Unboxing the Nano from CO Brewing

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molson said:
How hard is it to change it out to the new one? Do you have to adjust anything with the PID?
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Horseflesh said:
Those were my questions too.

The stock element is assembled with a triclamp holding the element into thou housing, so it looks easy to take apart... Might be harder to put it back together... Looking forward to someone else's pictures. :)
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It won't go in the stock housing the way it comes. Going to cut the first triclover off tomorrow where CBS welds it instead of using a second clamp and I think it'll go in just fine.

fireantz said:
Tried searching this to find it but what is the biggest grain bill / OG you can do for a 10/11 gallon batch in in the 20 gal kettle setup?
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I did a 31# 11 gallon batch and have done 3 30# 15.5 gallon batches. I did burn the element on two of them though, hence the new element going in to hopefully avoid that all together.

That Mash Manifold from SS Bretech looks like it would definitely help this thing big time. Will be ordering one of those for sure. Edit: Have one on the way.
 
Still waiting for my 25 gal "Down Under" should be getting it mid February :). Looking for recommendations on the tubing to buy and how much I'll need?
 
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If you're getting the PLC remember you need a 3-prong 240V and a grounded 120V, both with GFCI. Non-PLC units can come with one 4-prong 240V, the PLC version is built to a different UL standard and it will come with 2 power cords.
 
Horseflesh said:
That manifold does look nice. With one recirc return as provided, I'm pretty sure the mash is not very evenly heated. I get good flow out of the pump but motion seems to be concentrated in the area around the return... no surprise. Multiple points of return would have to help.

http://www.ssbrewtech.com/products/re-circulation-manifold-for-infussion-mash-tuns
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Will be interested to hear how this works. I have no complaints with standard set up but looks like less babysitting with this.
 
The SS manifold is nice and I built one similar that I use in my 10 gallon cooler to sparge. Here is something to think about. CBS's claim of high efficiency seems to rely on the fact that the stainless steel tube that recirculates the wort is suppose to keep the entire mash moving. It sounds like that is not happening for some of you guys. Reaction Brewing, you guys are seem to be really maxing out the 20 gallon's ability with 30 lbs of grain. Anyone try a much thinner mash to see if they can get the entire mash basket in motion?

Take a look at 2:22 portion of this video. This is the sparge method that I think may help with efficiency with the CBS basket if it is raised slowly as demonistrated in the video.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHXCcxPRoJ0[/ame]

Has Tim from CBS ever mentioned what the maximum recommended grain bill for each kettle size is? From the looks of the videos, I don't think Tim designed the system to handle a mash that is the consistency of oatmeal.

Thoughts?

I am waiting to place an order for either the CBS system or the Brew-Boss depending on some of you guys tweaking with the CBS system.
 
Horseflesh said:
If you're getting the PLC remember you need a 3-prong 240V and a grounded 120V, both with GFCI. Non-PLC units can come with one 4-prong 240V, the PLC version is built to a different UL standard and it will come with 2 power cords.
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I'm getting the non-PLC version. If anyone has pictures of their electrical hookups I would appreciate seeing them.
 
Irish-Brewer said:
From the looks of the videos, I don't think Tim designed the system to handle a mash that is the consistency of oatmeal.
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I feel like I would need the mash to have twice as much water for the pump to have any chance of keeping it all moving. I can see why @02RedWS6TA has experimented with a stirring system.

But, for any BIAB-style system I do not see how you would get the mash thin enough without adding a lot more water, which would require a longer boil time.
 
jahlinux said:
I'm getting the non-PLC version. If anyone has pictures of their electrical hookups I would appreciate seeing them.
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I believe CBS should provide you with a bare 4-conductor power cable. Tim told me they did not put plugs on the cables since there are options for how you hook them up. A NEMA 14-30 4-conductor plug should do the trick:

nema14-30r.jpg


Do verify the exact specs of your power cable with Tim though. (They told me what to get and it turned out to be wrong because either they overlooked the PLC on my order, or they changed how they built them after my order was taken. I expected to have one 4-conductor plug as above, but it turned out that I needed one 120V and one 240V 3-prong.)
 
Horseflesh said:
I feel like I would need the mash to have twice as much water for the pump to have any chance of keeping it all moving. I can see why @02RedWS6TA has experimented with a stirring system.

But, for any BIAB-style system I do not see how you would get the mash thin enough without adding a lot more water, which would require a longer boil time.
Click to expand...

I am trying to find someone who has experimented with the system well enough to be able to say what the maximum OG or final abv of a batch has been that had a thin mash to recirculate (as in Tim's demo video) and required a 60 minute boil. If a 6 to 6.5 abv beer can be made with the thin mash and high efficiency (with a stock set up from CBS) then I think I would be happy with the CBS system.

Brew-Boss's COFI basket is interesting but wonder if wort channeling is an issue.
 
Irish-Brewer said:
I am trying to find someone who has experimented with the system well enough to be able to say what the maximum OG or final abv of a batch has been that had a thin mash to recirculate (as in Tim's demo video) and required a 60 minute boil. If a 6 to 6.5 abv beer can be made with the thin mash and high efficiency (with a stock set up from CBS) then I think I would be happy with the CBS system.

Brew-Boss's COFI basket is interesting but wonder if wort channeling is an issue.
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I have videos posted of 11 gallon brews that end up in the 5's no problem on a mostly stock system. You need something to throttle the output of the pump, mag drives should always have some pressure on them. So add a 3 way or a valve on the output of the pump.

As long as it doesn't have oat* in it you should be fine. If it has oatmeal get ready to stir and add a ton of rice hulls. I add 1lb of rice hulls with anything wheat or flaked oats heavy.

Out of 6 I believe 10-11 gallon brews I'd guess 4-5 of them we just sit there drinking during the mash once the bed is set. Pale ale, IPA, stout, Porter, should all be fine unless you want to add the oats or wheat to them. Once you do that all bets are off and experimentation will be needed.
 
CBS does advise a beta glucan rest whe using oats, too. I did this for the first time last brew. I didn't have any issues draining the basket, but it was also only about a pound of oats out of twelve, plus a half pound rice hulls.
 
Did my first brew on the system and overall things went really well. I went with a SMASH to keep it simple just 10 pounds of 2-row and crystal hops. Here on some notes and questions.
• I decided to try wet milling my grains, by adding about 90 grams of water to the grains 15 minutes before milling. I also used about a half pound of rice halls, and was able to run the pump at full speed the whole time. Had great circulation and didn’t get any scorching.
• I did notice that the actual temperate of the mash was about 5 degrees lower than the reading of the PID. I didn’t think the difference would be that much, with the good circulation I got. Maybe I need to shorten the length of the hose I’m using (3 feet) or just compensate by setting the PID higher. It did hold at the set temperature the whole time within .5 degrees
• I did only get 65% efficiency, I set my crush at .50, so might tighten that up next time. Or just use more grain, haven’t decided yet.
• Once I reached a boil I was able to lower the power of the element all the way down to 60 and kept a rolling boil. There was no scorching on the element at all.
• I didn’t get a great whirlpool but I think that was because I was running it through a counter flow chiller.
• How is everyone cleaning up? I thought it would be easier to just run water through the system and clean it in place however I had a hard time getting the sludge out of the kettle. I wanted to avoid taking everything off the kettle to hose it down, but maybe that’s the way to go?
 
I have done 4 batches on my Nano so far. Mash efficiencies of the first 3 were in the low-mid 70s, but batch 4 was 84% and I am not sure why! I double-milled at the LHBS (.045 gap), but I had double-milled at least one of the prior batches too. I did a beta-glucan rest (113F, 15 minutes) as well, which was a new step. Beats me.

For cleaning I have not found a better method than tearing down and hauling the kettle out to the lawn. I thought CIP might work but unless you get all the hop sludge out, it's hopeless. I suppose you could fill the kettle with water and pump all the debris out, then refill to CIP. I am not convinced that would be a time savings though.
 
I cut a trench in my basement and bought a small electric power washer. Big steps but totally worth it, clean up is quick and easy now.

Before that I just took it out and power washed it in the yard.
 
02RedWS6TA said:
I cut a trench in my basement and bought a small electric power washer. Big steps but totally worth it, clean up is quick and easy now.
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Sounds interesting, can you take a picture of your basement setup? Or do you already have a video of your cleanup process?
 
jahlinux said:
Sounds interesting, can you take a picture of your basement setup? Or do you already have a video of your cleanup process?
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There's video in my last couple brew days of the start of the trench. I'll try to do a separate one of clean up after the next brew day. I didn't get a chance to brew Wednesday like planned.

Trench is 10" wide and 72" long. Currently runs into the drainage tile from the house but I'll cement it in soon and actually have it as a real drain. I just don't have any time right now.
 
02RedWS6TA said:
There's video in my last couple brew days of the start of the trench. I'll try to do a separate one of clean up after the next brew day.
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That would be awesome. Thanks! I'll take a look at some of your resent videos. I have to really start getting serious about learning this system it's not much longer before mine shows up.
 
molson said:
•How is everyone cleaning up? I thought it would be easier to just run water through the system and clean it in place however I had a hard time getting the sludge out of the kettle. I wanted to avoid taking everything off the kettle to hose it down, but maybe that’s the way to go?
Click to expand...

I've mainly been hauling the kettle to the lawn too hose it off but I don't like this method. Last batch I added water that I saved from my immersion chiller and did most of the cleaning that way. I use a hop filter and drained nearly all the wort so it wasn't too bad. But I could never get all the particles out so I had to haul it over to the sink. I brew near the edge of my garage so I'm able to drain down the driveway which is nice.
 
Used the SS brewtech mash manifold tonight. By far the easiest mash so far but my efficiency was terrible. Was supposed to hit 1.055 and came in at 1.044 after boiling longer than planned plus doing a 164* mash out.

Also used the new element, worked great but the mash was about 2-3* below set point. No big deal using an instant read thermometer I just adjusted for it. Brew went well other than the efficiency being crap. I think I'm going to use a vfd on the agitator to slow it way down and set the mash manifold towards the bottom of the mash. See if I can get the best of both worlds.

In conclusion, with some practice the mash manifold definitely helped. No stuck mash, no stirring, nothing. 20 minute rest plus a 75 minute mash and I'd never had to touch it if I didn't want to. I did stir just to try and bring the efficiency up but it was circulating without me.
 
pretzelb said:
I've mainly been hauling the kettle to the lawn too hose it off but I don't like this method. Last batch I added water that I saved from my immersion chiller and did most of the cleaning that way. I use a hop filter and drained nearly all the wort so it wasn't too bad. But I could never get all the particles out so I had to haul it over to the sink. I brew near the edge of my garage so I'm able to drain down the driveway which is nice.
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After filling the fermentor, I pump as much out of the kettle as I can. I fill it with a few gallons of warm water and cleaner (I've been using Oxyclean) and circulate that through the whirlpool port. I then take a stainless steel scrubber and wash the gunk off the sides of the kettle. I pump that out of the kettle, rinse with clean water, again using the pump and whirlpool port. After I pump the rinse water out of the kettle, I use my wet/dry vacuum to suck up whatever gunk the whirlpool has collected in the middle of the kettle and any remaining water. This works well for me...
 
So what's the biggest grain bill someone has done? I know it can do 32lbs and it's still a decent mash consistency. My next recipe calls for 40lbs of grain, anyone push it yet?
 
Question for all of you using some sort of hop spider. I am looking at some from Arbor fab. How do they work for hop stands/ whirlpools? Do you still whirlpool?
 
jready said:
Question for all of you using some sort of hop spider. I am looking at some from Arbor fab. How do they work for hop stands/ whirlpools? Do you still whirlpool?
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I got one from Utah Biodiesel that hangs from the side. I can still hop stand if I want but it obviously gets in the way of the perfect whirlpool. My next batch is an 2x IPA so I will probably try a hop stand then. The other issue for me is I switched to an immersion chiller from Jaded and it will be crowded at the bottom of my kettle now. I will say the clean up is easier with the hop filter but with the new IC I probably don't need it.
 
pretzelb said:
I got one from Utah Biodiesel that hangs from the side. I can still hop stand if I want but it obviously gets in the way of the perfect whirlpool. My next batch is an 2x IPA so I will probably try a hop stand then. The other issue for me is I switched to an immersion chiller from Jaded and it will be crowded at the bottom of my kettle now. I will say the clean up is easier with the hop filter but with the new IC I probably don't need it.
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Great info thanks. I have been on the fence about it. I make a lot of the NE IPAs so big hop stands. Clean up is a pain but I will take that over flavor loss!
 
jready said:
Great info thanks. I have been on the fence about it. I make a lot of the NE IPAs so big hop stands. Clean up is a pain but I will take that over flavor loss!
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I've done one big NE IPA and it turned out really well. Here is a review from a guy on another board I post on. As you can see he's reviewed over 2000 beers, I sent him two beers to review for me. This was the IPA.

And yeah, I'm always open to reviewing, I just passed 2000 of them on beeradvocate
I accidentally chose wrong and opened the wrong bottle (which btw, was excellent!) so I didn't end up having it that night and then I forgot to respond the next night when I had the IPA. It was really good! You really hit the style. Very aromatic and fruity in the nose. Big hop flavors well integrated without crazy bitterness (though it was definitely a little bit more bitter than you'd get from a trillium or something). Nice soft body, it was shockingly good. Easily the best homebrew I've ever had, by a mile. 90% as good as a trillium and on-par with most of the other local NE style IPAs IMO. Great job, I was really impressed - didn't know you were that good of a brewer!
 
02RedWS6TA said:
I've done one big NE IPA and it turned out really well. Here is a review from a guy on another board I post on. As you can see he's reviewed over 2000 beers, I sent him two beers to review for me. This was the IPA.



And yeah, I'm always open to reviewing, I just passed 2000 of them on beeradvocate

I accidentally chose wrong and opened the wrong bottle (which btw, was excellent!) so I didn't end up having it that night and then I forgot to respond the next night when I had the IPA. It was really good! You really hit the style. Very aromatic and fruity in the nose. Big hop flavors well integrated without crazy bitterness (though it was definitely a little bit more bitter than you'd get from a trillium or something). Nice soft body, it was shockingly good. Easily the best homebrew I've ever had, by a mile. 90% as good as a trillium and on-par with most of the other local NE style IPAs IMO. Great job, I was really impressed - didn't know you were that good of a brewer!
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Now you gotta post the recipe!!
 
jready said:
Great info thanks. I have been on the fence about it. I make a lot of the NE IPAs so big hop stands. Clean up is a pain but I will take that over flavor loss!
Click to expand...

Whether or not to use a hop filter is a tough decision. I was using a plate chiller and went with the hop filter after getting paranoid about getting debris in the chiller. With the immersion chiller I no longer have to worry about that so I suppose I could give up on the hop filter. But there are those who don't want hot break or hop material in the fermenter so then you are back to finding a way to filter the hops. At the end of day I think it comes down to personal annoyances.

For myself, I kept getting annoyed when I left too much in the kettle. Now with the IC I can drain all the way to the end. I bet that I lose some flavor by using the hop filter but I'm not sure if I could tell the difference. Even if I could it would have to be pretty big to get me to get over my annoyance with leaving too much in the kettle.

I think the ideal solution would involve an immersion chiller, a fermenter like the BrewTech Brew Bucket, and a custom filter for the top of the BB. If the filter sits on top of the Brew Bucket and filters as you drain from the kettle it should make everyone happy. The IC would avoid issues with clogging, you can freely add hops to the kettle and get the most from the hops, you are draining everything you can, and the filter is keeping the wort into the fermenter as free of debris as possible. Might get tricky with a 10g batch and making sure the filter is sanitary but other than that it sounds perfect in theory.
 
pretzelb said:
Whether or not to use a hop filter is a tough decision. I was using a plate chiller and went with the hop filter after getting paranoid about getting debris in the chiller. With the immersion chiller I no longer have to worry about that so I suppose I could give up on the hop filter. But there are those who don't want hot break or hop material in the fermenter so then you are back to finding a way to filter the hops. At the end of day I think it comes down to personal annoyances.



For myself, I kept getting annoyed when I left too much in the kettle. Now with the IC I can drain all the way to the end. I bet that I lose some flavor by using the hop filter but I'm not sure if I could tell the difference. Even if I could it would have to be pretty big to get me to get over my annoyance with leaving too much in the kettle.



I think the ideal solution would involve an immersion chiller, a fermenter like the BrewTech Brew Bucket, and a custom filter for the top of the BB. If the filter sits on top of the Brew Bucket and filters as you drain from the kettle it should make everyone happy. The IC would avoid issues with clogging, you can freely add hops to the kettle and get the most from the hops, you are draining everything you can, and the filter is keeping the wort into the fermenter as free of debris as possible. Might get tricky with a 10g batch and making sure the filter is sanitary but other than that it sounds perfect in theory.
Click to expand...


Thanks very helpful. I use a plate chiller and out of 10 super hoppy brews and a handful of others I have not had a clog. Now that I have totally jinxed myself I'm sure my Saturday brew will be the first.

What bugs me about the plate chiller is what stays in the plate chiller. Which IC are you using?
 
jready said:
Now you gotta post the recipe!!
Click to expand...

10lbs Maris otter
2lb white wheat
2lb carafoam
1lb flaked oats

1oz mosaic at 60. No bag
1oz citra and Amarillo each at 5
2oz each mosaic, citra and Amarillo for 30 minute steep at 180^
2oz each mosaic, citra and Amarillo dry hop on 4th day of fermentation

I used Wyeast 1056

Stolen from someone off here
 
jready said:
Thanks very helpful. I use a plate chiller and out of 10 super hoppy brews and a handful of others I have not had a clog. Now that I have totally jinxed myself I'm sure my Saturday brew will be the first.

What bugs me about the plate chiller is what stays in the plate chiller. Which IC are you using?
Click to expand...

I went with the Jaded King Cobra because of the low profile. It seems to work really well. The big test will be summer when ground water is warm but I have a plan using a pump and ice for that. Only problem is I will have to get ice for my brew day.
 
pretzelb said:
I went with the Jaded King Cobra because of the low profile. It seems to work really well. The big test will be summer when ground water is warm but I have a plan using a pump and ice for that. Only problem is I will have to get ice for my brew day.
Click to expand...


When I lived in Texas I just ran two ICs one in a bucket of ice with some water than into the kettle. Seemed to solve it.
 
02RedWS6TA said:
10lbs Maris otter
2lb white wheat
2lb carafoam
1lb flaked oats

1oz mosaic at 60. No bag
1oz citra and Amarillo each at 5
2oz each mosaic, citra and Amarillo for 30 minute steep at 180^
2oz each mosaic, citra and Amarillo dry hop on 4th day of fermentation

I used Wyeast 1056

Stolen from someone off here
Click to expand...

What what the AA content on the hops ?
 

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