Sea-buckthorn berries

[Larsen]

Hi

I'm about to brew a batch of Saison, and i wan't to add a small amount of sea-buckthorn.

I just don't have any idea how much. I just want a hint of the berry in the final beer.

I brew 150 liters and i want to add it in the kettel the last 10 minutes of the boil. I'm planning for 100g for the batch.

If you have experience with this pleace reply.

Thanks

 

[myerstyson]

Subscribing to this thread as where I live now, these berries grow everywhere.

 

[Hujo]

A 100 grams for 150 liters? Unless you're a homeopath, that's very very low. Even if you want it very subtle, i'd say 5 kg is minimum. I'd probably add them to the fermenter as well.

 

[Kiichi]

This is an interesting one. I know sea buckthorn is a really potent fruit, delivering a lot of sour and flavor even in small amounts. Really needs sweetness to balance that out usually. I know several brews using it (including it in a Randall for a double IPA which was amazing), the most prominent of which is Mikkeller Spontan Sea Buckthorn, which is tasty but teeth scrubbing sour.

Thus I mostly advice to be cautionary. I have no actual idea what impact 100g on 150L will make, especially if you just want a hint, but damn, be careful. When you get the note you want you will also get a bit of tartness. Better add too little initially and add a bit more in secondary before you overdo it.

I´d say get a feel for them by adding one pureed berry to a pint and see how intense that is. That should give you a ballpark and allow you to dial the amount in. See what amount in a pint you need for a hint and then apply that to the large batch...then halve it cause of the longer exposure maybe.

 

[Hujo]

Yes, it's a sour berry, especially when fermented out, but I still think that amount is very low. The mikkeler beer contains lacto, which is the main reason for that beers acidity. The idea of testing in a glass is good, but keep in mind that it takes a while for the flavors to blend.

 

[Kiichi]

Yes, it's a sour berry, especially when fermented out, but I still think that amount is very low. The mikkeler beer contains lacto, which is the main reason for that beers acidity. The idea of testing in a glass is good, but keep in mind that it takes a while for the flavors to blend.

Yeah, of course the main culprit for the sourness in the Mikkeller brew is not the sea buckthorn, but compared to others from the same range, which I assume use the same basic beer, it is much sourer imho.

You are right about the flavors blending, I have no idea how long that will take in such a situation. Also don´t know how many fit in a Randall, cause there it was pronounced but did not overtake.

 

[ong]

I haven't used them, but my understanding is that they're pretty oily. I'd think you might want to separate out the fatty layer before brewing with them. I generally do all fruit as a secondary addition, rather than in the boil, although, again, no experience with sea buckthorn.

 

[Kiichi]

I haven't used them, but my understanding is that they're pretty oily. I'd think you might want to separate out the fatty layer before brewing with them. I generally do all fruit as a secondary addition, rather than in the boil, although, again, no experience with sea buckthorn.

Interesting thought about the oil, don´t know but perhaps something to consider.

I too prefer secondary. That way I can throw them in and then taste from the tap every hour until I think they are right (which usually means the slightest tad over what I aim for). Then I can rack it off and have full controll. This is also a fast process, cause if you do a puree this is literally a matter of one day maximum, maybe less than 2h in this case.

Just threw some vodka disinfected green tea (0.88 oz into 5gallons) in the secondary of one of my brews and am glad that I tasted in these increments, cause I had to pull them out after 4h cause it would have gotten way too strong. It´s really upfront now too, but alright and balanced for the concept.

 

[Hujo]

Yeah, the seeds contain some fat, and the flesh contains fat-acids like omega 3,6 and 7. I really don't know how or if fat acids affect head retention, but i wouldn't worry about the oil from the seeds, since you need to press them to extract the fat, just like any kernel.

 

[Larsen]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts..

I'll stick to my 100 grams, at let you know by the end of march how i t tasted.

I brewed a wit with fresh lemon grass, and used 3 sticks in a batch (10 min. boil). The first 2 - 3 months it's very nice, but then the lemon really starts to kick in, and after 6 month it's very dominating and not plesant anymore.

Thanks.

 

[BourbonSprings]

I don't know jack about making the fermented sea buckthorn alcoholic juice, but as a chef, I am very interested.
I see that a lot of you are concerned about the high fat content of the sea buckthorn. I am familiar with a Russian product, called Sea Buckthorn Oil.
Are you guys discarding this oil? Because I bet you could sell that by-product for premium $$$ in NYC!!!!
I would buy.

Best,

Emily C.
Bourbon Springs
425 Graham Ave.
Brooklyn, 11211

 

[terrenum]

Bump this thread!!
Any hints/learnings?
I am planning to brew a saison with a lactobacillus kettle sour process and then add Seabuckthorn in secondary aprox. 4 weeks after brewing and 8 weeks before bottling. I will be adding brett as well so want to brett to have time to develop their flavour profile
thanks for your input
S

 

[gratus fermentatio]

Bump this thread!!
Any hints/learnings?
I am planning to brew a saison with a lactobacillus kettle sour process and then add Seabuckthorn in secondary aprox. 4 weeks after brewing and 8 weeks before bottling. I will be adding brett as well so want to brett to have time to develop their flavour profile
thanks for your input
S

You may find this thread useful:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=453912
Regards, GF.

 

[Larsen]

I realized that i forgot to reply ... sometimes life have other plans with you..

Well everything is ok, and got a notice about traffic to the tread..

I couldn't get fresh berries, so i had a guy in "health/nature/bio" -kind a shop to put some frozen aside for me. When i should pick it up, his colleague had sold it!!

I ended up with adding, 750 ml of frosen juice to the batch. We did some testing after fermentation, and find the rigth level of the berry and sourness. Which are aprox 7 times more than my plans. but more than 6 times less than the 5 kg proposed.

My final note is that i like my Saisons better without Sea Buck Thorn berries.

Have a nice summer..

 

[kbaggen]

Hi there,
I have used 10 gram (fresh) for 5 min in 18 liter batch, and this give a clear but not overwelming hint of the berriers in a Citra Sea buckthorn wit!

Also done a dunkel hefewwisesfen (http://posebryg.bagge-nielsen.dk/2016/10/06/the-funky-dunkel-hefewiezen-with-sea-bucktorn/) with them and used for a 10L batch 4 gram in 5 min + 2 gram dry hoped (sanitiezed in starsan, then cleaned with water, then further cleaned by pouring over with boiling water).

I think Sea bucktorn in the rigt amount is a very good compliment to Citra!