are a direct result of the OP's process... not the OP's ingredients. For Christ sakes, The Vikings brewed beer that they enjoyed and they had no idea wtf yeast were but they did know what their process was. Read some books... read some forum posts regarding topics that interest you... absorb every last drop of information that you can and treat every beer you brew and every question that you ask as a lesson which you can learn from.

Today's lesson is - a beer which has reached its FG will not necessarily continue to produce airlock activity. Simple as that.
 

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