More important: OG or volume?

[VMCosco]

I brewed my first batch last weekend. It was the brewers best scottish ale kit (had to start somewhere). Everything seemed to go well during the boil and transfer to the primary. The recipe called for adding water to bring the volume to 5 gallons while being careful to stay within the recommended OG range.

That is where my problems began. I slowly added water, watching the OG as I did. When my OG reached 1034 (low end of the range) by total volume was just over 4 gallons. Temperature at that point was around 65.

I realize I may have messed something up along the way, but my core question for the future is which is more important: To achieve the recommended volume (i.e. 5 gallons) or to achieve the recommended OG?

 

[MyNameIsPaul]

If it was a formulated recipe, I'm pretty sure that at 5 gallons, it was at the specified OG. be very sure to mix/stir the wort well when topping up to evenly distribute the wort with the 'new' water your adding, sometimes readings can be off if the wort hasn't been mixed very well.

 

[Tinga]

when doing extract kits the og can be quite misleading due to the uneven mixture of the extract. the only reason you shouldnt be hitting your og is if you didn't add all your extract or you left a lot of wort behind in the boil kettle.

to answer your first question though I would say the OG is more important than volume since the flavor profile is centered around that OG.

 

[VMCosco]

But I never got it up to 5 gallons. I stopped at 4 because that was at the recommended OG. Was I correct not adding any additional water? If so, cool. If not, are there any changes/additions I should make during fermentation to make up for the volume shortfall?

Edit @Tinga: Thanks. You are correct, there was a bit of LME left in the can that I just couldn't get out. Also, my siphon stopped with a little wort left in the kettle. I hadn't though of either until you brought them up.

 

[Tinga]

But I never got it up to 5 gallons. I stopped at 4 because that was at the recommended OG. Was I correct not adding any additional water? If so, cool. If not, are there any changes/additions I should make during fermentation to make up for the volume shortfall?

Edit @Tinga: Thanks. You are correct, there was a bit of LME left in the can that I just couldn't get out. Also, my siphon stopped with a little wort left in the kettle. I hadn't though of either until you brought them up.

I dont think that those small bits would have left you with such a large discrepancy. I'm guessing the wort was just unevenly mixed giving you a misinterpretation of the OG

 

[TyTanium]

What is the target OG of your recipe? Assuming you got all the extract in, your actual gravity is probably 25% higher (= 5 gallons / 4 gallons - 1) than the recipe states.

 

[VMCosco]

What is the target OG of your recipe? Assuming you got all the extract in, your actual gravity is probably 25% higher (= 5 gallons / 4 gallons - 1) than the recipe states.

Recommended OG was 1034 - 1038. I came in at 1034 with 4 gallons.

Recommended FG is 1010 - 1014

That would mean my OG was extremely high. Hmmm, anything I can do to fix this at this point?

 

[HibsMax]

But I never got it up to 5 gallons. I stopped at 4 because that was at the recommended OG. Was I correct not adding any additional water? If so, cool. If not, are there any changes/additions I should make during fermentation to make up for the volume shortfall?

Edit @Tinga: Thanks. You are correct, there was a bit of LME left in the can that I just couldn't get out. Also, my siphon stopped with a little wort left in the kettle. I hadn't though of either until you brought them up.

Just out of interest, why do you syphon from your kettle? I just pour direct from my pot through a strainer into my fermenter. Helps a little with aeration and mixing.

From what I have been reading about extract kits, if you follow the instructions and add everything properly then the OG shouldn't be an issue. I've had issues but that was, I think, because I was measuring the OG before stirring the %^& out of my wort. There are ways to get the LME out of your can. Make sure you leave them standing in hot water for about 10 minutes before pouring, it's less viscous that way. You can also use your boiling wort to rinse out the cans, just don't scold yourself.

 

[Bob]

You will hardly ever get all the extract out of the tin. That's another reason to use dry extract instead of syrup. When you get away from kits, you'll see.

You will always have kettle loss. Always. Even if you dump through a strainer, some wort will be retained by hops and trub. Don't sweat it.

Add more water. Seriously. Dilute the beer. Briefly boil enough water to reach your desired brew length, cover the pot with foil, and let it cool. Add it to the bottling bucket then follow your standard bottling instructions.

Cheers,

Bob

 

[homebrewdad]

You will hardly ever get all the extract out of the tin. That's another reason to use dry extract instead of syrup. When you get away from kits, you'll see.

You will always have kettle loss. Always. Even if you dump through a strainer, some wort will be retained by hops and trub. Don't sweat it.

Add more water. Seriously. Dilute the beer. Briefly boil enough water to reach your desired brew length, cover the pot with foil, and let it cool. Add it to the bottling bucket then follow your standard bottling instructions.

Cheers,

Bob

This. Add some boiled and cooled water to reach your volume.

Your OG reading was low because you were using top off water to reach your volume. If you added all of the extract, your OG *will* be what the recipe specifies unless you miss your volume. Unless you mix it insanely, your gravity will probably always be a little high or low, depending on where you pull the sample from. Worse, once you let the wort sit, it will "de-mix" to a point.

Gravity readings measure how much sugar is dissovled in a sample of water. Since you don't have uniform mixing, you don't get uniform readings.

Good news is that the fermentation process fully mixes everything for you.

The reason that all grain and partial mashes have varying OGs is due to the efficiency of converting sugars from grain. Since you are using extract, all of the sugars are there - you don't have to worry about OG as much.

Take a look at this Belgian Blonde I just brewed. This was AFTER sloshing it for fifteen solid minutes - I topped off with 1.25 gallons of water (which was spot on, according to BeerSmith).

Tell me that a sample deep in that would give the same SG as a sample from the top, or from the middle?

Exactly.

 

[VMCosco]

Just out of interest, why do you syphon from your kettle? I just pour direct from my pot through a strainer into my fermenter. Helps a little with aeration and mixing.

From what I have been reading about extract kits, if you follow the instructions and add everything properly then the OG shouldn't be an issue. I've had issues but that was, I think, because I was measuring the OG before stirring the %^& out of my wort. There are ways to get the LME out of your can. Make sure you leave them standing in hot water for about 10 minutes before pouring, it's less viscous that way. You can also use your boiling wort to rinse out the cans, just don't scold yourself.

Thanks for the pointers. I guess I didn't have a reason to siphon and not pour. Now i know

 

[HibsMax]

Thanks for the pointers. I guess I didn't have a reason to siphon and not pour. Now i know

No worries. I'm new at this myself. I've learned SO much from this place already (so much that I paid up, it's only fair).

 

[VMCosco]

You will hardly ever get all the extract out of the tin. That's another reason to use dry extract instead of syrup. When you get away from kits, you'll see.

You will always have kettle loss. Always. Even if you dump through a strainer, some wort will be retained by hops and trub. Don't sweat it.

Add more water. Seriously. Dilute the beer. Briefly boil enough water to reach your desired brew length, cover the pot with foil, and let it cool. Add it to the bottling bucket then follow your standard bottling instructions.

Cheers,

Bob

I am 6 days into primary. Based on your advice I should let fermentation finish up as is and add the water when I transfer to the bottling bucket correct? If I am using bottled spring water, do I still need to boil it?

Also, should I still shoot for the recommended FG before transferring or will that target be different now?

 

[helibrewer]

Once you have a sense for your equipment losses, adjust your recipes and start with a larger pre-boil volume, that way you get both the volume and gravity you are after.

When I make a 5 gallon kit I almost always add an addition pound of DME and adjust my pre-boil volume up by about 1 gallon...it usually gives me 5 gallons into bottles (or keg) after all the losses and my OG (post boil) is right on.

Using something like BeerSmith software really helps in making this kind of adjustment unless you just like doing all the math

 

[HibsMax]

I am 6 days into primary. Based on your advice I should let fermentation finish up as is and add the water when I transfer to the bottling bucket correct? If I am using bottled spring water, do I still need to boil it?

Also, should I still shoot for the recommended FG before transferring or will that target be different now?

Your FG should be for the full volume of everything. Your FG will go down after you add water to it. I am sure there is a formula you can use but just as an example, if your FG was 1020 and you added a gallon of water it might go down to 1010. Again, this is just for illustration purposes, I don't know what the actual numbers will be.

 

[Bob]

I am 6 days into primary. Based on your advice I should let fermentation finish up as is and add the water when I transfer to the bottling bucket correct? If I am using bottled spring water, do I still need to boil it?

That is correct. Let the ferment finish, then dilute at bottling time. To be certain about sanitation, boil. It's not a lot.

Also, should I still shoot for the recommended FG before transferring or will that target be different now?

That target will probably be different. In any case, don't ever rely on what the sheet of paper tells you. The yeast are doing all the work, and they can't read. Three successive like hydrometer readings, taken a day or so apart, are the real way of knowing whether your ferment is complete.

Cheers!

Bob

 

[VMCosco]

Just got home and took a reading. Not surprisingly it is now 32. Goes to show my original reading was artificially low due to lack of proper stirring.

I will check again tomorrow and Saturday. If it is staying the same I will assume it is as good as it is gonna get and proceed to bottling. I will add about a gallon of water to my bottling bucket and hope for the best.

Thanks to everyone for your help.