The real deal on recirculating

[brad.maynes]

According to Dave Miller's book, at the beginning of lautering, you should recirculate your runoff until "crystal clear". After an hour and a half of recirculating on last Saturday (don't ask - bad job sparging last time, nuff said), my buddy and I were never able to hit "crystal clear" to our obsessive happiness. Other places I have read to recirculate until you get to the point of "unfiltered apple cider", whereas others just say recirculate until the worst of the particulates are gone.

What is everyone's experience with this? I certainly don't remember recirculating for an hour and a half when I was brewing in MA years ago ...

I will fully admit that I am only being paranoid about this because our last lautering directly resulted in SUCH a bad beer. Ouch.

 

[Iordz]

I vorlauf about 1-1.5 gallons and when the wort is relatively clear and free of particles I start lautering. Honestly, I prefer to cold condition all my beers for a bit longer, which helps proteins coagulate and yeast flocculate, leaving the beer clear. With some beers I don't care too much about clarity, like my American brown. I keg it in 2 weeks and tap it at 3, flavor is more important to me than clarity, however if I was to enter a competition I would make sure the beer is clear.

 

[Yooper]

I vorlauf a quart or two, usually. I did notice that when I do a mashout that the wort is clearer. Probably because the wort is less viscous and seems clearer.

 

[malkore]

you want runnings that don't have bits of grain in them. its not clear like water...its clean of 'crud' and haziness. the hazy bit is usually the grain that was turned into flour, and the bigger bits are husks and bits of grain.

 

[the_bird]

Couple quarts, usually (as a batch sparger); if you're doing an hour and a half, you're basically taking out your entire runnings and putting them back in a second (or third, or fourth) time. I can't possibly imagine there is anything other than a very minute benefit to going that long.

 

[Lil' Sparky]

I used to just recirculate a gallon or so - until the grain bits were gone. Never had any issues with the final product.

I will say that since I started using a pump to recirculate during a direct-fire step at mashout, the wort is extremely clear by the time it makes it to the kettle. It's as clear as finished beer. There's also a nice white layer (from the flour?) on top of the mash when I'm done. I assume that all used to make it into the kettle. I have no idea what effect it really has, if any.

 

[raceskier]

I usually do about 2 gallons. I never get "crystal clear", just no more visible bits. I think the "unfiltered apple cider" is the perfect descrition.

 

[boo boo]

I do a few quarts and then let her go. About 1/4 way through I see "clear" runnings. And I do mean clear.

 

[jammer]

I wouldn't bother more than 2 quarts. You're just getting the chunks out.

 

[Soulive]

I do a couple quarts give or take. I'm not really concerned with clarity too much. I kind of like a little haziness in my beer. Call me crazy...

 

[TexLaw]

I also vorlauf about a gallon or gallon and a half. That gets all the husk bits out and results in fairly clear runnings. It might be more than I need to do, but I also enjoy adding that extra bit of care to my beer.

As I understand it, flour in the wort really isn't a problem, as you don't have concerns about tannins. You will have some extra, unconverted starches and some proteins to deal with, but I can't imagine it makes much difference.


TL

 

[CBBaron]

Based on my experience of forgetting to vorlauf, you definitely want to recirculate to get the husks and larger particles out of the wort, but I can't imagine there is much gain after the first few quarts to gallons (based on your lauter tun design). If you are that paranoid about having clear runnings then I would invest in a pump based system and recirculate during the mash. One advantage I have read about all of the recirculating systems is very clear wort. And once you have the recirculation system it is easy to create a HERMS with a work chiller and a HLT.
Craig

 

[srm775]

I never or very rarely vorlauf. I simply clip a fine mesh bag to the end of the tube coming out of the ball-valve and it catches everything and the wort is crystal clear. When you're done sparging, take the bag off and dispose of everthing. Works perfectly.

 

[cheezydemon]

On BYO's site(I haven't got the issue yet) it advertises an article that seems to be saying that you can extract tons more from the grains if you heat the wort and mash it again in your tun. Anyone tried anything like this?

 

[brewt00l]

On BYO's site(I haven't got the issue yet) it advertises an article that seems to be saying that you can extract tons more from the grains if you heat the wort and mash it again in your tun. Anyone tried anything like this?

"Reiterated Mashing: Multiple Mashes for Massive Brews" is the article you are thinking of in the latest BYO.

 

[Lil' Sparky]

I don't get BYO, so someone will have to elaborate on the process.

 

[Lil' Sparky]

I did find this for those of you who don't get BYO. I'm listening to it now.

http://www.podcastdirectory.com/podshows/2105211

 

[brewt00l]

I don't get BYO, so someone will have to elaborate on the process.

I don't have the article in front of me but the gist was heating your sparged wort & using that for your subsequent sparges in place of water to extract the max amount of sugars from a given grain bill with out needing massive volumes and boil offs.

 

[FSR402]

I never or very rarely vorlauf. I simply clip a fine mesh bag to the end of the tube coming out of the ball-valve and it catches everything and the wort is crystal clear. When you're done sparging, take the bag off and dispose of everthing. Works perfectly.

I do the same thing. I tried on three brews to do it the "right" way and I was never able to get it to run clean. So now I just filter it out.

 

[Evan!]

I don't have the article in front of me but the gist was heating your sparged wort & using that for your subsequent sparges in place of water to extract the max amount of sugars from a given grain bill with out needing massive volumes and boil offs.

Without listening to the podcast, I would imagine that it would be much less efficient this way...given that virgin water is better at rinsing grains than sugary wort. But maybe I'm wrong...?

 

[Chriso]

My old CVPC manifold was hit or miss, which is why I switched styles. One time it took about 6 2-quart pitchers (3 gal) to even START establishing a grain bed. The next, it took a single quart.

With my new S/S braid hose, it's about 3 quarts - one full pitcher, and one more half-pitcher after pouring back in, just to make sure I poured carefully enough. Then into das kettle!

Correct me if I'm wrong, but even if you pull a bunch of flour into your kettle, a good hot break and a good cold break should take care of most of your haze, right? Sure, you'll get a little chill haze, but it shouldn't be like eating a granola bar, right?

 

[brewt00l]

Without listening to the podcast, I would imagine that it would be much less efficient this way...given that virgin water is better at rinsing grains than sugary wort. But maybe I'm wrong...?

DOH! I forgot the rather key element of "grain beds" which IIRC, the article mentions adding additional grain and implementing additional mashes with the sparge water so there is more to it than just sparging with wort...sorry 'bout that.

 

[Lil' Sparky]

Without listening to the podcast, I would imagine that it would be much less efficient this way...given that virgin water is better at rinsing grains than sugary wort. But maybe I'm wrong...?

I agree. There doesn't seem to be much differential for the sugars to equalize.

And after listening to the podcast, I think it adds too much work to my brew day. I don't think I'll be trying this for the 08-08-08.

 

[billtzk]

One time it took about 6 2-quart pitchers (1.5 gal) to even START establishing a grain bed.

six 2 quart pitchers would be three gallons. how many fingers am i holding up?

 

[Chriso]

six 2 quart pitchers would be three gallons. how many fingers am i holding up?

Erp. Math error. Brain no worky good when at work. Yeah. Three.