Pumpkin ale: add more spices at bottling?

[CrazyP]

About a week ago my friends and I brewed up a pumpkin ale based on this Charlie Papazian recipe: http://www.homebrewersassociation.o...recipe-of-the-week-cucurbito-pepo-pumpkin-ale

It calls for 3.5 tsp at 10 minutes before flameout. The wort itself smelled amazing but now that fermentation is done there is very little aroma left... just a very subtle flavor. Fermentation was very vigorous (I used Wyeast 1968). Although I kept it at cool 64F I suspect that most of the aroma was blasted with the CO2 out the blowout tube.

I'm considering adding a small amount of spice when I boil my priming sugar at bottling... Is this a good idea? If so, how much is a safe amount to add without going overboard?

 

[inhousebrew]

If you want more it couldn't hurt to add some but I would maybe add it to the fermenter to give it time to even itself out a bit. Put it in there, pull a sample a week later, add more if needed.

 

[jonmohno]

Do it, 1 tblsp is not alot for 5 gal. Add how much you think of what spice combo you like.A tsp wont hurt but Im just guessing up to 2 tsp for bottleing? The worst that can happen is that at first,but you can age them so consider that. They will hit that spice you botttle with at first then fade gradually.

 

[SpeedYellow]

What kind of spice level are you looking for? Have you tried some store-bought pumpkin beers that you can point to as being over or under-spiced? (I've had several so may be able to give some comparisons). But IMHO, 2.5 tsp of cinn, nutmeg, allspice, cloves is a pretty good amount. I did 2 tsp of pumpkin pie mix at flameout, thinking that it would be pretty mild in comparison to some recipes I've seen here, and was wrong. The spice levels are pretty strong, a bit too much for me, relative to the store bought beers I've liked.

 

[CrazyP]

Some excellent advice here... As to what level of spice I'm looking for, I'd like to hand somebody a pint of this beer and have them recognize it as a pumpkin ale, but I don't want it to be too in-your-face. Right now I don't think I would call this a pumpkin ale if I didn't know what was in it, but it's still a good beer. My biggest fear is screwing it up by adding too much spice.

What do think about adding 1tsp to the fermenter (after boiling a few minutes in a "tea") and then if it still isn't strong enough adding adding another teaspoon at bottling time?

 

[inkman15]

I had the same thing happen to me last year with my pumpkin. It smelled amazing when we put it in the fermenter and at bottling time it had lost a lot of the aroma/taste. We did 1.5tsp of a spice blend in a "tea" and tossed it in the bottling bucket along with the priming sugar. The results were great and this batch was probably the most popular one I've done.

 

[CrazyP]

I had the same thing happen to me last year with my pumpkin. It smelled amazing when we put it in the fermenter and at bottling time it had lost a lot of the aroma/taste. We did 1.5tsp of a spice blend in a "tea" and tossed it in the bottling bucket along with the priming sugar. The results were great and this batch was probably the most popular one I've done.

Sounds perfect! I'm going to do the exact same thing. I can't wait for this one to carbonate. Even without the spice aroma, it tastes really good. I was skeptical about how much the mashed pumpkin really added, but since the spice is so subdued, the pumpkin flavor actually comes through and it also gives the beer a nice mouthfeel.

 

[Streeter]

I had the same thing happen to me last year with my pumpkin. It smelled amazing when we put it in the fermenter and at bottling time it had lost a lot of the aroma/taste. We did 1.5tsp of a spice blend in a "tea" and tossed it in the bottling bucket along with the priming sugar. The results were great and this batch was probably the most popular one I've done.

Hi. So to be clear you are talking about teaspoons and not Tablespoons correct? Just pumpkin pie spice? I made a recipe from the LHBS and they give you 20grams of pumpkin pie spice. I put that in last 10 of the boil with cup brown sugar. Then 1TBSP more cinnamon, a tsp of nutmeg, 1TBSP van ext. at secondary since I couldn't taste much of anything when racking. Two cans of pumpkin puree with no additives were also added, one at boil and one in primary. It was brewed the 28th of Sept and is the 17th Oct today. I racked to carboy (and lost another 1/2 gallon due to trub -lost almost a gallon going to secondary) all in all I started at about 6gal and am probably at 4.75 gal now. The beer started at 1.56 and finished 1.008 so 6.3%.

Back to flavor, the beer has a nice subtile aroma and I can taste a mild cinnamon flavor but pumpkin is barely there. I picked up two vanilla beans soaked them in vodka for a few hours and just threw them in tonight. I am afraid that the flavor I do get now is so mild that it may just fade out after a few weeks in bottle. So I got another 20g of pump pie spice. I didn't know if I should a) Throw some or all of it in the carboy (which I think wouldn't mix in well and just float on top so maybe not a good idea). b) boil it and add at bottling. c) do nothing because the carbonation may make the flavors pop a bit more.
I also have a # lactose that I was thinking of throwing in at the bottling boil with corn sugar to give it more sweetness and pumpkin pie mouth feel.

So I am open to suggestions, as I am new to this but obviously don't want to over-spice it. Also I was told not to really stir stuff in due to the Oxy. When I read you guys are saying a tsp (teaspoon) is overpowering in 5 gallon I was worried because a TBSP is 3 tsp and I have added several TBSP and 14grams is one tbsp, so my 20 grams would be adding more than another Tbsp.

 

[CrazyP]

Hi. So to be clear you are talking about teaspoons and not Tablespoons correct? Just pumpkin pie spice? I made a recipe from the LHBS and they give you 20grams of pumpkin pie spice. I put that in last 10 of the boil with cup brown sugar. Then 1TBSP more cinnamon, a tsp of nutmeg, 1TBSP van ext. at secondary since I couldn't taste much of anything when racking. Two cans of pumpkin puree with no additives were also added, one at boil and one in primary. It was brewed the 28th of Sept and is the 17th Oct today. I racked to carboy (and lost another 1/2 gallon due to trub -lost almost a gallon going to secondary) all in all I started at about 6gal and am probably at 4.75 gal now. The beer started at 1.56 and finished 1.008 so 6.3%.

Back to flavor, the beer has a nice subtile aroma and I can taste a mild cinnamon flavor but pumpkin is barely there. I picked up two vanilla beans soaked them in vodka for a few hours and just threw them in tonight. I am afraid that the flavor I do get now is so mild that it may just fade out after a few weeks in bottle. So I got another 20g of pump pie spice. I didn't know if I should a) Throw some or all of it in the carboy (which I think wouldn't mix in well and just float on top so maybe not a good idea). b) boil it and add at bottling. c) do nothing because the carbonation may make the flavors pop a bit more.
I also have a # lactose that I was thinking of throwing in at the bottling boil with corn sugar to give it more sweetness and pumpkin pie mouth feel.

So I am open to suggestions, as I am new to this but obviously don't want to over-spice it. Also I was told not to really stir stuff in due to the Oxy. When I read you guys are saying a tsp (teaspoon) is overpowering in 5 gallon I was worried because a TBSP is 3 tsp and I have added several TBSP and 14grams is one tbsp, so my 20 grams would be adding more than another Tbsp.

I'm a little late in responding, but I had amazing success with adding the spice at bottling. After boiling the priming sugar, I threw about 1.75 teaspoons of the spice mixture into the pot, covered it and let it steep while I sanitized the bottles. Then I racked over this mixture as usual. I was concerned that the spice would make its way into the bottles but it dropped out of solution almost immediately. The resulting beer was spiced perfectly (for me at least)... If you like the spice to be subtle then you could probably cut it down to 1 teaspoon.

I'm impatiently waiting for this batch to carbonate. I can't wait to try it!

 

[Streeter]

I'm a little late in responding, but I had amazing success with adding the spice at bottling. After boiling the priming sugar, I threw about 1.75 teaspoons of the spice mixture into the pot, covered it and let it steep while I sanitized the bottles. Then I racked over this mixture as usual. I was concerned that the spice would make its way into the bottles but it dropped out of solution almost immediately. The resulting beer was spiced perfectly (for me at least)... If you like the spice to be subtle then you could probably cut it down to 1 teaspoon.

I'm impatiently waiting for this batch to carbonate. I can't wait to try it!

So had you put in spices originally and this was just adding more to it? So this was a mixture of the spices in boiled water (how much?) and your 5oz (I assume) of corn sugar?

 

[CrazyP]

So had you put in spices originally and this was just adding more to it? So this was a mixture of the spices in boiled water (how much?) and your 5oz (I assume) of corn sugar?

Yes, the recipe called for about 3.5 tsp of spice to be added with 10 minutes remaining in the (wort) boil, which resulted in a nice pumpkin spice flavor, but after fermentation the flavor was all but gone. So to bring the spice back up I added an additional 1.75 tsp (half the original amount) to the boiled priming solution, which was ~5 oz. corn sugar and 16 oz. water.

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

+1 to this. I added more spice at bottling a half tsp at a time till it tasted how I wanted. Which turned out to be about 1.5 tsp.

 

[CrazyP]

+1 to this. I added more spice at bottling a half tsp at a time till it tasted how I wanted. Which turned out to be about 1.5 tsp.

Glad our numbers agree! It makes me wonder if its even worth adding spices during the boil... Probably depends on fermentation. My batch was pretty high OG (1.079), and I fermented with a good pitch of Wyeast 1968. It frothed and bubbled like nothing I've ever seen for three days then dropped like a rock. FG was 1.014. I suspect most of the original flavor dropped with the yeast and/or was volatilized with the CO2.

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

Pretty much. My hydro sample had a slight background flavor of it, but not enough leaving me to add more. Then again I didn't want to over do it with the boil addition knowing I could add more at bottling to get it right.