Pale ale with red x and rye recipe trial

[Jbrew]

Pretty new to recipes, fooled around a couple times previously to try and clone wailua wheat, but never really got close, so i had just stuck with making recipes of the forum.
I'm looking to make a hoppy pale ale kinda. I'm not a huge ipa fan, but they are starting to grow on me. I like carton boat, and red rye returning a lot, there right at about 35 ibu.
Im insterested in red x and also rye. Ive never used either malts before. Ive read that red x is similar to munich. I have a half pound of cascade, 2 ounces of bramling cross, 1 ounce of mosaic, 1 ounce of wakatu. Here's my recipe:

6 Gallon
OG: 1.052 (70% eff)
30 Ibu

8lbs 2 row pale
2lbs red x
1.5lbs rye
.5lb crystal 60L

.5oz wakatu 7% AA 30 min
1oz cascade 7% AA 30 min
2oz cascade 7% AA hop stand 175 for 15 min
.5oz wakatu 7% AA hop stand 175 for 15 min

London III ale yeast

Im definitely looking to do some dry hopping as well. I'd like to use the the hop varieties i have now, but I'd like to reserve 3 ounces of the cascade for another recipe.
I'm looking for hop flavor and aroma rather then bittering, that's why I'm starting with additions at 30 minutes. I love mosaic hops, used them a couple times and really liked them a lot, but there pretty fresh and the wakatu I bought on sale since they were old, so I'd like to use them up before the mosaic. The bramling cross Ive looked up, but just undecided where I'd want to use um. I've never used them before. The London III yeast I've read is supposed to be the conan equivalent. I've read that it gives some fruity esters, but ive never used it before. It seems to be used with ipas a lot, so I don't know how it will do with a lower hopped beer.
Please make any suggestions, I have made my,own recipes, but pretty much flew by the seat of my pants. The resulting beer was always drinkable but was never anything special and always lacking something, either hop aroma, body or at times just bland, so lemme know if this would even make anything remotely drinkable. I used a couple different recipes for a basis.
Thanks all.

 

[GnenieGone]

Wow, got a lot of flavors. Sweet malt, spicy, grapfruit (unsure of the wakatu) with English yeast. Do it and return back your results. Love it tho!

 

[Miraculix]

If you really want it red, you would either need to cut out the pale or rye as both together will lower the total ebc too much. Red x alone is really perfectly red alone when used with an og of around 1.05, which you do. Or you can compensate by adding a little bit of chocolate malt or roast barley or black patent or midnight wheat to compensate for the loss of colour caused by the rye and pale malt. But really just a bit of it... Use a calculator to get into the colour range that red x alone would have. I am talking about probably 0.5 to 1.5 % of the overall grain bill for the roasted addition.

 

[TreborDeSinagro]

I made a SMASH with red x and mandarina bavaria for a camping trip at the end of last summer. Turned out really great. Very sessionable, basically the whole 5gal batch went the first night!

From memory it had a slight residual sweetness, there was a definite toffee caramel malt profile, nothing roasted or burnt. Sweetness went well with the MB orangey hops.


OG1042, 3.8% abv. 35 IBU (30IBUs from the 60 min addition, 5 IBUs from a 5 min addition). Used the rest of the 100g pack as dry hops. 23 litre batch.

 

[TreborDeSinagro]

Oh, and it turned out very red btw!

 

[Miraculix]

Oh, and it turned out very red btw!

I also brewed a smash with it once, with Sorachi Ace. Was an interesting combination and very very red as well.

 

[Jbrew]

So what do you guys think? To go with red maybe I should do a 1:1 ratio with the red x and 2 row? Which would then be 5 pounds 2 row and 5 pounds red x? Or should I just eliminate the 2 row altogether and just use 10 pounds red x?

 

[TreborDeSinagro]

Just red x on its own will work fine. My brew with it had plenty of body.

However, your subject is ‘pale ale...’ so if you’re truly after a pale beer I wouldn’t bother with red x at all. If you want your beer to be pale I’d probably use pale ale malt and a touch of dark crystal, say 2%.

If you want a red beer, go for 100 % red x

 

[Miraculix]

Just red x on its own will work fine. My brew with it had plenty of body.

However, your subject is ‘pale ale...’ so if you’re truly after a pale beer I wouldn’t bother with red x at all. If you want your beer to be pale I’d probably use pale ale malt and a touch of dark crystal, say 2%.

If you want a red beer, go for 100 % red x

Yes, I agree. And if you want the rye flavour in your red, then add a tiny bit of midnight wheat to compensate for the lack of colour of the rye.

 

[Jbrew]

Yea, I'm just calling it a pale ale because its not really bitter enough to be an IPA. I would like it to be red, so ill try the red x. You think the pound and half of rye will dilute red too much?

 

[TreborDeSinagro]

You could always add in some carafa special 3 when you sparge. Probably only need a very small amount to get the colour back.

Do you use any brewing software? If so, you’re aiming for about ebc30. Red x alone will give you this. Plug the numbers in and see you get.
BeerSmith is well worth the small investment.

 

[Miraculix]

Actually, this calculator is even available for free on their homepage.

https://www.brewersfriend.com/srm-calculator/

Assuming that you would use 12pounds of red x and 1.5 of rye malt, you would need around 10grams of chocolate or midnight wheat or black malt, according to the calculator.