Belgian Dark Strong Ale Westvleteren 12 Clone - Multiple Award Winner

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jtp137 said:
Those that pitch fresh krausen what temp is the fresh yeast when you pitch? Would you need to cool it to the temp of the wort if the wort is 65 and the krausen is in the 70s would that shock the yeast
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Pitching krausen within 2-3F of the wort seems about the variance limit. We use a small wine cooler to normalize krausen temps before pitching.
 
image.jpg1_zpsljlgmkr5.jpg


I just took my second medal with this recipe! Thanks, again!

-Mike
 
Just finished brewing this. Hit 1112 and very excited! 1 gallon reduction was an interesting challenge and smelled well worth the trouble.
 
orangehero said:
Swing tops may be a bad idea for long term aging due to their oxygen permeability, especially if you use silicone gaskets.
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I did not know that about silicone gaskets.

I'm glad I learned this the easy way, that is before I used the silicone replacement washers I purchased. I guess I'll toss them and buy rubber gaskets for this beer.
 
I would recommend using crown caps. Even the rubber gaskets aren't that great and some of the ones I have never truly lose their rubbery smell. I love using the silicone gasket flip-tops, I just reserve them for styles that are best consumed fresh.

Now although Westvleteren, as far as I know, only uses crown finish bottles, many other Trappist breweries use cork finish bottles. Corks are of course more gas permeable than crown caps, but probably not as much as a synthetic rubber gasket. It can be argued that some amount of oxidation is desirable, but that also depends on what kind of timeline you expect to consume the beer.

Personally I bottle half of the batch in the 11.2 oz bottles that Belgian beers come in for individual consumption, and the other half of the batch in crown finish 750ml amber punted Champagne bottles for sharing with friends.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?p=7233673#post7233673
 
Bottled mine today! Og right in the mark: 1090! Fg 1014! Can't wait to try one!
 
Brewed this today. Hit the temps but not the points. 1.057 pre boil, 1.082 final after syrup.
LBS was out of 530 so I made a starter from wlp500.

Used two fermentors for headroom.
I dont have a temp. control for the ferms, but seem to be in the 79-80 range now 24 hours later.
After a week I'll combine them into a single fermentor.
Worried my 1.082 wont produce well.
Anyone have success on this beer after messing up?
Any advice?

Thanks
 
Colorado68 said:
Brewed this today. Hit the temps but not the points. 1.057 pre boil, 1.082 final after syrup.
LBS was out of 530 so I made a starter from wlp500.

Used two fermentors for headroom.
I dont have a temp. control for the ferms, but seem to be in the 79-80 range now 24 hours later.
After a week I'll combine them into a single fermentor.
Worried my 1.082 wont produce well.
Anyone have success on this beer after messing up?
Any advice?

Thanks
Click to expand...

Actually with WLP500 you'll have something very close to a dark Chimay Grande Reserve. You should end up with a nice Belgian quad. Keep it fermenting on the cool side, (63-70F).
 
On the sad news front, it seems the european importer of candi syrup is utterly useless.

My lhbs has been trying to reorder for over half a year now and there never seems to be stock there.....
 
:
CSI said:
Actually with WLP500 you'll have something very close to a dark Chimay Grande Reserve. You should end up with a nice Belgian quad. Keep it fermenting on the cool side, (63-70F).
Click to expand...

Thanks for thee feedback CSI.

After 5 days it's already at 1.012 and in the secondary. Seemed very strong and guessing that it produced fusels. This may end up being on the dryer side.
 
Colorado68 said:
:

Thanks for thee feedback CSI.

After 5 days it's already at 1.012 and in the secondary. Seemed very strong and guessing that it produced fusels. This may end up being on the dryer side.
Click to expand...

Yes, it sounds like it. WLP500 seems to like a cooler fermentation. At 1.012 I might consider crashing it to remove as much active yeast as possible and then hope the fusels will age out, (they normally will).
 
I'm getting geared up to brew this in 9 days. Got the WLP530, 3lbs of D-180 candi syrup, hops, and Servomyces getting delivered from Northern Brewer tomorrow. Will get the grain from the local shop.

Will likely start the yeast starter about 7 days before because I will most likely have to do a 2 step starter to get enough yeast (only have a 2 liter flask).

My main concern at the moment is my fermenter. I have either a 6.5 gallon glass carboy or 6.5 gallon bucket. I will use a blow off tube...but will this be sufficient or am I going to lose a lot of yeast through blow off? If necessary I guess I could scale the recipe down a bit but I'd prefer not to.

Edit: I also have a secondary question (literally)...for tertiary fermentation...does that mean racking off the yeast cake a second time (so transfer from primary to secondary, then transfer again?). Is it recommended to do this or considered optional?
 
decoleur said:
Mmacdon, you might want to consider fermcap-s. It will suppress the foam generation.
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I always use around 8 drops of fermcap-s during the boil...Do you suggest I drop some straight into the fermenter as well?
 
So question about d-180 shelf life. I bought 6 lbs last winter to do a 10g batch but only ended up doing 5. I still have 3 packs left over that are now about 10 months old. Any good or should I get new? Hate to waste them.
 
I had an old d-180, about that old. It was slightly crystallized but still tasted good and did a good job. Just be sure to,shake well and make sure you get the full contents of the pack, don't lose out on the crystals. I'll let CSI comment on whether it's bad for brewing, in my experience it was fine. Could it have been better to use fresher product? Yes probably. Will it be bad to use? Doubt it.
 
mmacdon3 said:
I'm getting geared up to brew this in 9 days. Got the WLP530, 3lbs of D-180 candi syrup, hops, and Servomyces getting delivered from Northern Brewer tomorrow. Will get the grain from the local shop.

Will likely start the yeast starter about 7 days before because I will most likely have to do a 2 step starter to get enough yeast (only have a 2 liter flask).

My main
moment is my fermenter. I have either a 6.5 gallon glass carboy or 6.5 gallon bucket. I will use a blow off tube...but will this be sufficient or am I going to lose a lot of yeast through blow off? If necessary I guess I could scale the recipe down a bit but I'd prefer not to.

Edit: I also have a secondary question (literally)...for tertiary fermentation...does that mean racking off the yeast cake a second time (so transfer from primary to secondary, then transfer again?). Is it recommended to do this or considered optional?
Click to expand...

Why not split your stuff into two fermenters, that should give you the headroom.
 
CSI said:
They are useable.
Click to expand...

To reiterate the point, anything that's almost 100% sugar has a very long shelf life. Unless you stored the packs opened, and next to stinky/gross stuff, you should not see an appreciable drop in quality.

Also I wanted to add my voice, I used your recipe but used Belle Saison and 3068 Hefeweizen yeast in a 50/50 split. It's delicious and not because of the yeast (well yes it's the yeast) but the recipe is perfect.
 
mmacdon3 said:
I always use around 8 drops of fermcap-s during the boil...Do you suggest I drop some straight into the fermenter as well?
Click to expand...

I put 3.5 gallons into a 6 gallon better bottle and needed every bit of the space. It didn't blow over but the Krausen was up to the neck. I don't use fermcap. I plan on getting a 10 gallon spiedel so I can do 5 gallon big brews in them.

If you use fermcap in the fermenter it would probably be good. Not sure if you would lose too much yeast if you didn't, but I wouldn't be comfortable with it.
 
Just a quick note that i brewed this recipe last weekend. I had a boil over (facepalm after years of doing this it still happens) and so my OG was low at 1.080. I added back 1/2 gallon of water. I also had a small blow off despite having like 2 feet of head space but it was minor. Pulled a sample today to check the gravity..1.006..yikes..so I pulled it from my fermwarp and am letting it cool naturally in the basement to put it to secondary but I may just go right to tertiary..What do you guys think would you do that? I am actually nt a big fan of trappist ales or at least the ones ive tried (never had a westy though. the sample was hot but was still flavorful and plum raisiny sweet. I got high hopes for it still despite the couple of "errors". As an FYI I checked it with both a refractometer and my hydrometer and both were right around there
 
So I finally got this brewed yesterday. Stuck to the original recipe but just bumped up the grain bill a bit to account for poor efficiency. That didn't quite work though because my pre boil gravity ended up at 1.055.

On the fly decided to boil an extra 15 min and added both .5lb of extra light DME and an extra .5 lb of the D-180 candi syrup at flameout. Final OG ended up at 1.090 so at least I was happy with that.

Put around 5.5 gallons into my 6 gallon fermenter with fermcap, hit it with pure O2 for 2 min and pitched an estimated 350 billion cells. Also was able to program my stc-1000+ so it should take me through the whole temperature profile with ramping without me having to touch it.

Started bubbling at 12 hours and now 24 hours later it is very active and the krausen has already reached the blow off tube. Hopefully I don't lose too much beer.

IMG_20151219_141522.jpg
 
mmacdon3 said:
Started bubbling at 12 hours and now 24 hours later it is very active and the krausen has already reached the blow off tube. Hopefully I don't lose too much beer.
Click to expand...

Expect some very major yeast activity! Fermcap doesn't help much (I used about a quarter bottle without it helping much. I resolved the issue by inserting the maximum size blow out tube tube (about 1-1/4" O.D.) directly in the mouth of the carboy (forget using rubber bungs) and elevating the end of the tube as high as possible into a can of water. Make sure the end of the tube is quite a bit higher than the level of wort in the carboy (several feet). Otherwise much of it will just siphon out. I have a picture of this setup somewhere back in the thread.
 
Bottoms_Up said:
Expect some very major yeast activity! Fermcap doesn't help much (I used about a quarter bottle without it helping much. I resolved the issue by inserting the maximum size blow out tube tube (about 1-1/4" O.D.) directly in the mouth of the carboy (forget using rubber bungs) and elevating the end of the tube as high as possible into a can of water. Make sure the end of the tube is quite a bit higher than the level of wort in the carboy (several feet). Otherwise much of it will just siphon out. I have a picture of this setup somewhere back in the thread.
Click to expand...

Absolutely. Also, consider using a sterile blow-off container so the capture can be re-introduced after high krausen. (We use 17.5 gal jacketed fermenters for 10 gallon batches and still get blow-off each time).
 
My lhbs does not carry Brewer s Gold...has anyone used Nugget as a replacement?
 
Bottoms_Up said:
Expect some very major yeast activity! Fermcap doesn't help much (I used about a quarter bottle without it helping much. I resolved the issue by inserting the maximum size blow out tube tube (about 1-1/4" O.D.) directly in the mouth of the carboy (forget using rubber bungs) and elevating the end of the tube as high as possible into a can of water. Make sure the end of the tube is quite a bit higher than the level of wort in the carboy (several feet). Otherwise much of it will just siphon out. I have a picture of this setup somewhere back in the thread.
Click to expand...

Great advice...wish I would have listened

View attachment 1450670227746.jpg
 
Yeah I should have done something like that from the start. My plan was just to keep an eye on it this weekend and make changes if necessary but I had to leave town just as it was getting going...so wasn't too surprised to see that mess when I got back.

Got it cleaned up and a positive note is I didn't lose too much beer...will still be able to completely fill the 5 gallon carboy for secondary. My main concern is that the majority of that blow off was yeast...lots of it. I hope it doesn't affect my attenuation. It's currently at 70 degrees and slowly ramping to 80 over the course of this week. It's still bubbling but not nearly as active as the last couple days. Just hope I get close to the final gravity.
 
mmacdon3 said:
I hope it doesn't affect my attenuation. It's currently at 70 degrees and slowly ramping to 80 over the course of this week. It's still bubbling but not nearly as active as the last couple days. Just hope I get close to the final gravity.
Click to expand...

If I recall from the lengthy discussion on this and related threads, many have lost yeast through their blow-off tubes, and still ended up with excellent beer. I also lost some yeast through a much smaller diameter blow-off tube, before I rigged it up with the higher diameter and much elevated tube - and it didn't affect the attenuation.

The other great option is CSI's solution of capturing the blow-off in a sterilized container and adding it back later when the fermentation slows down somewhat.
 
Glad I decided to read this post as I just purchased everything today for this recipe. Don't want to learn the hard way like mmacdon. Guess I'll head to the hardware store tomorrow to get larger tubing.
 
CSI: where did you buy your flask parts for your Krausen trap? I've searched the Internet up and down and can't find those parts. I would love to set a system up like that.
 
Cutterman said:
CSI: where did you buy your flask parts for your Krausen trap? I've searched the Internet up and down and can't find those parts. I would love to set a system up like that.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure it's custom built, but I'm definitely sure CSI will respond.
 
Quick question; I purchased 3 pounds of D-180 for recipe and one is different. Does anyone know what the difference is?

image.jpg
 
I brewed my first batch of this beer today using the recipe on the first page of the thread.

I have been using a new kettle, and I only evaporate off .5 gallon per hour instead of the 1 gallon per hour I was hoping for, so I ended up with ~6.5 gallons at 1.080 using three lbs of the d-180 instead of 5.5 gallons at 1.090 using 2.5 lbs of the d-180.

Also had to move 3/4 oz of each the mid and late hop addition to the 60 minute addition so that I could hit the IBU target from the recipe.

I expect that all will be well though. Has anyone tried this brew at four months into aging?
 

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