Specialty Grains: few basics

[Paulgs3]

Just a few basic questions about specialty grains:

Which grains need to be "mashed" and which ones need to be "steeped" ?

A few of my past recipes said 20 minutes @ 160, some said 30-60 minutes, is there a break down listed somewhere which displays how each grain is supposed to be treated for desired effects?

When formulating a recipe that calls for 8#s of DME and I want to add 1.5#s of grains, do I need to cut back on the DME? If so how much?

Thanks in advance,

Paul

 

[bonzombiekitty]

I've had this confusion myself. You mash if you want to convert the starch in the grains to sugar, steep if you want the flavor. Depending on the particular recipe you might mash a given grain but steep it in another.

I don't do all grain, and personally, I just avoid the confusion and mash any grains I use. I get the flavor I would from steeping, plus some extra sugar which I'm all for.

 

[7HockeyDad]

In general, Crystal / Caramel malts can be steeped because the starches have already been converted. Most base malts need mashing to convert their starches to sugars and won't do much for you if steeped. John Palmer's book has a section on this and you can find an online version at www.howtobrew.com.

Also you can taste malts to see what it will do for your beer. If starches have already been converted you should taste some sweetness. Your LHBS should be able to easily let you know the best malts for steeping as well.

I thought I saw an online reference that also described in general which could be mashed vs. steeped but I don't remember where.

 

[FromZwolle]

Just a few basic questions about specialty grains:

Which grains need to be "mashed" and which ones need to be "steeped" ?

A few of my past recipes said 20 minutes @ 160, some said 30-60 minutes, is there a break down listed somewhere which displays how each grain is supposed to be treated for desired effects?

When formulating a recipe that calls for 8#s of DME and I want to add 1.5#s of grains, do I need to cut back on the DME? If so how much?

Thanks in advance,

Paul

do you have the recipe already planned out? what is the original gravity you are aiming for? if you are mashing the 1.5#s of grains it will change the gravity, and you will need to adjust the amount of dme. the general formula is .6(grains)=DME, so to keep the same gravity, reduce the dme by .9 pounds.

 

[tamoore]

I'm making a brew in a couple of weeks that uses 2lbs of pale 2 row with some other specialty grains (5lbs total), along with 6lbs of wheat extract.

What's the difference between mashing and steeping? I'm planning on heating up about a gallon of water to 154, holding it there putting the crushed grains in a muslin bag, and keeping them in that water at +/- 2 degrees for about 45 minutes (by riding the flame), then 'sparging' through the bag in a strainer with another gallon. Isn't this effectively doing the same thing as mashing? I think I'll need the extra sugar from the 2 row....

 

[bonzombiekitty]

What's the difference between mashing and steeping?

Basic difference is the temp of the water, amount of water, and length of time.

I'm planning on heating up about a gallon of water to 154, holding it there putting the crushed grains in a muslin bag, and keeping them in that water at +/- 2 degrees for about 45 minutes (by riding the flame), then 'sparging' through the bag in a strainer with another gallon. Isn't this effectively doing the same thing as mashing?

Yeah, that sounds like mashing to me, if the water to grain ratio is about 1.5qt per pound of grain and you sparge with 170 degree water. Plus you are using 2row pale malt, which is a base malt, which doesn't have the starch converted and a good amount of enzymes in it to do the conversion, so you'll be mashing.

 

[KayaBrew]

This may clarify things...

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/Malts_Chart

 

[BeerJorge]

Paul,

It really all depends... you don't exactly need to cut back on DME as long as you are not brewing a specific style of beer in which case you need to stay within specific Gravity readings as well as Color in beer.

Here's a guide that can help you figure out which malts need mashing or steeping...

Home Brewing Malt

 

[FromZwolle]

I'm making a brew in a couple of weeks that uses 2lbs of pale 2 row with some other specialty grains (5lbs total), along with 6lbs of wheat extract.

What's the difference between mashing and steeping? I'm planning on heating up about a gallon of water to 154, holding it there putting the crushed grains in a muslin bag, and keeping them in that water at +/- 2 degrees for about 45 minutes (by riding the flame), then 'sparging' through the bag in a strainer with another gallon. Isn't this effectively doing the same thing as mashing? I think I'll need the extra sugar from the 2 row....

that's pretty much a mash. you might find it helpful to use a double boiler to keep steady temps. it really helps me when i do the occasional partial mash. take a skillet or other pan that will have just enough room to fit your pot in. fill about 1/2-1" of water in the pan and rest the pot in the pan. it really helps spread out the heat and keeps temp fluctuations down.

 

[dcp27]

Basic difference is the temp of the water, amount of water, and length of time.

+ enzymes. no enzymes = no conversion = not a mash. if you're using a base malt (pilsner, 2-row, wheat, etc), then you're causing enzyme activity and mashing. if it's just caramel and roasted malts, then its a steep.

 

[Paulgs3]

Great information! Thank you for all the feedback!!

Paul

 

[pcollins]

@Kayabrew: Best chart ever!!

Yeah, check the chart first and maybe, just maybe, don't trust your LHBS. (I didn't say that out loud.)

I went and picked up some ingredients last week at a brewery/U-brew and they gave me Maris Otter as I was looking for a steeping grain that was mid-pale. All they had was that and Crystal 120. I asked if I had to mash the MO or if I could just steep it. "No, no, you can just steep it, it's fine." Apparently not. Not that it made a huge difference to my brew day but I do like to keep things simple.

Lesson learned...

 

[FromZwolle]

@Kayabrew: Best chart ever!!

Yeah, check the chart first and maybe, just maybe, don't trust your LHBS. (I didn't say that out loud.)

I went and picked up some ingredients last week at a brewery/U-brew and they gave me Maris Otter as I was looking for a steeping grain that was mid-pale. All they had was that and Crystal 120. I asked if I had to mash the MO or if I could just steep it. "No, no, you can just steep it, it's fine." Apparently not. Not that it made a huge difference to my brew day but I do like to keep things simple.

Lesson learned...

steep maris otter? that was definitely an employee, not a brewer.

 

[pcollins]

For now I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt that perhaps he didn't understand the difference. Still, this backwater of LHBS that we have in Ontario keeps rearing it's ugly head.

 

[surreal_trip]

yup, its friggin horrible!

 

[FromZwolle]

well, at least there's always hbt.

 

[homebrewer_99]

I put together this chart using the info in Palmer's How To Brew. It doesn't look exactly like this (but the info is correct). I also laminated it and carry it in my wallet for when I go to the LHBS:

Base Malts - Mashed Only
American 2 row
American 6 row
Pilsner Malt
Continental Pilsner
British Pale Ale
Rye
Wheat

Kilned Malts - Mashed Only
Vienna
Munich
Aromatic (20L)
Biscuit (25L)
Victory (28L)
Melanoidin (28L)
Special Roast (50L)
Brown (70L)
German Beechwood / Smoked Rauch

Roasted Malts - Mashed or Steeped
Carapils / Dextrine
Crystal (15L)
Honey Malt (18L)
CaraVienna (20L)
Crystal (40L)
CaraMunich (60L)
Crystal (60L)
Crystal (80L)
Crystal (120L)
Special “B” (120L)
Meussdoerffer Rost (200L)

Kiln / Roasted Malts - Mashed or Steeped
Pale Chocolate (200L)
Light Roasted Barley (300L)
Chocolate (350L)
Chocolate (420L)
Carafa Special II (430L)
Chocolate (475L)
Roasted Barley (450L)
Roasted Barley (500L)
Black Barley (500L)
Black Patent (525L)
Roasted Barley (575L)
Black (600L)

I also have another chart I made for weight conversions for grain-LME-DME. If you want a copy of both just email me: [email protected]. Same offer goes out to anyone who is interested.

Also, you would need to cut back on your DME by 14.4 oz.

 

[FromZwolle]

copy, paste, stolen. very nice chart.

 

[7HockeyDad]

kaya / homebrewer99,

Both of those are great resources. Thx.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/Malts_Chart
I think the wiki chart will become my standby for developing just the right malt profiles in my future "Art in fermented form" to steal from New Holland's slogan.