Warminster MO test - 100% (or + 3% C77 + torrefied wheat), Fuller's hopping.

[Gadjobrinus]

Getting in some Warminster MO, eager to try it again in English bitters. I used to use it a ton but it's been years and I've forgotten everything in terms of sense memory and brewing qualities.

So, wanting to test it for bitters. Thinking of 100% Warminster for OG 1.052, and a hopping schedule that closely approximates Fuller's - Challenger for bittering, then 3 min. before knockout/WP/30 min. hop stand of challenger, northdown and EKG for 41 IBU, and thus a lower BU:GU than I usually do for bitters, in this case, 80% (v. 85-90% usually).

What do you think, for this purpose? Some alternative thoughts:

1. Thought of including just 3% of C77. I use it all the time in most of my bitters, along with inverts 2 & 3, and Baird's C135-165, in some combination or the other (not all in every recipe, either) for various bitters. This, along with 4-5% torrefied wheat for the northern ales. So, keeping it muted but adding in 3% C77, and/or 3% in wheat.

2. Really wanting to keep hopping "clean," so am also thinking of a single hop - challenger, perhaps even EKG only.

3. Very fond of First Gold for strong bitter and will eventually be using it once settling on the base malt. That said, it's a pretty definite contribution. Don't want to detract from the malt, here. Thoughts?

Thoughts on any of the above appreciated.

 

[DBhomebrew]

You're testing various MOs with minimal differences between. I'd keep to 100% base with no hopping later than 30m. You're not concerned with covering up the malt, you're concerned with covering up the differences between the malts. The latter is much more subtle than the former.

 

[huckdavidson]

Chewing on some of each variety that you're interested in and documenting what you taste would certainly be headed in the right direction.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

You're testing various MOs with minimal differences between. I'd keep to 100% base with no hopping later than 30m. You're not concerned with covering up the malt, you're concerned with covering up the differences between the malts. The latter is much more subtle than the former.

Thanks, you're right of course. I'm muddying up the waters. On the hopping, over a 90 minute boil, you're saying no additions past 30 minutes in - in essence, nothing but bittering, right? Likely just go with Challenger.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

Chewing on some of each variety that you're interested in and documenting what you taste would certainly be headed in the right direction.

Thank you, good reminder. Something as basic as it is I'd completely forgotten to just do. I do the same with various sea-salts (e.g., fleur de sel from Brittany v. Maldon flakes, etc.).

 

[DBhomebrew]

T-30m. 30m before flameout. Yeah, pretty much bittering only.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

T-30m. 30m before flameout. Yeah, pretty much bittering only.

Thanks. If bittering only, why not just go with less hops, earlier, for the same nominal ibu's? e.g., 1.2 oz Challenger at 90 min. gives me 41, and 2.6 oz at T-30 gets me 41. Lot more hops, more "character" too. What are your thoughts?

 

[DBhomebrew]

All I'm saying is boil whatever hops at whatever amount for at least 30m. Minimize hop flavor/aroma. For this, yeah, just throw whatever amount of whatever English hops you have on hand at 60 or 90m to arrive at 80-85% BU:GU. There's not much of difference between IBUs at 60 vs 90.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

All I'm saying is boil whatever hops at whatever amount for at least 30m. Minimize hop flavor/aroma. For this, yeah, just throw whatever amount of whatever English hops you have on hand at 60 or 90m to arrive at 80-85% BU:GU. There's not much of difference between IBUs at 60 vs 90.

Gotcha. Thanks.

So 100% Warminster MO, OG 1.052, single-infusion at 152F, single-hop (Challenger) at 90 min. for 41 IBU/82% BU:GU, Wyeast 1469 off of top-cropped.

Thanks guys.

 

[DBhomebrew]

You may want to reconsider the yeast for an easier to handle, more reliable, neutral variety. I really liked some of my 1469 batches. Others, not so much. Either way, its presence was always upfront. If I were doing this, I'd go with a London or even Notty.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

You may want to reconsider the yeast for an easier to handle, more reliable, neutral variety. I really liked some of my 1469 batches. Others, not so much. Either way, its presence was always upfront. If I were doing this, I'd go with a London or even Notty.

It's a good suggestion and I get the logic - but here I think we get into the kind of balancing act that can take place, when trying to isolate out components in a system. By which I mean, I use the 1469 in all these bitters, so perceptions, I think, of any of the base malts can't entirely be taken out without thinking of their interplay with this admittedly characterful yeast. Something clean like Notty will definitely point up differences in the malts, one would think, but I wonder if we've reached the usefulness of the isolation, given each of the malts may be very different from one another in the context of the "house" yeast of 1469 (and minerally water, for that matter).

Does that make sense?

 

[DBhomebrew]

If I were doing this,

Key phrase there. Looking forward to your results.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

Key phrase there. Looking forward to your results.

No, I get it, and the logic is also sound to me. Just something to think on. Thanks.