Tri clamp valves vs regular ball valve

[schmeldorf]

What makes the tri clamps so much more sanitary? They can be disassembled?

Anyone?

 

[RiverCityBrewer]

Tri clamp butterfly valves can be completely disassembled and have no threads.

 

[Lennie]

I have triclamps and its honestly not that big of a deal. They're easy to pull off the conical but I don't know that you'd have to remove the ball valves every time.

 

[audger]

for sanitation, threads suck. o-rings are way better.

 

[bdjohns1]

Tri clamp fittings are the standard in the dairy industry, which is even pickier about sanitation than brewers. (I know - I'm a manager at a big cheese plant by day).

We like them because they're able to be cleaned in place if you design your system right. That means no crevices, threaded fittings, pitting, etc. Ball valves aren't great because the seat the ball rotates in can't be cleaned in place. Butterfly valves are better, but our hardcore food safety folks don't like them. So, a triclamp ball valve is easy to remove for cleaning, but still technically should be hand-cleaned.

Since we're pretty much fully automated, we usually go with pneumatically controlled valves which have a beveled valve seat surface that can be cleaned without disassembling the valve.

 

[Bobby_M]

The thing to realize is that having some TC fittings and some threaded fittings pretty much defeats the purpose. Either you go all sanitary or don't waste your money.

 

[Barnesie]

The thing to realize is that having some TC fittings and some threaded fittings pretty much defeats the purpose. Either you go all sanitary or don't waste your money.

That realization saved me a lot of time in planning. I kept trying to plan a method to have threaded pre-boil and all TC post boil and kept wracking my brain until I finally said SCREW IT...literally.

Bought all my fittings from Mr. Bobby_M above and I'm not looking back.

At the end of the day, it's just beer.

 

[ValveMan]

A tri-clamp valve has less 'nooks and cranies' than a threaded valve. This doesn't allow for as much (if any) bacteria growth than a threaded valve. Another valid thing to know if the difference between a ball valve and a butterfly valve when it comes to bacteria growth. A ball valve can be high purity but never sanitary because the area around the ball and the inside of the ball can be a place bacteria can grow. The best thing to use is a sanitary butterfly valve if you are very concerned with sanitization.

This is a good video explaining the difference as well.

 

[bdjohns1]

The thing to realize is that having some TC fittings and some threaded fittings pretty much defeats the purpose. Either you go all sanitary or don't waste your money.

If I were in commercial operation, I'd agree, but at home, there are a few places where you can fall back to non-3A fittings and not really be compromising. First would be anything that's only contacting water - like all of the stuff for an HLT. Second would be anything that needs to be torn down periodically anyhow.

There are some places where going with threaded fittings forces you to do a tear-down periodically to effectively clean (at least by the standards that my quality manager down the hall at work wouldn't shake his head at). Any weldless bulkhead can have harborage points that can only be effectively cleaned by tearing down the parts. Specifically, the area right around where the O-ring is compressed on the interior wall of a BK is the perfect place for residue to get caught.

So, even if you don't go 100% with sanitary fittings, there are some places where doing it can be a time/effort savings over the life of your gear. Main places would be bulkheads (although less crucial on the HLT). From some stuff I've read, they're better for some tubing hookups versus camlocks or other QDs as they're less likely to get air incorporation.

Plus, I've spent enough time with tri-clamps over my career that I can practically manipulate them in my sleep.

 

[oakbarn]

Ran into this thread looking for some information on Butterfly vs ball valve. I think there is some advice I would not heed. I have some ball valves and butterfly valves from John at http://conical-fermenter.com/.

The ball valves and the butterfly valves are very easy to clean and just take a little time. You can take apart these ball valves in seconds. We have some ball valves from Blickman as well and they are not very easy to clean. John says you should clean after every use. I did not the first couple of times but got the idea that we should clean every once in a while. Well, the gunk we found inside made us believers. We had "cleaned" using hot (140 degree) PBW for 30 minutes each time before we really cleaned them. After we figured out how to take apart the first time, it was easy to clean the inside. The second time took no time at all as it was so easy to take apart and clean each piece. You do need to keep the same seals in the same spots with the same valves but other than that, it is a snap. After seeing the inside of that valve, we clean each and every time.

As far as having a mix of threaded or TC, I think for a homebrewer it is almost impossible to not have some threads somewhere. I would suggest to keep to a minimum and be able to clean them with boiling water with the threads exposed. We take those fittings and boil in a bath. I like the TC fittings and try to use them every where I can.

One place you cannot get away from threads is on the pumps. No one makes a head with TC fittings.

 

[Barnesie]

The ball valves and the butterfly valves are very easy to clean and just take a little time. You can take apart these ball valves in seconds. We have some ball valves from Blickman as well and they are not very easy to clean. John says you should clean after every use. I did not the first couple of times but got the idea that we should clean every once in a while. Well, the gunk we found inside made us believers. We had "cleaned" using hot (140 degree) PBW for 30 minutes each time before we really cleaned them. After we figured out how to take apart the first time, it was easy to clean the inside. The second time took no time at all as it was so easy to take apart and clean each piece. You do need to keep the same seals in the same spots with the same valves but other than that, it is a snap. After seeing the inside of that valve, we clean each and every time.

Ironically, I just took apart my ball valves this weekend for a hot PBW soak and the amount of trapped up gunk was shocking even after only about three full brew sessions. Makes me very concerned for my planned plate chiller purchase.

I do think it's important to note that this is gunk and not contamination. I'm not very worried about much of anything that I'm using pre-boil and everything boil and post-boil gets sanitized with boiling wort.

That being said, seeing what gets trapped inside threads and ball valve joints makes me much more interested in TC fittings for fermentation if I ever invest in a conical.

 

[cfrazier77]

One place you cannot get away from threads is on the pumps. No one makes a head with TC fittings.

You can get a pump with TC fittings but they are not cheap.
http://www.brewmation.com/brewery_pumps.html

Also, Nano and Micro brewery pumps come in TC.