Spontaneous ferment attempt

[Joewalla88]

I attempted to brew a sponteous fermentation beer last week. I left it out over night, and then brought it out again for another night. It's starting to smell like something is going on, but I don't really see any activity.

This first picture is how I left it outside. I put a mesh bag over the top to keep stuff out. The second picture is of the little activity I got a couple days ago, but thats about all that's happened. Does anyone have any idea if this is going to work? I thought about setting it out for one more evening to gather some more bugs, but I don't know if thats necessary or not.

 

[specharka]

Without stepping the wild microflora up to a pitchable rate, that's going to be a considerable task. Even lambic brewers who practice spontaneous fermentation exclusively recycle microbes for fermentation to develop a house character. If you're looking to go down this road, awesome! But I would strongly recommend capturing microbes, stepping them up to a pitchable volume and retaining a culture for future use. Lambic brewers do not ferment exclusively from bugs obtained in their koelschips.

 

[Joewalla88]

I thought about that afterward. I should have started smaller. I hope I can still get this to work. I thought it would be fun to get a house strain like you mentioned, but I might need to rethink this.

 

[thaefathan]

Last week I made up 7 jars with a couple oz 1.020, ~20 IBU wort, placed them around the garden for a few minutes (started raining). Today I'm brewing some 1.025 wort with 20 IBU, so I can pitch each jar into about 1/2 gal. I'm planning to let that sit for a while after all activity stops, then taste each one, and step up the ones that don't taste horrible. I read that you shouldn't expect much until the 3rd batch, that's when the culture starts to mature. And you don't want to taste them until fermentation is completely over. Throw out anything with fuschia spots, that's botulism.

 

[myndflyte]

Throw out anything with fuschia spots, that's botulism.

What if it's really tasty though?

 

[Joewalla88]

That's a little frightening.

 

[Agate]

I do a couple of spontaneous inoculations per year. One in the early spring and one in the late fall. It's definitely do-able, and you can expect to see the start of fermentation after 4-7 days or so. Very roughly speaking.

I don't think a bucket is the ideal way to do this, and you're likely to get some mold growing from the large headspace. Two things that will improve your chances for success are to drop your post-boil pH to 4.5 or less with lactic acid (which will eliminate the risk of botulism) and to get it in a carboy the next day, filled to the top with a blow-off tube.

 

[thaefathan]

How do those taste? Do you reuse that culture for more brews? Does the flavor change from generation to generation?

I just brewed my 1.033OG wort with 20 IBU hops. I put 2 quarts into 7 containers, and pitched the whole ~3oz of starters. Some of them smelled like fart. For my next steps I'm thinking of cold crashing these, pouring off the liquid, and adding 2 quarts fresh wort on top of the 'yeast' cake/ pellicle that forms. I'm not sure when exactly to do this though.

 

[LakesideBrewing]

...Throw out anything with fuschia spots, that's botulism.

Is there anyway to test for botulism? I have a one year old spontaneously fermented beer that looks ok, and I want to taste it, but I don't want to get sick.

 

[Agate]

How do those taste? Do you reuse that culture for more brews? Does the flavor change from generation to generation?



I just brewed my 1.033OG wort with 20 IBU hops. I put 2 quarts into 7 containers, and pitched the whole ~3oz of starters. Some of them smelled like fart. For my next steps I'm thinking of cold crashing these, pouring off the liquid, and adding 2 quarts fresh wort on top of the 'yeast' cake/ pellicle that forms. I'm not sure when exactly to do this though.

I'm assuming you're asking me? It's a little tough to say, I'm about 2 years in to what is probably a 4 year process. I have a local yeast that throws a lot of blueberry and peach esters, and that seems to be pretty regular. I don't taste them anymore for the first year, as they just taste... weird. Older ones are coming along nicely, starting to develop some character and acidity. Trying to decide if I want to bottle straight, dry hop or fruit them, or blend. But I haven't re-used any cultures, as my purpose is to have them go through the natural progression of microbes.

If you're getting a lot of sulfur in your wild captures, you probably have some bacteria going on. Might be worth adding some hopped and/or acidified wort to see if you can get the yeast to take over.

 

[Joewalla88]

Is there anyway to test for botulism? I have a one year old spontaneously fermented beer that looks ok, and I want to taste it, but I don't want to get sick.

I wonder that too. Would testing the PH help? Supposedly it doesn't do well in PH under 4.6, so if your PH is low enough would it be alright? Or is there a chance that it did some damage before the ferment took it down low enough? Also, since it grows in low oxygen environments, is it a real threat if you oxygenated your wort at all?

 

[Joewalla88]

So, I finally ordered a PH tester, and the PH is around 3.7, so Im not entirely worried about botulism. It smells awesome, very farmhousy but after testing the gravity, there doesnt seem to be any real fermentation happening. I'm tempted to move it to a carboy, and pitch some dregs I grown up.

 

[Dextersmom]

Throw out anything with fuschia spots, that's botulism.

might have been mentioned, TLDR, but thats likely serratia not botulinum toxin.