Some questions about oxidation

[Erythro73]

Hi!
I've just bought my equipment from my LHBS. I bought, among other things, a 8 gallons plastic bucket which is supposed to be the primary fermenter and a 3 gallons glass carboy which is supposed to be the secondary fermenter. I have an airlock, but no fermentation hose. I asked specifically for a 3 gallons glass carboy because I just didn't want to do a 5 gallons batch.

Now, what I was wondering is, is there a problem with oxydation if I do my primary fermentation in a 8 gallons bucket if I only do a 2.5 gallons batch? I mean, there's a lot of oxygen trapped down there. OK, this is only for what? 3-4 days, so will it deeply affect the taste if I put it quickly in my secondary fermenter?

Second question : how do I transfer my beer from the primary fermenter to the secondary one? I mean, in all possible way, I have to open the plastic pucket to put my siphon there and to have my secondary fermenter open to. Is it important or not?

Thank you very much!

 

[HawaiianHippie]

The oxygen will get displaced by CO2 pretty quickly. As long as your bucket seals well and you use an airlock, no worries.

 

[WOP31]

You will be fine fermenting in the bucket, as the HawaiianHippie pointed out the air in the headspace will quickly be replaced with co2. So no problem in the primary. When you rack to the secondary, the co2 is heavier then the o2 so it will basically create a "blanket" of co2 on top of the beer in primary.

You were very smart in choosing the 3 gallon carboys as your secondaries, by reducing the headspace you reduce the amount of o2 in there, and there should be enough off gassing and slight fermentation clean up in the secondary that there will be a little "blanket" of co2 in there in a day or two.

Cheers and welcome to the world of home brewing!

 

[enderwig]

OK, this is only for what? 3-4 days,

Do yourself a favor and disregard the instructions that said to primary for 3-4 days. give it 2 weeks, at least. You can thank me later!

 

[Erythro73]

Well, that's very straightforward . Thank you all!

Enderwig : I thought I should change ASAP from primary to secondary, because plastic isn't so permeable to oxygen. And that, well, to have a greater beer, I should've to switch as soon as fermentation becomes a lot less spectacular....

 

[enderwig]

Oxygen permeation of fermenting buckets isn't an issue unless you are talking about aging beer in them. You are fine to have beer in your fermenting buckets for up to 4 - 6 weeks. I never primary less than 2 weeks. If you move off the yeast cake too early, they have no time to "clean" the beer. They remove some of the off flavors that they created as a by-product of fermentation. Also, if you beer is not quite finished, moving it off the yeast cake, will stall it. When it comes to fermentation, trust your hydrometer, not a timeline. Beer is made, not scheduled!

 

[Erythro73]

Oxygen permeation of fermenting buckets isn't an issue unless you are talking about aging beer in them. You are fine to have beer in your fermenting buckets for up to 4 - 6 weeks. I never primary less than 2 weeks. If you move off the yeast cake too early, they have no time to "clean" the beer. They remove some of the off flavors that they created as a by-product of fermentation. Also, if you beer is not quite finished, moving it off the yeast cake, will stall it. When it comes to fermentation, trust your hydrometer, not a timeline. Beer is made, not scheduled!

4-6 weeks? But... Palmer and Papazian both seem to say that after 3 weeks, the sediment in the bottom of the bucket will alter the taste with some off-flavors. I'm a little confused here.

 

[ChshreCat]

That's much more of a concern for big brewers. It's much more of a boogeyman for home brewers. I've gone over a month and tasted no sign of autolysis at all. Some folks on here have gone well beyond that. There are old rules that were followed because they were always followed, and they don't always hold up to experience.

 

[pilotdane]

CO2 is heavier than air so even the slightest amount of CO2 will lie on top of the beer providing protection. Opening the lid of your fermentor is a no no because the slightest air current can disturb the protective layer of gas and introduct some air (with oxygen).

 

[Erythro73]

Well, then, it all comes down to my previous questions, pilotdane. How am I supposed to siphon the beer from my primary to my secondary without introducing oxygen?

You said I should not open the lid of my fermentor. Well, then, how am I supposed to introduce my siphon? Because, I need to at least remove the air-lock of my fermenter which will basically cause disturbance in my fermenter and introduce oxygen. And well, the hole is bigger than my siphon.

Then, when the beer will come out of the siphon, it would go in the glass carboy where there are no CO2 and well... it will be exposed to oxygen.

 

[ChshreCat]

Well, then, it all comes down to my previous questions, pilotdane. How am I supposed to siphon the beer from my primary to my secondary without introducing oxygen?

You said I should not open the lid of my fermentor. Well, then, how am I supposed to introduce my siphon? Because, I need to at least remove the air-lock of my fermenter which will basically cause disturbance in my fermenter and introduce oxygen. And well, the hole is bigger than my siphon.

Then, when the beer will come out of the siphon, it would go in the glass carboy where there are no CO2 and well... it will be exposed to oxygen.

It's not THAT vital. You'll never create an O2 free atmosphere to transfer into. Just keep splashing to a minimum when you rack over and you're just fine. You don't have to try to keep every molecule of oxygen away from your beer. Relax (etc.)

 

[Nugu]

When you rack you do remove the bucket lid, bucket is full of co2 above the beer still (co2 is heavier than air) protecting it. (The mantra of "do not open the bucket" generally refers to any other time than racking)

There will be some splashing when you start the siphon to secondary but do not be alarmed because unless you really go nuts it won't do anything.

In secondary SOME co2 gas will be released by the beer, not nearly as much as in primary. This is why you want the small head space. That small amount of gas will displace the oxygen above the beer again. (If you secondary in a large container, it's not likely enough gas would be released to cover the surface)

Edit: Also do a search for "long primary", you'll be glad you did after messing with secondaries for a few batches.

 

[Erythro73]

Thanks a lot guy .

Yeah, I'll try to relax a little bit . I just want to have a good first beer . So I'm asking a lot of questions to clarify a little bit on what I've read.

 

[david_42]

Oxygen is not a problem at the beginning of the fermentation cycle because the yeast need it for growth. They stop growing when the O2 runs low and start producing CO2.