Pitch more yeast?....No, Im not a brewing Newbie, just new variables.

[Feurhund]

So, bit of background. Reason I am in this situation I the batch has a few new variables. First time using my new 60L Spiedel tank, and I am using a bottle cultured Schneider Weiss yeast grown up to a 1L starter, but admittedly a bit rushed.
So the ferment is 12 gallons of Weizen, all grain decocted etc. and I don't expect any fermentability issues from the brew day. It had an OG of 1.050 and after pitching at 63F and 24 hours it had a 2 inch Krausen. 5 days later gravity was 1.030 so I raised to 68F. At day 7 krausen has fallen and SG is 1.028.
Should I pitch a smack pack of Wy3068 to finish it off or give it more time? Main reason I want to hold off would be to keep a pure Schneider culture for washing. I am less confident in judging the ferment as it is more like an open ferment with all the headspace so i am not used to krausen behavior outside a carboy and of course a culture grown up from the bottle is not as reliable, so maybe it is just taking its time. Thanks for the input.

 

[RM-MN]

Try raising the temperature some more for a few more days before you try pitching more yeast. It's likely that you have plenty of yeast in there but some varieties like it quite warm to finish. I used Wyeast 3944 and had to get it to the mid-80's to get it to finish.

 

[Feurhund]

Thank you for the feedback. Wy3944 is a very different animal though as it is a Belgian Wit strain and can tolerate heat.

I wouldn't raise a weizen yeast above 68F or it may produce fusels, bubblegum and too much banana. I am normally patient with these things, but the drop of the krausen has me edgy and I have the smack pack on hand. The gravity samples on the other hand taste great, nice clove presence from the Schneider strain that I love and I did a long Feurillic acid rest too. Just sweet from the residual gravity.
May just pitch the smack pack tonight to ensure it gets down to 1.012-014. Alternatively I could try stirring up the yeast while minding not to aerate?

 

[lostcheesehead]

If you're wanting to culture the yeast, I would say the yeast do its own thing here and don't pitch some other strain. You may end up with a lackluster beer, but you're in this for the yeast, right? I suspect the fermenting performance is due to underpitching (even if using a stir plate, MrMalty.com suggests a 1.89L starter, and that's assuming you had 2 vials of 100 billion cells each to start with). In building your culture, did you use the guidelines from the yeast book by Jamil Z. and Chris White? Whatever the case, you probably have a decent supply for your next hefe brew! Good luck with that one!

 

[duboman]

I'm not familiar with the yeast at all but the beer is great. It sounds as though your cultured yeast was stressed and at 12 gallons batch size with that OG it also appears as though a 1L starter was inadequate and perhaps not enough aeration of the wort. I wouldn't raise it over 68 either. Do you have the ability to gently rouse the yeast a bit?

Perhaps you can contact the brewery and ask for some help, if they are open to home brewers they might get you some good advice on getting it to finish without having to pitch a different yeast.

 

[RM-MN]

Thank you for the feedback. Wy3944 is a very different animal though as it is a Belgian Wit strain and can tolerate heat.

I wouldn't raise a weizen yeast above 68F or it may produce fusels, bubblegum and too much banana. I am normally patient with these things, but the drop of the krausen has me edgy and I have the smack pack on hand. The gravity samples on the other hand taste great, nice clove presence from the Schneider strain that I love and I did a long Feurillic acid rest too. Just sweet from the residual gravity.
May just pitch the smack pack tonight to ensure it gets down to 1.012-014. Alternatively I could try stirring up the yeast while minding not to aerate?

All of these flaws would have been produced during the initial fast ferment. You are well past that now and are trying to get the yeast to finish. Heat that beer up.

 

[Feurhund]

Ok, advice taken to heart. I came close to pitching the smack pack....even smacked it as this is a 12 gallon batch and I don't want it mediocre just to harvest pure Schneider.

But I must have channeled Papazian, RDWADAHB( or something), instead i put the pack back in the fridge, hooked my aeration wand to my CO2 and roused the yeast off the bottom then ramped to 72F. I will give it a few days and see if Schneider can do it's thing.

Will report back.

 

[GilSwillBasementBrews]

If that doesn't get you where you want. You could always rack to another container and pitch new yeast there. This preserving your yeast strain in primary for future batches.

 

[Feurhund]

Considered that, but would be pain as it is in a 60L Spiedel and is 12 gallons. Next biggest would be two separate carboys and filled to brim.

 

[Feurhund]

Not going to claim victory, but down to 1.018 Today! Hydro sample has the same great taste, so I think I will hold it at 72F and let it finish off.

 

[Feurhund]

Quick update. Gravity was stuck again at 1.017 which I was fine with because it is the first go with the bottle harvest.
So I used the 1 gallon of speise I kept from brew day and also made up another half gallon of steeped and boiled light chocolate malt and carafa II. I then put 2L of the plain in one flask and 2L of the dark wort in another and split a smack pal of 3068 between them.
I gave it a couple hours and sanitized and CO2 purged two kegs. One got the dark speise and one the light. I then racked off the Weiss into each keg, sealed with C02 and put in the ferm chamber at 72F.
I was then able to collect my pure Schneider culture from the Spiedel tank!
Now 10 days later the kegs are full of pressure and I checked SG and it was down to 1.015. I am going to let it carb and finish another 4 days and then cold crash to condition. The sample at 70F tasted awesome and the concentrated dark speise effectively made the other keg a nice dunkelweiss in flavor and color! Sometimes tinkering and complicating things does payoff. Thanks for the feedback and I will follow up with serving pics.

 

[Tinga]

most yeast produce a bulk of their flavors in the first couple days of fermentation so if youre 5 days out from the pitch you could raise the temp without getting any off flavors. also I would pitch a lot more yeast next time. a one liter starter in 12 gallons seems a bit on the low end. I would pitch a 2 liter starter next time.

 

[Feurhund]

See above as I took that route. The smaller pitch was a timing problem. I have two small kids so when a brew day opens up I have to take it. The beer tastes great from the warm sample so it should be perfect after cold crash and conditioning

 

[Feurhund]

Well I hate it when people don't update their threads so here are some glamour shots. Beer turned out perfect.

Great mousse like head that lasts. Nice clove presence with balancing banana and a little tartness. Couldn't be happier with the beer and glad I stuck with the Schneider weisse yeast.

Haven't cracked the dunkelweiss yet but will post a pick of that one too. Thank you for the support and wish I could pour you all one at my home bar.