Taking the next step (or the plunge, depending on how it goes)

[Dave T]

So I have 8 brews under my belt (yes, a legend in my mind), 3 from extract kits, 4 from extract recipes, and one was a mini mash because I couldnt’ find the right extracts, prodded and guided by Islandlizard (many thanks, membership incoming, can’t justify not donating after all the help I get here). And of course, that was much easier than I had anticipated, so now I’m planning an all grain beer for tomorrow. Like usual, filled with questions from all the reading I’ve been doing. The pictorial in this forum was outstanding, by the way.

Mash tun / sparse thing - I have a cooler - it looks like it’ll hold about 6gallons, will this work? Do I need to build some sort of spare rig / filtering thing on the bottom like in the pictorial? I have a couple more coolers, but SWMBO (really love that btw, although she does not) would rather I not repurpose our camping coolers. Should I be using some sort of filtration? I like the PVC setup on the bottom in that thread, it appeals in it’s simplicity, but how does it work? I didn’t see any holes. I would imagine I’d need some type of strainer, just not seeing it.

I’m confused about the volume - using the calculator that was in the post (and just round numbers), I need 9 gallons of water. That is split into a mash volume of 4.3 and a spare volume of 4.7. then it turns into fuzzy math - I take 9 gallons of water, slosh it around in a pile of grain for an hour, and then I come up with 6.5 gallons of wort, and boil it down to 5. Where is the other 2.5 gallons? Does the grain soak it up?

How specific is the mash temperature requirement? I can be pretty anal, and I’ve been known to change the temperature of an entire lab. My assumption is that I can get water slightly above temp, put it in the cooler and let the cooler equalize for about 30 mins, hopefully it’s still slightly over, and pour in the grains? Is there a band I should maintain, or just don’t go over 165f?

So once I get the mash wet and drained, I sparge. For clarification, I first pour the liquid that I just drained over the grain pile until that’s clear, and then I do the same with the ‘sparge volume’ (probably into another vessel than the mash volume?)?

And lastly for now - sparge water - Does that need to be the same temp as the mash? Not wanting to mess around with hot water if I don’t need to.

Seems the rest is like a full volume boil - just sit back, drink beer, clean up my mess, and hope it doesn’t boil over...

Thanks

Dave

 

[bracconiere]

for the mash, yes, you need to modify the cooler...i use one of these and a ball valve...

https://www.morebeer.com/products/kettle-tube-screen-stainless-steel.html

mash temp is important you want between 145f-158f, lower will be drier then higher...and the word your looking for the water to add the grain too is 'strike' temp, there are calcs that will get you a good strike temp. based on how much grain, temp of grain, etc....

yes the grain does absorb water...and 9 gals sounds high for a 5 gal batch...i use 7 gals for a 20lb/10gal batch....and sparge with 10 gals...and get ~14 gal pre-boil volume...

edit:

(yes, a legend in my mind),
Thanks

Dave

You and me both!!

 

[doug293cz]

So I have 8 brews under my belt (yes, a legend in my mind), 3 from extract kits, 4 from extract recipes, and one was a mini mash because I couldnt’ find the right extracts, prodded and guided by Islandlizard (many thanks, membership incoming, can’t justify not donating after all the help I get here). And of course, that was much easier than I had anticipated, so now I’m planning an all grain beer for tomorrow. Like usual, filled with questions from all the reading I’ve been doing. The pictorial in this forum was outstanding, by the way.

Mash tun / sparse thing - I have a cooler - it looks like it’ll hold about 6gallons, will this work? Do I need to build some sort of spare rig / filtering thing on the bottom like in the pictorial? I have a couple more coolers, but SWMBO (really love that btw, although she does not) would rather I not repurpose our camping coolers. Should I be using some sort of filtration? I like the PVC setup on the bottom in that thread, it appeals in it’s simplicity, but how does it work? I didn’t see any holes. I would imagine I’d need some type of strainer, just not seeing it.

You will need some kind of manifold, or filter arrangement (like a bazooka tube or water supply braid) to keep grain from getting into the BK. The manifold in the pics has holes or slots on the underside of the pipes, so that's why you can't see them. Instead of a manifold filter, you could get a fine mesh bag the just fills the cooler volume. With a bag, you need to lift it out of the wort to get it to drain well, unless you also have a false bottom, manifold, etc. A pulley rigged above the MLT makes lifting the bag a non-issue.

I’m confused about the volume - using the calculator that was in the post (and just round numbers), I need 9 gallons of water. That is split into a mash volume of 4.3 and a spare volume of 4.7. then it turns into fuzzy math - I take 9 gallons of water, slosh it around in a pile of grain for an hour, and then I come up with 6.5 gallons of wort, and boil it down to 5. Where is the other 2.5 gallons? Does the grain soak it up?

Yes, the grain will absorb about 0.12 gal of your strike water per lb of grain. So 8 lb of grain would absorb about 1 gal of water, and 12 lb of grain would absorb about 1.5 gal. You need to add this volume to your target pre-boil volume to get the total of your strike plus sparge water volume. Also, if you have any undrainable volume in your MLT (fill ~1/4 full, drain the same way you will during brewing, and measure the volume retained in the MLT) that will also need to be added to the total starting water volume. Thus if you were going to use 12 lb of grain, and wanted 6.5 gal pre-boil, you would need to start with 6.5 gal + 1.5 gal = 8 gal of total water.

To get the best lauter efficiency with batch sparging, you want the initial run off volume and the sparge volume to be about the same. So for 6.5 gal pre-boil, you want both runnings to be about 3.25 gal. No additional water will be absorbed during the sparge, so your sparge water volume will be 3.25 gal. Your strike water is then the balance of the total water which is 4.75 gal. Now crushed grain takes up about 0.08 gal/lb of the MLT volume, so the 12 lbs would take up about 1 gal. That combined with the 4.75 gal of strike water would give you a mash volume of 5.75 gal, which would be a challenge to stir in a 6 gal cooler. In this case you want to reduce your strike volume somewhat, and use the extra water for sparge, 4 gal strike and 4 gal sparge would be a good choice. You will still be close enough to equal initial and sparge runnings volumes to have very little effect on lauter efficiency.

How specific is the mash temperature requirement? I can be pretty anal, and I’ve been known to change the temperature of an entire lab. My assumption is that I can get water slightly above temp, put it in the cooler and let the cooler equalize for about 30 mins, hopefully it’s still slightly over, and pour in the grains? Is there a band I should maintain, or just don’t go over 165f?

You want to be able to hit your mash target temp, measured after a thorough stirring for dough-in, within 2˚ - 3˚F. Many people try to get within 1˚F of better, but withing 2˚ - 3˚F you will still have a successful mash, and your finished beer shouldn't be too far off what you where planning. There are lots of water calculators that will tell you what temp your strike water should be to hit your mash target with your given amount of grains. Usually using these takes a few runs to get things dialed in. Just keep good notes, and make compensating adjustments on your next brew. If your mash temp is way off, you can add small amounts of cold or boiling water to adjust. If you need to cool down the mash, add the cold water as soon as you can.

So once I get the mash wet and drained, I sparge. For clarification, I first pour the liquid that I just drained over the grain pile until that’s clear, and then I do the same with the ‘sparge volume’ (probably into another vessel than the mash volume?)?

Yes, at the end of your mash, you drain off 1 - 2 qt at a time and pour back over the grain bed (this is called vorlaufing.) Repeat until the drained wort is clear of any grain bits. Then drain the mash tun as quickly as your equipment allows, and allow to drain completely. Next add your sparge water to the grain, and stir aggressively for about 5 minutes, then vorlauf and drain as before.

And lastly for now - sparge water - Does that need to be the same temp as the mash? Not wanting to mess around with hot water if I don’t need to.

Your sparge water does not need to be heated.

Seems the rest is like a full volume boil - just sit back, drink beer, clean up my mess, and hope it doesn’t boil over...

Thanks

Dave

Brew on

 

[RM-MN]

Mash tun / sparse thing - I have a cooler - it looks like it’ll hold about 6gallons, will this work? Do I need to build some sort of spare rig / filtering thing on the bottom like in the pictorial? I have a couple more coolers, but SWMBO (really love that btw, although she does not) would rather I not repurpose our camping coolers. Should I be using some sort of filtration? I like the PVC setup on the bottom in that thread, it appeals in it’s simplicity, but how does it work? I didn’t see any holes. I would imagine I’d need some type of strainer, just not seeing it.

You need some way to separate the wort from the grains. Lots of ways to do this. I use a polyester bag made for straining paint. No other modification needed for the cooler, it simply becomes an insulate container. When the mash period is over you can open the drain on the cooler to let the wort drain out, lifting the bag as necessary to keep the liquid flowing. You won't need to worry about returning any of this to the mash tun, the polyester bag makes an excellent filter and won't let enough grain particles through to worry about.

I’m confused about the volume - using the calculator that was in the post (and just round numbers), I need 9 gallons of water. That is split into a mash volume of 4.3 and a spare volume of 4.7. then it turns into fuzzy math - I take 9 gallons of water, slosh it around in a pile of grain for an hour, and then I come up with 6.5 gallons of wort, and boil it down to 5. Where is the other 2.5 gallons? Does the grain soak it up?

Lets make this simple. Weigh the grains you will need in pounds. Multiply this by 1.5 and that becomes the quarts of liquid needed for the mash. When the mash is over collect the wort and measure (to the best of your ability, it isn't real critical) the wort you collected. Now you know the amount of water needed to sparge with to get your pre-boil volume. Divide that by two and sparge twice. I would be expecting you to need about 7.5 gallons pre-boil. Again, not critical.

How specific is the mash temperature requirement? I can be pretty anal, and I’ve been known to change the temperature of an entire lab. My assumption is that I can get water slightly above temp, put it in the cooler and let the cooler equalize for about 30 mins, hopefully it’s still slightly over, and pour in the grains? Is there a band I should maintain, or just don’t go over 165f?

Yes there is a temperature range required for the enzymes to be activated. Roughly 148 to 160F. There are 2 enzymes that are needed to work together to convert the starch to sugars.

And lastly for now - sparge water - Does that need to be the same temp as the mash? Not wanting to mess around with hot water if I don’t need to.

The water used to sparge can be cool or hot, very little difference in how it recovers the sugars. I find cool water easier to deal with.

 

[Moose_MI]

^^Sensible, practical suggestions. Well done!

 

[Dave T]

Awesome, thanks. One last question - the grain I have has ‘dust’ - should this be shaken out before I immerse, or will it filter out?

 

[RM-MN]

Awesome, thanks. One last question - the grain I have has ‘dust’ - should this be shaken out before I immerse, or will it filter out?

When I BIAB all the grain is close to dust because I mill it as finely as I can. Any of it that gets through the bag settles out in the fermenter and will make clear beer. Just dump that dust in with the rest of the grain.

 

[Dave T]

Holy crap my temps were all over the place. Need to rethink my setup. 25f outside temp not helping. Might be a little lighter beer than anticipated...