Trunk line build - advice needed

[Merkur]

Hi - I have read a number of threads on here regarding DIY Trunk lines and before I start building one I'd like to confirm I have all the key points addressed.

I have two Komos V2 Kegerators on order which will be placed side by side (with the recommended air gaps). There will be a total of six beer lines - four from one kegerator and two from the other. The kegerator with only two kegs on tap will have storage for two 'On Deck' kegs and a gallon water reservoir with a pump that feeds the copper core of the trunk line. The 4mm EVA Barrier lines beer lines encircle the copper cooling pipe and are wrapped tight in 'SaranWrap' as a moisture barrier, then adhesive foil tape and finally foam pipe insulation. See photo of my mock-up. The longest beer line will be 6-7 feet and it is in an air condidtioned space - not a 90 degree Texas garage!

The beer is dispensed to a DIY 'T' shaped Black Iron pipe tower which is still being thought out, and the copper cooling line will split to each side of the 'T' and then the return path will be through two larger diameter vinyl lines back to the one gallon water reservoir.

Questions:
- Does anyone see any issues with this approach?
- Am I asking too much to dispense beer 6-7' through the 4mm lines? Should I use the 5mm lines? I currently use the 4mm lines which pour great using 5.5' lengths and the guidance from Bobby_M at BrewHardware.com
- Any recommendations on coolant flow rate or pumps to use?
- I made up the sample in the picture from scraps I had. The copper tube couldnt be bent without it crimping. I understand that there are two types of 1/4" copper tube - thin & thick wall - and one bends easier than the other. Is this correct?

Thanks,

Paul

 

[dawn_kiebawls]

Unfortunately I don't have a whole lot of information to offer you. If I were to be bending copper, or any other pipe for that matter, I would use a conduit bender. I'm not 100% sure if a conduit bender can handle 1/4" pipe or not but they work really well.

Other than replying to get you a bump on this thread, I'm pretty much only replying because this reminded me of a time I was trying to fit my '69 Chevelle with some new brake lines and kept crimping the lines! A mechanic friend of my Father loaned me a brake line bender that would have more than paid for itself if I had it from the start...

Hope the build goes well for you. I'll be watching the thread as I'll be going down the same road pretty soon. Cheers!

 

[AkTom]

You can get rolls of soft copper. It bends easily. A bender would still be helpful though.

 

[duncan.brown]

- Does anyone see any issues with this approach?

I'd put the coolant return inside the trunk line. The return liquid will still be relatively cold. If you let it heat up in uninsulated vinyl lines on the return, you'll just be making the chiller do more work.

- Am I asking too much to dispense beer 6-7' through the 4mm lines? Should I use the 5mm lines? I currently use the 4mm lines which pour great using 5.5' lengths and the guidance from @Bobby_M at BrewHardware.com

You can check with an online line-length calculator, but you should be fine. Longer lines will slow down the pour, but you won't get foam as long as the lines and taps are cool.

- Any recommendations on coolant flow rate or pumps to use?

I use one of these: Glycol Pumps · Penguin Chillers

- I made up the sample in the picture from scraps I had. The copper tube couldnt be bent without it crimping. I understand that there are two types of 1/4" copper tube - thin & thick wall - and one bends easier than the other. Is this correct?

You want the stuff that they use for air-conditioning compressor installs: Everbilt 1/4 in. O.D. x 20 ft. Soft Copper Refrigeration Coil Tubing-1/4 R 20RE - The Home Depot

I used 5/8" 3/8" rather than 1/4".

 

[Merkur]

Thanks for all the constructive guidance Duncan. Good point on putting the return lines inside the trunk line insulation. I hadn’t thought about them picking the ambient heat up. I like the idea that the returns have less ‘resistance’ than the copper feed and instead of bringing the two ends of the beer tower ‘T’ together again and feeder them back to the reservoir, as one pipe, I’ll leave them separate and have two return lines. Each with a larger diameter than the 1/4“ copper feed.

I’ll make a trip to Home Depot and look at the 1/4 vs the 5/8 or 1/2” flexible copper. This trunk line is going to be pretty unwieldy and I think anything larger than 1/4” pipe may make it too unmanageable.

i decided against using the glycol as I think for my line length it will be an overkill. I already have a Penguin chiller for the fermenter and they are great, but for this I think I’ll just circulate water at kegerator temperature to keep the lines cool With a ‘pond pump’. Not anywhere near as efficient but more cost effective and quieter in a home bar. The brewery gets pretty noisy when the Penguin kicks in.

All the best and thanks again. I plan to update this thread during the build and will monitor temperature readings of the lines to fine tune the operation.

Paul

 

[duncan.brown]

i decided against using the glycol as I think for my line length it will be an overkill. I already have a Penguin chiller for the fermenter and they are great, but for this I think I’ll just circulate water at kegerator temperature to keep the lines cool With a ‘pond pump’. Not anywhere near as efficient but more cost effective and quieter in a home bar. The brewery gets pretty noisy when the Penguin kicks in.

Sounds good. When I was designing my system I thought about putting water in the kegerator and circulating that, but I read a few posts where people hadn't had much luck as the water wasn't cool enough. However, I couldn't find any definitive statement on maximum line length and temperature for this approach. Since the water would have taken up keezer space (which I'm short of) I went with using the spare port on my glycol chiller. My abandoned 5 gal water drum and pond pump are now used to recirculate BLC through the lines for cleaning.

However, my guess is that with a short run you'll likely be fine with recirculating kegerator water. I'll be interested to hear how it works out.

I mis-typed in my previous post and my coolant is 3/8" OD copper, not 5/8". I used the same diameter for out and return.