Soda Keg Score --- now how to clean?

[kpr121]

Hey all, its been a while since I've posted here. Brewing kind of fell off the priority list for a couple years - Ive brewed but not with the obsession I previously had. Anyway, after spending way too much money on commercial beer my wife and I are ready to get back into the swing of things - we'd like to brew a bunch this winter while other hobbies don't take up so much of our time (gardening, fishing, camping, etc). In order to make that work I needed a few additional fermenters/vessels to store the brew in the 'pipeline', so I started looking for deals on carboys, buckets, kegs, etc. And I happened upon this:



A total 26 pin lock kegs (mix of firestone and Cornelius style) for a price I couldn't pass up (lets just say they were well under $20 per keg). They seem to be in great shape physically but they are all either full of soda or were emptied and never cleaned. Some of them appear to have leaked and have sticky soda all over their exterior. Hopefully they hold pressure - I didn't check them all - I figured I would need to get them all cleaned up first anyhow.

So I'm planning on building one of those DIY submersible pump keg/carboy cleaner things, have already ordered new orings for them all, and am making up some DIY PBW (oxyclean and TSP/90).

I also have to make a decision on how to deal with my existing kegging setup which is all ball locks (a total of around 10 or so kegs). It uses John Guest fittings and MFLs so changing between the two wont be terrible but I might just make the decision to swap out completely to pin locks, selling off the ball locks or relegating them to long term storage vessels that don't get put in use often.

TL : DR - Bought a bunch of dirty soda filled pinlock kegs for a killer price. Excited about it but have to clean them up and also decide what to do with existing ball lock setup. Looking for any input/thoughts.

 

[Stealthcruiser]

With that many kegs, I would make two washers.
One to wash, and one to sanitize before storage.

On the washer one, since the outsides are dirty, tap into, and design a manifold, that will spray the outsides as well.

 

[kpr121]

That's a novel idea to fab something up that would spray the outsides too ... I was hoping that just allowing the inverted top of the keg soak in the cleaner would get the gunk off - there's only 3 or 4 that have really dirty side walls - it would be cheating if I didn't have to scrub anything at all!

I like the idea of clean and sanitize with separate washers. Probably would need to give them a quick rinse between steps to get the residual PBW off and keep it from contaminating the sanitizer.

Realistically I am probably not going to be cleaning all of these at one time... I will probably end up cleaning them in batches of 3 or 4 at a time given I'll want to recirculate the cleanser for 15 or 20 minutes at a time. Adding in the time to replace O-rings and get all the hardware (diptubes, posts) disassembled and reassembled that would probably take me a few hours to do 4.

 

[kpr121]

Oh maybe I should fab up a multi-keg cleaner - pump running to a PVC manifold that has multiple stickups - each stickup spraying one keg. I could put that all inside a big Rubbermaid container (bathtub even) and knockout 4 to 6 at a time. Probably would need a pretty strong pump though...

 

[pshankstar]

Congrats on the find! OP I scored four free pin lock kegs this summer in a similar state. They all had some residue left inside.

I hosed them out first. Then filled each one with hot water and oxi-clean free for a good 15 mins or so. Then I ran them through my keg washing setup for a good 10 minutes each with fresh hot water and oxo-clean solution. Followed by another 15 minute rinse cycle. The soaking helped breakup everything and then the washer flushed everything really good. I still took them apart afterwards and replaced all the o-rings but let them soak too. It was a lot of work, but for the great price it's worth the elbow grease put into it.

I am setup for ball lock connectors too. I thought about leaving them as pin locks since all my lines have the MFL fitting, but I decided I would like to stick with one standard. I found the best price to replace the posts were from Adventures In Homebrewing. Good luck and congrats!

 

[kpr121]

pshankstar - Thanks for input. I did see those conversion kits from AIH but that would nearly double the cost of my kegs ... I am thinking that with so many I'd be better suited to just switch over entirely to a pin lock system - that would only require replacing a half dozen or so quick disconnect connectors in my kegerator and on transfer/misc lines I have. Selling my 8 or 10 ball locks will probably pay for all the kegs and all the connectors I need and still end up money ahead honestly. I don't see needing more than 26 kegs, ever. (Famous last words, I know).

I think you got the right idea with doing a pre-clean rinse and soak. That should keep the efficacy of the cleaner up. I was thinking I would completely disassemble them and remove the O-rings as a very first step. Soak all the hardware in the same container during the entire cleaning process. Then replace orings and reassemble, and run sanitizer through them.

Something like is what I was thinking with a multi keg washer. The picture is of a bottle washer, but you get the idea. I have a medium duty submersible float switch pump (probably somewhere around 2500 to 3000 gallons per hour). I'm wondering if I would have enough pressure if I teed off to four risers - would probably use 1" or 1 1/2" pipe.

 

[pshankstar]

@kpr121, here is a photo of the keg washer I put together. The tubing that goes straight up from the "t" connector can be swapped out for a shorter one. This helps when I am washing fermenters or my smaller 2.5 gallon keg. I place this in an old fermenting bucket with the cleaning solution, then drain it and rinse it off and place it into a home depot bucket with hot water to rinse the keg or fermenter. It works great and when I need to recirculate cold water for my immersion chiller in the summer, I place the pump in a cooler with ice water and attach a hose to the pump. I thought I would share this with you. Good luck and cheers!

 

[cabron99]

One keg washer will do you fine. I have 42 kegs which cycle through a 15 tap kegerater, and unless you drink a whole lot more than I do, you will find that you will tend to save up empties until you have 3-4 and then make a short project out of it.

pao

 

[kpr121]

pshank - awesome, simple, effective design. Love that it can be multipurposed.

Cabron - You're probably right. These kegs have sat for the better part of 20 years with soda remnants in them, I suppose another couple weeks/months/years wont hurt them all that much. Clean as I need them is probably the simplest way to go.

 

[MaryB]

55 gallon plastic open top barrel fill with cleaner and submerge 2-3 kegs at a time and let soak 24 hours. Add a small submersible heater to keep it warm so it works better.

 

[Stealthcruiser]

55 gallon plastic open top barrel fill with cleaner and submerge 2-3 kegs at a time and let soak 24 hours. Add a small submersible heater to keep it warm so it works better.

Might as well throw in a pond pump too, to keep stuffs moving.......

 

[JohnSand]

You might sell half of them to fund your new hardware and washer parts.

 

[kpr121]

Well I got three cleaned somewhat the “old fashioned” way today. It wasn’t all that bad to be honest.

I did rig up a pond pump with a 1/2 inch pvc pipe, set it in a bucket with the keg inverted over it (all connections removed) and circulated some hot oxyclean while I cleaned another keg a large Rubbermaid container that I could lay the keg flat in. This allowed me to scrub the outside and both top and bottom really well. The black rubber was really oxidized and getting everywhere. I might hit them with some tire shine or something to try to protect it from deteriorating even more.

Swapped out all the o rings, lubed them up, and rebuilt them. I’ll be getting my pin lock QDs tomorrow so I’ll be able to pressure test them, sanitize, and hopefully fill a couple of them up with “Brown Trout Stout” (ESBish, Mild-ish ale)

 

[Stealthcruiser]

I might hit them with some tire shine or something to try to protect it from deteriorating even more.

Tire shine would look bitchin', but I'd keep it and similar products away from the keg rubber, ( just me!), 'cause it's loaded with Silicone, which ain't good to have around carbonated anything, as far as head retention.........As in it ain't good in a brewery.

It contaminates stuff.......Kinda' like having a can of WD-40, in a paint shop.........Not a good idea.

 

[augiedoggy]

I just wash mine in the bathtub with the sprayer attachment I use to give my dog a bath... the soda syrup will wash away very easily with a sponge and some oxyclean or pbw... If it was beer it would require a bit more effort.

Seal rebuild kits are $2-3 from places like chi or ebay to rebuild them.
youll find if you only brew 5 gallons at a time, in the future after they are all clean that pulling the keg cleaner out is just as much work as just cleaning it by hand... they dont need to be fully disassembled each time after cleaning the keg tank just add some starsan mix and pressurize and release the starsan mix through the poppets under pressure that will clean them out unless you are adding hops directly to the keg or are in the habit of putting trub in the kegs.

 

[kpr121]

Augie- thanks for the input. I brew 10 gallon batches and might end up fermenting in these kegs (or at least using them as no-chill vessels) so I think the keg washer will be valuable in the future. I luckily had ordered 100 packs of orings a few years back for poppets, posts, and diptubes so the only thing I needed to buy were the lid orings, which I found for under $1 a piece.

Two of three of the kegs held pressure, the third was no surprise as it was missing the gas diptube (not sure if I lost it or if it was never there - don't remember). I'll probably work my way through the rest of the 26, putting aside the kegs that need 'something', and order all the parts I need at one time.

Heres a photo of the cleaned kegs and a video of the washer (better bottle used so you can actually see whats going on). I plan to make a more permanent riser and also tee off with QDs to clean the posts and diptubes at the same time - but for now this works since I break down the keg completely before cleaning anyhow.

 

[augiedoggy]

I have a number of kegs myself... The majority of them still sit in the closet unrebuilt (some still full of soda) as well as 5-10 gallon ball lock kegs... The issue I have is that I dont have enough refrigerated space to keep more than 5 at a time cold I do have the blow off valve for basically secondary /natural carbing in them but that leaves a lot of yeast at the bottom as a tradeoff which does clear up after a handful of pints if the keg isnt moved.
So I end up reusing the same 7-8 kegs while the other sit. I find that as long as I leave them sealed and under pressure when they ere empty they clean up very easy. so I clean 2 at a time as I need them since I also usually do 10 gallons... ironically I dont use my 10 gallon kegs often because I like to let one keg condition or dry out more and if I use it in my kegerator I can only fit 2 (one 10 and one 5) vs 3-5 gallon kegs for my 3 taps.

 

[kpr121]

Yeah, when I say I'll 'work my way through the rest of the 26', that might take 2 months or it might take 2 years. Thinking I'd like to get through at least 15 or so which would let me gradually swap out and sell the 8 to 10 ball lock kegs I have in rotation now.

 

[pshankstar]

I have a number of kegs myself... The majority of them still sit in the closet unrebuilt (some still full of soda) as well as 5-10 gallon ball lock kegs... The issue I have is that I dont have enough refrigerated space to keep more than 5 at a time cold I do have the blow off valve for basically secondary /natural carbing in them but that leaves a lot of yeast at the bottom as a tradeoff which does clear up after a handful of pints if the keg isnt moved.
So I end up reusing the same 7-8 kegs while the other sit. I find that as long as I leave them sealed and under pressure when they ere empty they clean up very easy. so I clean 2 at a time as I need them since I also usually do 10 gallons... ironically I dont use my 10 gallon kegs often because I like to let one keg condition or dry out more and if I use it in my kegerator I can only fit 2 (one 10 and one 5) vs 3-5 gallon kegs for my 3 taps.

On a side note. Hey @augiedoggy if you are ever interested in selling any of your 10 gallon ball lock kegs, please let me know! I'm about 1.5 hours away. I've been looking for larger corny kegs to ferment in, but for now I have been using extra 5 gallon kegs and splitting the fermentation into two kegs (3 gallons each) then pushing them both over to a serving keg. It would be nice to have one or two larger kegs to ferment in instead of 4 kegs for 10 gallons of finished beer. Also, my cleaning time would be cut in half too.

Or if you know of a good place to find them at a decent price, please PM me. Cheers!

 

[augiedoggy]

Yeah, when I say I'll 'work my way through the rest of the 26', that might take 2 months or it might take 2 years. Thinking I'd like to get through at least 15 or so which would let me gradually swap out and sell the 8 to 10 ball lock kegs I have in rotation now.

I use a combination of both types and bought plastic leur fittings to easliy swap between the two types of connectors... sometimes the different dimensions of each have advantages...

As far as welling the 10 gallon kegs, Sorry I know once I break down and build a large keezer they will get used... plus I'm opening a 3bbl nano and they might come in handy there. I know right were Canandaigua is though... I have some equipment I maintain for work out there. if I find myself changing my mind ill let you know... I got them for $20 each on craiglist but they were all missing hardware I had to source.

 

[kpr121]

I use a combination of both types and bought plastic leur fittings to easliy swap between the two types of connectors... sometimes the different dimensions of each have advantages...

As far as welling the 10 gallon kegs, Sorry I know once I break down and build a large keezer they will get used... plus I'm opening a 3bbl nano and they might come in handy there. I know right were Canandaigua is though... I have some equipment I maintain for work out there. if I find myself changing my mind ill let you know... I got them for $20 each on craiglist but they were all missing hardware I had to source.

That's a good point. I know I can fit five ball locks on the floor of my keezer. I'm 98% sure 5 pinlocks wont fit. I'll have to play around with that to see what configuration or combination will work. I use John Guest fittings and MFLs so swapping really wont be much of an issue. The other thing I could do is swap out the posts so I have tall skinny pin locks, if they have the same thread size.