Wheat beer help...

[drthrob]

Need opinions on a wheat recipe. I am typically a porter/stout brewer (all-grain, always all-grain) and decided to make a wheat this time. Two weeks in primary, five days in secondary, now five days into kegs. I've been doing daily taste tests and the beer is really just...bland. Nearly tasteless. As I don't have much experience with wheats, I figured I'd come here and see what people's opinions on the problem might be. I believe it may have something to do with the chosen yeast, but I researched a bit before the choice and wanted to try the spicy notes others had mentioned when using it.





5 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 43.5 %


5 lbs White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM) Grain 2 43.5 %


1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 3 8.7 %


8.0 oz Oats, Flaked (1.0 SRM) Grain 4 4.3 %


1.00 oz Tettnang (Tettnang Tettnager) [4.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 5 12.6 IBUs


1.00 Items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 mins) Fining 6 -


1.00 oz Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 7 8.6 IBUs


1.0 pkg SafBrew Specialty Ale (DCL/Fermentis #T-58) Yeast 8 -





I fully recognize that five days in a keg is not a lot for conditioning, but I should be getting some semblance of the flavor at this point. Any help is appreciated. My next thought beyond changing yeast is adding orange peels or coriander in last ten minutes of boil so go from there.


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[fantomlord]

Hefeweizens are best young, so your short time in the keg probably isn't the issue. I think your main issue is yeast. I would change only the yeast next time.
try this:
http://www.northernbrewer.com/shop/wyeast-weihenstephan-wheat.html (leave yourself plenty of headspace)
or maybe this:
http://www.northernbrewer.com/shop/safale-wb-06.html

 

[drthrob]

That is what I figured. Thanks for the input. Have you had any experience adding orange peels and/or coriander in the boil?


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[Pie_Man]

You can certainly add coriander and maybe play around with yeast strain and fermentation temps. It looks like you're going for a Belgian Witbier-like beer based on the yeast strain.

With your grain bill, you could also change to a neutral yeast like US-05 or WLP001, and add some more hops to make an American style wheat beer.

 

[WileECoyote]

That is what I figured. Thanks for the input. Have you had any experience adding orange peels and/or coriander in the boil?


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Hello, I use orange peels in mine, I tried coriander but I my taste is coriander sensitive so I don't use it, instead I use real lemon juice at 1 min, only 1 lemon in a 5 gal batch for mild lemon flavor, for me coriander has a harsh lemon bite to it, and the lemon juice makes it have smooth lemon aid flavor in the beer.

We have just tried orange peel zest in a batch but its not ready to drink yet, so far from the samples, Im thinking I should have gone with squeezing the juice from the oranges and adding it at 1 min, so far it has that orange bite kinda like the coriander had, and its very orange flavored.

With your current beer you could add a lemon or orange slice to it, that should help with flavor till you get another batch done.

Like Pie Man said, I Also like the WLP-001 for my wheat beers, I really like the way its just clean and lets the beers flavors come forward instead of being yeasty tasting, I just don't think I would add more hops to it though.

Also if you want to add more flavor to your recipe you could go with Maris Otter instead of the 2 Row, that will add some nice flavor, I almost always substitute MO in-place of US 2 row, to me it just adds such a better flavor to my beers.

Cheers

 

[drthrob]

Hello, I use orange peels in mine, I tried coriander but I my taste is coriander sensitive so I don't use it, instead I use real lemon juice at 1 min, only 1 lemon in a 5 gal batch for mild lemon flavor, for me coriander has a harsh lemon bite to it, and the lemon juice makes it have smooth lemon aid flavor in the beer.



We have just tried orange peel zest in a batch but its not ready to drink yet, so far from the samples, Im thinking I should have gone with squeezing the juice from the oranges and adding it at 1 min, so far it has that orange bite kinda like the coriander had, and its very orange flavored.



With your current beer you could add a lemon or orange slice to it, that should help with flavor till you get another batch done.



Cheers

Yeah, I chopped up an orange last night and threw it in a pint glass before pouring the beer over it. I should have known better than to experiment with an untried yeast on a new brew style for me. Lesson learned. Thankfully, all-grain is a cheap way to brew and I didn't just spend $50 on an extract to have to throw it out.


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[WileECoyote]

Yeah, I chopped up an orange last night and threw it in a pint glass before pouring the beer over it. I should have known better than to experiment with an untried yeast on a new brew style for me. Lesson learned. Thankfully, all-grain is a cheap way to brew and I didn't just spend $50 on an extract to have to throw it out.


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Another thing to remember is that with a lot of yeast the longer you leave it, the less yeast flavor you will get in that beer, time makes a huge difference on a simple amber recipe I brew for my wife with kolsch yeast, it needs 3 1/2 months before going on tap to be any good.

So maybe just give it some time and it just might end up being great !

Cheers

 

[johnmac22]

To add to what wileEcoyote said...you can use marris otter for more malt flavor. I have also seen many individuals split their base malt between 2-row and a pilsner malt to add more biscuit flavor


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[peanasky]

Hefeweizens are best young, so your short time in the keg probably isn't the issue. I think your main issue is yeast. I would change only the yeast next time.
try this:
http://www.northernbrewer.com/shop/wyeast-weihenstephan-wheat.html (leave yourself plenty of headspace)
or maybe this:
http://www.northernbrewer.com/shop/safale-wb-06.html

I will second the weihenstephan yeast. It throws off some wonderful esters during fermentation.

As far as orange peel, if you're doing it yourself, make sure to JUST get orange peel. If you get pith (the white stuff) in your beer, it can add a nasty astringent bitterness. Trust me, it sucks.

 

[WileECoyote]

Hello, to update you guys on the orange hefe with the orange zest in it (no pith), it has really turned out very very good, personally I still think I would become a great beer with squeezed orange added at flameout instead of zest.

We took 2 growlers of it to friends house last night and it was very well liked by everyone, it was all gone is a short amount of time, everyone said it was a very easy drinking flavorful beer.

Back on 4-30-14 this beer was extreme orange harsh flavor, now it has just a nice orange flavor and also has a very well rounded wheat beer flavor, highly drinkable.

Cheers

 

[Clarke]

not sure why it would be bland, I use T-58 and find it has lots of flavor, and an oz of cascade should shine, the only thing that I would wonder is if Cascade and T-58 would compete with each other?