Sparging

[captaineriv]

I'm still trying to understand how to effectively sparge and what's required to get the most out of it. Say if I follow some general guidelines and use a total of 10 lbs. of grain (about 2 lbs. of which will probably be specialty grains) and about 1.3 quarts of water for every lb. of grain in the mash, and 2 quarts of water for every lb. of grain to sparge with (and do the process correctly). I calculate that I'm ending up with about 8.25 gallons of wort going into the brewpot if I use ALL of the sparge water. However, my brewpot is only 7 gallons. If I don't use all of the sparge water, and just stop sparging when the brewpot's at capacity, am I sacrificing a noticable amount of potential fermentables? I got the 7-gallon brewpot a while back because I was on a budget, and everything I read said that 30 quarts is generally sufficient for a standard AG batch. It seems to me that 8 lbs. of base malt with 2 lbs. of specialty grain would qualify, more or less, as a batch of standard gravity. Please help clear this up for me.

captaineriv

 

[Orfy]

10lbs of grain is the top end OG for standard beer. I've seen big ales with graind bills of 20lb!!!!

My Calculations For 10lbs

Give

Mashing with 3.25 gallon
1st Run off 1.75 gallon
Sparge with 4.76
2nd run off 4.23 gallon

Total wort collected 5.98 gallon
Water added to boil 1.68 Gallon

If you reduce the amount you'll likey end up with a smaller amount of jigher gravity beer.

How about splitting the wort and broiling some in a pot on the stove top?

 

[GABrewboy]

I had this same question about a week ago, but after figuring out that the grains will soak up a ton of the water added, this is where you will end up with the 6 gallons of wort.......am I correct on this or not?

 

[DeRoux's Broux]

yep, the grains will absorb so much water. 10 lbs will probably absorb 1.5 gallons or so. daptaineriv, try this web site to figure about how much water you'll need. it includes water loses due to system, grains, etc.
http://www.allaboutbeer.com/homebrew/water.html

 

[captaineriv]

I never thought about the fact that the grains would absorb the water. Makes a lot of sense though. Thanks guys.


captaineriv

 

[captaineriv]

I read the information at http://www.allaboutbeer.com/homebrew/water.html and it answered pretty much all of my questions, but I am still confused with one thing. Near the bottom of the page, it says:

"Multiply your grain weight by the ratio of water with which you will mash. In this case, we'll use 1.33 qts/lb, giving us 2.8 gallons of mash water. If your mash tun has a false bottom like mine does, you'll need to add enough water to fill the space below the false bottom. In my case, this volume is one gallon, so I would use 3.8 gallons of water in the mash process."

For comparison purposes, if we assume that my brew has the exact same grist/water ratio as the one in the example and that the volume on my setup below the false bottom is also one gallon, would I use all 3.8 gallons mentioned above in my 20 qt brewpot that I use for mashing, or would I use 2.8 in the pot and directly add the other 1 gallon of water below the false bottom before pouring the mash into the lauter tun?

captaineriv

 

[DeRoux's Broux]

basicaly, the extra gallon is going to cover the false bottom or manifold, which ever type you use.
when i used a cooler for a mash tun, i'd have my water at 165 degrees and add enough to cover my bazooka screen( or it can be a false bottom). then i would dump in my grains, then i would add the remainder of the 165 degree mash water, stirring to make sure i do not get any dough balls, and cover and let rest for 60 minutes. it just makes up for water that will be left behind from the sparge, in the bottom of the mash tun. my valve on my mash tun now, is about the same, a gallon of deadspace. so i add an extra gallon to my needed mash water to account for that.

hope i answered your question?

 

[captaineriv]

I'm still not sure. Let me describe the process I was planning to use and you can let me know if I'm overly complicating it. I was going to do a single-step infusion mash by heating water in a 20 qt pot on the stove to around 168ish. Then I was going to add the grain and hold at around 155 for 60-90 minutes. Next, I would add direct heat from the burner to the kettle to mash out at 170 for 15 minutes. Finally, I would pour the entire mash from the kettle into my mash tun (a modified round water cooler with a false bottom), recirculate, sparge, and let run into my larger 30 qt. pot. Since my mash tun is well insulated, should I just do the entire mash in there instead of the kettle on the stove, and then add hot water at the end to bring to mash-out temp?

captaineriv

 

[DeRoux's Broux]

yep, just use the modified cooler for the entire mash/sparge rahter than including an extra step. it would be tough to pour all that into the cooler. go to www.cruisenews.net/brewing/ click on the simple all-grain brewing on the left and it will go through, step by step on a set-up just like you have. this worked real well for me until i got my 3-tier keg system set-up.

your on the right track!

 

[El Pistolero]

Since my mash tun is well insulated, should I just do the entire mash in there instead of the kettle on the stove, and then add hot water at the end to bring to mash-out temp?

Yes, do it that way.

 

[captaineriv]

Thanks a lot! I've done a partial-mash before with only about 3 lbs. of base malt, and I just used a strainer and strainer-bag over a bucket for the recirculating/sparging process since it was such a small amount. But this will be my first attempt at AG probably coming up around the new year.

captaineriv

 

[sdent]

Original Quote
"Mashing with 3.25 gallon
1st Run off 1.75 gallon
Sparge with 4.76
2nd run off 4.23 gallon

Total wort collected 5.98 gallon
Water added to boil 1.68 Gallon"

Wouldn't you want to keep sparging to get the total volume of water in the boil instead of just adding fresh water to the boil? That way you can get more potential sugars left behind.

 

[DeRoux's Broux]

depends. you need to check the ph level to make sure tannins aren't extracted w/ the liquor into the boil kettle.

 

[Mikey]

An easy way to go about this is to stop sparging when:

1) you've reached your maximum pre-boil volume

2) your sparge gravity has dropped to 1.010 (some say 1.000)

3) you've hit your target pre-boil wort OG.

Whichever you hit first. That way you don't have to do back flips worrying about sparge water volume. If you find that your post boil OG is always too low, and there's no other reason to explain the low efficiency, just use more malt the next time. Brewing shouldn't be complicated.

 

[user 574]

I've relaxed with the amt of sparge water as well. As long as I got enough to get to my pre-boil target and I've not dropped below 1.010 I'm a happy camper. FWIW, I seem to always get 7g pre-boil and am usually at 1.015-1.020+ on my gravity check at 7g.

 

[Lost]

Don't overthink it. Get the mash volume somewhere between 1 and 1.5 qts per lb and you'll be fine. Thick mashes have faster starch conversion and less fermentables (thicker, sweeter beer).. thin mashes are of course the opposite. Sparge until you have the right volume of wort or until your runnings drop below 1.008 SG.
Here are a few reminders:
1. remember to recirculate the first quart or so that comes out of the mash/lauter tun.. gently pour that back in and run the rest of it into your kettle. If you batch sparge you'll want to gently stir the mash after adding your sparge water; if you do this then you'll need to recirculate again if the runnings aren't fairly clear (like apple cider).
2. Sparge temp should not exceed 175.. 170 is probably a safer bet.
3. Sparge slow.. the slower the sparge the greater the efficiency.. 60 min is probably the minimum time. 1 qt per minute is a good bet.
4. Fly sparging is superior to batch sparging and easier IMO
5. If your runnings drop below 1.008 before the kettle is full then you're almost certainly sparging too fast.

I also agree with the others in that you mash tun should also be your lauter tun. You don't want to be pouring that hot sticky stuff.. you'd have one heck of a mess. Besides you risk hot side aeration if you pour the mash... Just build a copper manifold for your cooler and do the mash/lauter in that.. it's simple and it saves having another vessel to clean up. Good luck.

 

[Beermaker]

Ah hell, gather up 6 gallons, boil it down to 5, add some more and boil it down till you boil all you gather. No big deal. May take a bit longer to do it that way with a 7 gallon kettle.

 

[eolle]

Ah hell, gather up 6 gallons, boil it down to 5, add some more and boil it down till you boil all you gather. No big deal. May take a bit longer to do it that way with a 7 gallon kettle.

Right on!

It doesn't really matter what sparging method you use (batch v. continous) or even the water temp that much all that really matters is that you have enough voulume in your boil. I've seen everything done and almost everytime it makes good beer.

Don't worry too much. I can dig out the nasty column chrom. calculations if you want them...but they take time away from making beer . I wish I would have learned that lesson earlier.

-Eric