jtp137
Well-Known Member
Its not starchy at all and not sweet. Just the classic green apple of a young beer, but I can taste the caramel, dark fruit and complexity
6 to 8 weeks at 60 degrees or 6 to 8 weeks at 50
If the batch is still pushing gravity then 60F. The brightening crash is 50F. Because this ale is so dark, the brightening time can be variable.
I really beed to get a bottling hydrometer its hard to tell over a few points.
I followed the recipe to a T from the first page, next time I may increase the pale or throw a 1/4 pound of melanoidin malt to push the toasted bread flavor and simulate a decoction
We ran a trial in October last year using only Dingeman's Pale. It's much more bready than the import and was well worth the experiment. It's now my favorite variation of this ale. I'd leave the Melanoidin and go all Pale IMHO.
Hmm interesting. All pale malt. What about something like 75%pale 25%pilsner
CSI Looking through the old thread it looks like a lot of people would pitch at 65 and let the yeast rise naturally to 80 and hold the temp until it reached around 80% attenuation. Some said that it hit 80 in 36 hours
Is there a reason why you pitch at 65 and ramp evenly over 7 days till you hit 80. Is the first method susceptible to fusel alcohols. Or does the first method give too much fruity esters not characteristic of a true westy 12
I brewed for the first time this just before Christmas with my brother-in-law, and it's now done with the 2 month aging process at 50F and I'm ready to bottle. I haven't bottled much I went right to kegs so I have a few questions.
I read the great summary of tips on page 3 by Bottoms_up and it seems like I have some options:
I could carb just with corn sugar, but others report using CSI'S D-180 or CSI's Golden (clear) syrup. It seems like 2.5-2.6 volumes in a good target. Also I see I should re-pitch about 75 billion cells for my 5 gallon batch.
Any advice or tips? I just want to make sure I get proper carbonation and don't pooch up this beer which has signs of being spectacular at this very-last step.
Using D-180 is probably the best option, but I went with dextrose so I wouldn't have to store a partly opened package of D-180. I have kegs but decided to bottle, since this is a beer you want to age, and I didn't want to tie up a keg for such a long period. This is the approach I used:
I boiled 1-1/4 cups of water in a small pot. When it came to a boil, I added 172 grams of dextrose (corn sugar) and stirred. Theoretically, this should give 2.8 volumes of CO2 @ 70 F. Let it boil for 10-15 minutes. Then cool it to room temperature and add it to a sanitized fermentation pail. Siphon the beer into the pail.
In the meantime I added about 50 ml of pre-boiled and cooled water to a small sanitized pot and heated it to about 120 F. I took about 50 ml of this and added it to a small sanitized measuring cup (e.g. half liter). When it cooled to about 110 F I sprinkled about 1/4 - 1/2 package of EC-1118 yeast on the surface, covered with sanitized plastic wrap, and let it sit for 15 minutes. Then I stirred the yeast and added it to the beer in the pail, and stirred it very gently.
Then I bottled the beer. Let it bottle condition at room temperature for at least two weeks. Try one (or bottle a few in PET bottles and feel for rock hardness). If not ready, leave for another week. Then store the bottles in a cool environment.
I'm very happy with the resultant amount of pressure in the bottles.
Hey guys,
Question on the long secondary... I brewed a double batch of this back on February 14th, and am itching to get my fermentation chamber back for other brews, the pipeline is running thin!
I am thinking of brewing a couple batches on easter weekend, which would mean bottling this brew after a secondary of 4 weeks at 50f plus the two weeks in primary, so 6 weeks post brew date total.
If I bottle at that point, how much would that affect the outcome, especially since I am planning on letting it sit in bottles another 6 months before even trying it?
Thanks for the input!
I brewed this 10 days ago and followed the CSI technique of slowly ramping up from 64 to 80 over 7 days. I held it at 80 for 24 hours and then killed the heat. I just checked and I'm currently at 1.009 with the hydrometer and the refractometer in agreement. I was shocked at how good the sample tasted. I figured with a beer this big and it only being +10d it would not taste very pleasing, but I was pleasantly surprised. Very little heat from the alcohol and it has a clean/simple Belgian fruitiness about it. I'm sure the more complex dark stone fruit flavors and spice will appear with age.
I apologize if this has already been addressed in a previous post, but does anyone have suggestions for those who can't bulk condition at 50F? I understand that no matter what I do, it won't be a perfect match to the recipe. Should I go ahead and rack to a secondary? Should I plan to bottle next week and then condition for a year? In bottles, I could probably move it all to a friends cellar that would stay around 50 for the next couple of months.
Thanks for all the work that went into creating this incredibly helpful forum post!
I brewed this 10 days ago and followed the CSI technique of slowly ramping up from 64 to 80 over 7 days. I held it at 80 for 24 hours and then killed the heat. I just checked and I'm currently at 1.009 with the hydrometer and the refractometer in agreement. I was shocked at how good the sample tasted. I figured with a beer this big and it only being +10d it would not taste very pleasing, but I was pleasantly surprised. Very little heat from the alcohol and it has a clean/simple Belgian fruitiness about it. I'm sure the more complex dark stone fruit flavors and spice will appear with age.
I apologize if this has already been addressed in a previous post, but does anyone have suggestions for those who can't bulk condition at 50F? I understand that no matter what I do, it won't be a perfect match to the recipe. Should I go ahead and rack to a secondary? Should I plan to bottle next week and then condition for a year? In bottles, I could probably move it all to a friends cellar that would stay around 50 for the next couple of months.
Thanks for all the work that went into creating this incredibly helpful forum post!
I usually go straight from the primary to bottles (or keg). It will age well in bottles, although there are bound to be subtle differences than following the recipe exactly.
I admire your patience if you are aging for a year. It will be tasting great before that.
Thanks Kee. Do you think additional yeast will be needed if I'm bottling this early? Would cold crashing be wise? I could stick the carboy outside for a couple of cold nights which would cool it down quite a bit.
Edit: As for letting it age a whole year, that will only work if I let the wife hide the bottles. ; )
Thanks Kee. Do you think additional yeast will be needed if I'm bottling this early? Would cold crashing be wise? I could stick the carboy outside for a couple of cold nights which would cool it down quite a bit.
Edit: As for letting it age a whole year, that will only work if I let the wife hide the bottles. ; )
Been looking for a good Westy recipe for a while now. Am trying this one soon. I did a Belgian tour and was able to go to the Abby (even did the mass with the monks) then headed over to the store and got 2 six pack gift sets of the 12. There is never a guarantee you can get the 12 if you go. They may not have it on hand and may just have the others available. Felt fortunate that day.
Here it is back home. Did a taste test with the 2 of them. Closer than you would think (St. Bernardus was actually started from a monk from St. Sixtus so may explain the closeness).
I actually came across this thread and the other large Westy 12 thread when I was looking for info on making a St. Bernardus abt 12 clone. After checking the threads out I decided to I'd give the Westy 12 clone a try. I haven't had a Westy in years, but I love Belgian Dark Strongs, so I figured I'd give it a try.
I made it this morning, the only deviation from the recipe is I used 2lbs of D-180 instead of 2.5lbs, and I'm using Wyeast 3787. My OG came short, I only hit 1.082. I'm hoping that it will still turn out good. I've got it at 64F right now, and will ramp it up through the next week.
I grossly over-estimated the amount of trub (the Westy has very little trub) and the amount of water, and as a result I ended up with about 21 liters rather than 19. I decided to dilute it enough to make it up to 23 liters, so my S.G. ended up at 1.079. It still turned out fantastic - maybe even better than a Westy since the taste is a little more subtle. I call mine a Westy 10 rather than a 12
I just made another realization. I assumed that my efficiency would remain the same as with my lower gravity beers, but after some recent analysis, that doesn't seem to be the case. I believe that my efficiency drops at least 8 percentage points with higher gravity beers.
Has anyone else noticed a drop of efficiency with higher gravity beer? That is certainly something to take into account when calculating grain amounts.
With all the sugar and the boil down you should be getting a good efficiency. I hit 91%
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