Double IPA Trillium Vicinity Clone

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stonebrewer

stonebrewer

Invented the IPL
HBT Supporter
Joined
Mar 8, 2012
Messages
2,118
Reaction score
379
Location
rockville
Recipe Type
All Grain
Yeast
Wyeast 1318 London Ale III
Yeast Starter
2 Liter
Additional Yeast or Yeast Starter
No
Batch Size (Gallons)
5.5
Original Gravity
1.074
Final Gravity
1.014
Boiling Time (Minutes)
60
IBU
37
Color
5-6 SRM
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp)
7 days at 60F
Secondary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp)
NA
Additional Fermentation
NA
Tasting Notes
Earthy and spicy from the Columbus, notes of passionfruit and lychee.
Water Prep
Added phosphoric acid to hit mash PH of 5.28
Calcium 111
Sodium 59
Sulfate 77
Chloride 208

Mash
11 lbs Pilsner (2 Row) Ger (2.0 SRM) 73.6 %
2 lbs 4.0 oz Wheat, Flaked (1.6 SRM) 15.1 %
8.0 oz Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) 3.3 %
8.0 oz Caramel C15 (15.0 SRM) 3.3 %

Mashed at 150 for 75 minutes (had issues hitting temp...was supposed to be 60 minutes)

Hops
0.50 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - First Wort 60.0 min 21.2 IBUs
1.00 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min 15.4 IBUs
3.00 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 min 0.0 IBUs (chill to 170 before pitching hops into whirlpool)

Other Boil Ingredients
11.2 oz Corn Sugar (Dextrose) (0.0 SRM) 4.7 %
2.00 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 mins)
1.00 tsp Yeast Nutrients (Boil 10.0 mins)

Dry Hops
5.00 oz Galaxy [14.00 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days 0.0 IBUs
2.00 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days 0.0 IBUs
1.50 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days 0.0 IBUs

Options here: either put all dry hops in the fermenter day 3-4 or split them in half, put half in the fermenter and the other half in the serving keg (which is what I opted to do this time).

Fermentation
Fermented at 60F for 7 days in a Cornelius Keg. Attempted to reduce exposure to oxygen as much as possible. Pushed to a serving keg that was purged and had hops added, free floating. Serving keg has a home made screen on the intake tube made of 400 mesh stainless steel screen.

2a9scxt.jpg
 
No problem! Hope you love it like I do. Let me know how it turns out. This is still a bit of a work in progress, but at this point it was worth sharing the basic recipe. I am going to try tweaking this a bit as I am looking for some method to keep hop oil in suspension longer. This beer is fantastic the first 3-4 days and then you can see it clear and with that clearing you are losing hop character as it settles out of suspension. Still tastes great, but I rate it a 5 to start then a 4 a week later.

My next brew of this will be modified to add more flaked wheat to hold the oils in suspension...thinking 20-50% percent vice current 15%. I likely will add a little each time I brew it to see if I can find a sweet spot. I would also advise you keep the carbonation on the low side for this beer and the serving temps a little on the higher side as that seems to help too. BTW I notice this in Trillium bottles as well...beers I have had that are kept really cold or have aged a few weeks are not as good as fresh from the brewery. What you see with them is a thin, yeast like sediment that I think is actually a mixture of yeast and hop oil, at the bottom of the bomber. One other tip: I have a spare CO2 line that I keep a beverage out QD on...when this clears, I hit it with a shot of CO2 to get the oils back in suspension. There is a noticeable flavor/aroma improvement when I do this.

Missed ya in Baltimore this year! Hope to get out to Minneapolis next year...cheers!
 
Fermented for only a week? That is a nice quick beer. Love Vicinity. Just made a Galaxy Fort Point. Should be drinkable real soon.
 
removing the irish moss will absolutely help. once i started killing that practice my beers never clear now. Also, I use straight white wheat and not flaked wheat. Also, started using white labs 007 as well.
 
Man, after reading quite a few of your posts @stonebrewer and seeing this water profile, i a a little more concerned about my latest IPA than i was before!! lol was going for my first NE IPA, and think i am gonna be close (still fermenting.. day 4) but i think my water profile needs to be more extreme.

I hit:
Calcium 68
Sodium 0
Sulfate 75
Chloride 72
Mashed at 5.3

Was all RO water but I was afraid to put that much CaCl in! lol Well... looks like its time to brew again!! lol

Cheers... Thanks for the informative posts too!
 
That water profile will make a good IPA. Just might not be a NE IPA. My recent Galaxy FP clone I used...

Ca 159
Sulfate 104
Chloride 207

High chloride gives that creamy/smooth mouth feel.
 
h22lude said:
That water profile will make a good IPA. Just might not be a NE IPA. My recent Galaxy FP clone I used...

Ca 159
Sulfate 104
Chloride 207

High chloride gives that creamy/smooth mouth feel.
Click to expand...

I am 100% sure it will be a great IPA, but not so sure it will be what i was aiming for now... we will see where this gets. I usually have a LOT more sulfate than chloride in all my IPA's so this should at least get me closer to the goal! lol :mug:

Gonna shoot for these kinda numbers the next brew and see where that gets me i think!
 
frettfreak said:
I am 100% sure it will be a great IPA, but not so sure it will be what i was aiming for now... we will see where this gets. I usually have a LOT more sulfate than chloride in all my IPA's so this should at least get me closer to the goal! lol :mug:

Gonna shoot for these kinda numbers the next brew and see where that gets me i think!
Click to expand...

Agreed! It may even be close enough for you that you stick with it. I was worried about using so much chloride. I have no base to go by so I can't tell if I'd rather have less for my recipe. I may make it again with a typical ipa profile.
 
frettfreak said:
Man, after reading quite a few of your posts @stonebrewer and seeing this water profile, i a a little more concerned about my latest IPA than i was before!! lol was going for my first NE IPA, and think i am gonna be close (still fermenting.. day 4) but i think my water profile needs to be more extreme.
Click to expand...

Happy to help out anyway I can and honestly most of what I have learned about this has come from HBT and reading other brewing related blogs and whatnot. High chloride levels will really help with this beer, so I would enjoy the current batch, make detailed tasting notes, and then try it again with a more aggressive water chemistry and see if it makes a difference, and a difference that you like. This is part of the fun of brewing for me...tweaking recipes and seeing how to make them the way I want them to taste! Good luck and post back your results if you have a chance. Cheers!
 
What yeast did you use for this beer? I seem to remember that Trilium favors English yeast strains like London Ale III. I'm definitely starting to grow weary of Conan in NE IPAs, it runs over all of my dry hop additions.
 
specharka said:
What yeast did you use for this beer? I seem to remember that Trilium favors English yeast strains like London Ale III. I'm definitely starting to grow weary of Conan in NE IPAs, it runs over all of my dry hop additions.
Click to expand...

White Labs 007.....swear by it.
 
specharka said:
What yeast did you use for this beer? I seem to remember that Trilium favors English yeast strains like London Ale III. I'm definitely starting to grow weary of Conan in NE IPAs, it runs over all of my dry hop additions.
Click to expand...

Wyeast 1318 or WLP007 both work great. Most seem to favor the 1318, but I am still on the fence which I like more (but using 1318 the last few times so maybe I picked a side? ;>)
 
specharka said:
What yeast did you use for this beer? I seem to remember that Trilium favors English yeast strains like London Ale III. I'm definitely starting to grow weary of Conan in NE IPAs, it runs over all of my dry hop additions.
Click to expand...

I will have to take note of this. Havent noticed but will pay attention now. I use conan for most of my IPA's honestly. Love it, but REALLY wanting to try 1318 next i think.

stonebrewer said:
Happy to help out anyway I can and honestly most of what I have learned about this has come from HBT and reading other brewing related blogs and whatnot. High chloride levels will really help with this beer, so I would enjoy the current batch, make detailed tasting notes, and then try it again with a more aggressive water chemistry and see if it makes a difference, and a difference that you like. This is part of the fun of brewing for me...tweaking recipes and seeing how to make them the way I want them to taste! Good luck and post back your results if you have a chance. Cheers!
Click to expand...

I dont think i want to wait that long honestly. I have 8 taps to keep full and I am on a quest to nail this style (cause i LOVE IT). I am going to brew the same recipe but with a different water profile... going for somewhere close to 200 on the chloride and less than 100 sulfate is what i am shooting for with a 50-50 mix of filtered tap and RO (using bru'n water and have had my water tested)

Would like some critique on the recipe maybe if possible. was thinking of posting it for review in my own thread (cause i dont want to hijack urs with a completely different recipe). Would you guys mind taking a look? Looks like we have some people in here that have successfully made this style and would love a little input.

Thanks.

EDIT:
Here is the link to the recipe i just posted if anyone would like to take a look. https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?p=7671913#post7671913
 
Just kicked this keg, sad to say. However the last three pours were to die for. So damn good!! Got some Trillium coming next week from a buddy who drove up to the Boston area, so I probably will drink that for a week or two, but this is going to be my very next beer to brew. So freakin' delicious!

Galaxy is getting hard to find as there was a severe issue with all Aussie hops this year and production was WAY down. I scored 2 pounds of Galaxy last week though so I should be set for a while...though I just dumped a quarter pound into my Airwaves clone (WOW!!! it is so good).

I think my next clone attempt will be Cutting Tiles. If you haven't had it, you need to find someone to get you a can! The honey makes this IIPA so special. I have been very disappointed by HopSlam over the years as I (my palate, not yours!) find it a mess of a beer. Cutting Tiles, however is in my opinion the best IPA that Trillium does and one of the best on this planet.

Sorry for the rambling and being off topic! Brew this beer...you won't be disappointed! Cheers!!
 
Want to give this beer a try so bad! have plenty of ctz, centennial, Amarillo, cascade, and some other misc hops. Thinking about following the recipe and just subbing hops. Has anyone tried it with a different combo of hops?
 
Calaeb said:
Want to give this beer a try so bad! have plenty of ctz, centennial, Amarillo, cascade, and some other misc hops. Thinking about following the recipe and just subbing hops. Has anyone tried it with a different combo of hops?
Click to expand...

I posted this about 6 weeks ago so I don't think so. Go for it and post back what you think. Most Trillium beers are made to a handful of malt recipes with different hops (for their IPAs, anyhow). I don't think substitutes will make a bad beer, just a different beer.

I am about to brew this again. I am changing it a bit, adding both malted and flaked wheat vice just flakes. Trying to hit around 20% for the wheat combination. Last batch was extraordinary...hoping to improve on it! :ban:
 
Will give it a shot, will follow the same hop schedule and just swap them out for what i have.
 
Just finished up a near perfect brew day with this beer! I made a few tweaks, dropping the carapils a touch and increasing the wheat to almost 20%, mostly malted wheat but I did add a little flaked wheat to see if that has an effect. I also eliminated the Irish Moss to see if I can make the hops oils stay in suspension longer. One further tweak: I removed the dextrose altogether and will replace it with raw honey in the fermenter around day 4-5. This really is my attempt at making Artaic, AKA Cutting Tiles (except it uses Mosaic), AKA Galaxy Cutting Tiles. Looking forward to this beer a lot!! Cheers!!
 
Ugh! You guys make me jealous with this thread, its still on my list to brew using amarillo, centennial, and ctz.
 
This has been interesting...first beer I have ever used honey in and well, it is still going strong in the fermenter after two weeks! Getting a bubble about ever 3-4 seconds still and that has barely slowed down since I added the honey day 5 or 6. I was hoping to package today or tomorrow, but that seems to be off the table right now.
 
Have you checked the FG? I have experienced the same never ending bubbling with 1318. Might have something to do with it being a top cropping yeas.
 
Great point...will do. Yeah, it is still pretty thick on top...krausen-like...2-3 inches. May just be off gassing, but I have never had a yeast off gas that much before. Only have brewed with 1318 4-5 times though so can't say I know it well. Thanks for the tip @Oldskewl!
 
So it wasn't off gassing. It was still full of sugar (honey, actually)! And I, like a rookie brewer, decided to rush and not take a gravity reading. I poured a glass of sugar beer and decided to pull it out of the kegerator, hook a spunding valve up, put it in my temperature chamber, and flew off to Hawaii for a few weeks. Got back last week, just now getting "normal" and popped it back in the kegerator. First pour was all yeast (last night). Tonight, after running to IKEA to satisfy family needs, I came home, sat down, and poured myself a beer...then another...then another. WOW! This is so damned good! It could use some more dry hops (I lost track and may not have done all the dry hopping I planned!!), but I would put this up against Trillium's Artaic (now cutting tiles) any day. Great nose, flavor is spot on, and hoppy as anything I would buy in VT or MA! Lovin' these NE homebrewed IPA's everyone!
 
stonebrewer said:
Water Prep
Added phosphoric acid to hit mash PH of 5.28
Calcium 111
Sodium 59
Sulfate 77
Chloride 208

Mash
11 lbs Pilsner (2 Row) Ger (2.0 SRM) 73.6 %
2 lbs 4.0 oz Wheat, Flaked (1.6 SRM) 15.1 %
8.0 oz Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) 3.3 %
8.0 oz Caramel C15 (15.0 SRM) 3.3 %

Mashed at 150 for 75 minutes (had issues hitting temp...was supposed to be 60 minutes)

Hops
0.50 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - First Wort 60.0 min 21.2 IBUs
1.00 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min 15.4 IBUs
3.00 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 min 0.0 IBUs (chill to 170 before pitching hops into whirlpool)

Other Boil Ingredients
11.2 oz Corn Sugar (Dextrose) (0.0 SRM) 4.7 %
2.00 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 mins)
1.00 tsp Yeast Nutrients (Boil 10.0 mins)

Dry Hops
5.00 oz Galaxy [14.00 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days 0.0 IBUs
2.00 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days 0.0 IBUs
1.50 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days 0.0 IBUs

Options here: either put all dry hops in the fermenter day 3-4 or split them in half, put half in the fermenter and the other half in the serving keg (which is what I opted to do this time).

Fermentation
Fermented at 60F for 7 days in a Cornelius Keg. Attempted to reduce exposure to oxygen as much as possible. Pushed to a serving keg that was purged and had hops added, free floating. Serving keg has a home made screen on the intake tube made of 400 mesh stainless steel screen.
Click to expand...

Recipe looks awesome... I picked up everything to brew it and will be soon.

Can you elaborate on this for me? How did you make the intake screen?

Serving keg has a home made screen on the intake tube made of 400 mesh stainless steel screen.
 
I purchased a bunch of stainless steel screen from Utah Biodiesel ( https://utahbiodieselsupply.com/brewingfilters.php ). I cut out a small rectangle, rolled it around a dip tube to make it tight, and silver soldered it along the length of the screen. I fit it over the dip tube and use needle nose pliers to pinch the opening closed by folding it on four sides. To fit it into the keg, insert the dip tube a few inches and then slip the (tight fitting!) screen over the dip tube. This prevents a very nasty clog (experience talking!) from occurring with free floating hops being jammed up the dip tube. You can also just buy these online from one of the HB vendors. Will dig up where if you are interested in going that route. Think they were about 12 bucks shipped.
 
 
Last edited by a moderator:
stonebrewer said:
Here are a couple of places...I think MoreBeer and others carry these as well:

http://www.homebrewing.org/Corny-Keg-Dip-Tube-Screen_p_2091.html

https://www.amazon.com/KegWorks-Homebrew-Hops-Filter-Screen/dp/B006FX4ZCK

http://www.austinhomebrew.com/Dip-Tube-Screen_p_4768.html&utm_source=google&utm_medium=shopping?gclid=CjwKEAjw19vABRCY2YmkpO2OzTsSJAAzEt8sXardeAeYdS1LwebwyfzN4_9b_2LSGdKyXX5DmKqBfxoCrorw_wcB
Click to expand...

You already mention this in the OP, but I wanted to confirm your process.

Your dip tube screen allows you to add loose hops to your keg without any clogging issues? Are you using whole leaf or pellet? Any issues with clogging? The screens linked to suggest using with whole leaf, and not pellets.

I would like to move my dry hopping into the serving keg, where I could carbonate/dry hop for 3 days, and then move the keg into the fridge to prevent overextraction and the beer would be carbed and ready to go. My big concern is clogging the dip tube and either off gassing the beer or exposing it to oxygen in the process of unclogging it. I've seen that some people are fitting the dip tube inside a stainless steel dry hop filter, but that requires shortening the dip tube and would result losing product when kegging non-dry hopped beers.

I'm currently brewing 2.5 gallon batches and dry hopping in the fermenter. My aroma starts to die down after a week or so in the keg, but thankfully these smaller batches are finished quickly. Still, I think dry hopping in the keg would take it to the next level.

Any advice you wouldn't mind sharing would be greatly appreciated!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I rarely use leaf hop anymore...I started out using only leaf but switched to pellets for a number of reasons (storage requirements, grassy notes, and better hop extraction to name a few). I put pellet hops right in the keg and with these screens have not had a problem with clogs...YET! I don't want to guarantee it will not happen, but so far with about 7-8 kegs of hoppy goodness, I have not had an issue. I tried the cutting back the dip tube and using a SS filter basket approach...clogged badly. After switching to the dip tub covers I have yet to clog. YMMV...hope this helps!
 
stonebrewer said:
I rarely use leaf hop anymore...I started out using only leaf but switched to pellets for a number of reasons (storage requirements, grassy notes, and better hop extraction to name a few). I put pellet hops right in the keg and with these screens have not had a problem with clogs...YET! I don't want to guarantee it will not happen, but so far with about 7-8 kegs of hoppy goodness, I have not had an issue. I tried the cutting back the dip tube and using a SS filter basket approach...clogged badly. After switching to the dip tub covers I have yet to clog. YMMV...hope this helps!
Click to expand...

Ditto on the pellet hops.

How many ounces are you adding to the keg?

I'm surprised to hear the SS basket didn't work for you. That seems to be the most common method posted. I actually already have one of the dip tube screens, but I'm unsure if it's as effective at filtering as your 400 micron screen. The holes on the filter seem larger than a 400 micron mesh. It's the same as this one:
09040-dip-tube-screen-stainless-steel-web.jpg


Do those holes seem larger than the mesh you're using for your filter? I'm hesitant to try it out in fear that I'll get a clog.

At any rate, it's inspiring to hear that a dip tube filter has been adequate for you. Maybe you should start selling your mesh filters? ;)
 
The mesh on mine seems smaller, but those are some small holes and I would think that you would be okay. I add up to a pound into the keg, usually at least half a pound on a Trillium clone. I have been really pleased with these little mesh filters not clogging up the works so far. I don't think it would be cost effective for me to make them, but thanks for the idea! I'll post a picture when I have a little more free time so you can compare.
 
stonebrewer said:
The mesh on mine seems smaller, but those are some small holes and I would think that you would be okay. I add up to a pound into the keg, usually at least half a pound on a Trillium clone. I have been really pleased with these little mesh filters not clogging up the works so far. I don't think it would be cost effective for me to make them, but thanks for the idea! I'll post a picture when I have a little more free time so you can compare.
Click to expand...

Sounds like I'll just have to give it a go then. I'll brew something easy and dry hop with some lower cost hops. If I get poor results, no big deal.

If you have a chance, that would be great. Very interested to see your design.
 
I just don't understand the need for keg hopping?? why not just adequately dry hop and transfer under pressure to a purged keg? Should be able to get all you need from that.
 
This might sound amateur to some but does anybody have a partial mash recipe of the Trillium Vicinity?
 

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