MLF in mead

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Srimmey

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From everything I’ve read, honey has very little malic acid. That elbowing said, would it make sense to add some malic acid to the must (maybe in secondary?) and some bacterial culture with the goal of MLF?

Would it just be too much acid or could that buttery mouthfeel be properly replicated?
 
I've never thought about trying that. I have used MLF in a red wine based pyment.
The MLF conversion is Malic to Lactic, which is always done with red wines to smooth them out.

Maybe try adding just lactic acid?
 
Most meads benefit from an acid adjustment. That should be done to taste, at the very end prior to bottling. I might use malic on a cyser but tartaric on anything else.
 
Ok. What is the purpose/ benefit of MLF? Does it make the mead taste better? Improve on mouthfeel? I have no idea, which is why I ask.
Also, I know acid adjustments should be done @ the end before bottling in bench trials, but, I've never played with them, as it scares the heck out of me, the possibility of ruining a batch.
Anybody with more knowledge than me on the subject, I would be ever grateful for a link to read up on it properly.
Thank you, in advance.
Happy meading 😎
 
Ok. What is the purpose/ benefit of MLF? Does it make the mead taste better? Improve on mouthfeel? I have no idea, which is why I ask.
Also, I know acid adjustments should be done @ the end before bottling in bench trials, but, I've never played with them, as it scares the heck out of me, the possibility of ruining a batch.
Anybody with more knowledge than me on the subject, I would be ever grateful for a link to read up on it properly.
Thank you, in advance.
Happy meading 😎
MLF (I use the term conversion as it isn't a fermentation) is used in red wines to convert a harsher malic acid into a smoother lactic acid. In a red wine it is a softer acid that helps in the mouth feel. The Lalvin 71-B yeast has some of this capability naturally, but not enough to tackle something like a red wine. Most wine kits do not include dealing with MLF as you don't know when it is done without either waiting several months or using a chroma photography test kit.

How fast it completes is very pH dependent. At a pH of 3.4 you will likely be done in 31 days, but I would certainly wait it out to 60 days without a test kit. At 3.3pH or under you probably want a test kit as you are likely in the 6 month area for completion; granted we don't usually have mead down that low in pH.

MLF bacteria *can* destroy the mead/wine if you use sorbate before it is complete as they will start to eat that and give off flavors that you do not want... You better be really sure that it is done if you want to use sorbate and back sweeten. My first red wine pyment, I gave the MLF 4 months before I used sorbate and back sweetened.

Maylar is correct about that resource. I believe this is the one:
https://gotmead.com/blog/gotmead-live/11-14-17-ryan-carlson-science-fine-tuning-mead/
As far as acid goes, it comes down to using graduated vessels so you know exactly how much you use into a specific volume. You do very small bench trials, say 60ml (~2oz) and weighed acid additions to try and find the sweet spot of the type of acid(s) and how much. Once you know that, you scale it to your remaining batch size. I am also afraid of ruining a batch and I will shoot a bit under the final calculated amount and then work myself up to it.
 
Last edited:
Are you a member of GotMead? Squatchy (Ryan Carlson) did a thread on intelligent acid adjustments. I can't log in from here so I can't give you a link.
Not any more. I let my subscription run out. There wasn't a lot of activity on there when I was on & this place was hopping , hence the subscription to here.
I do remember Squatchy, although he wasn't big on talking much when I had questions. Oh well.
 
MLF (I use the term conversion as it isn't a fermentation) is used in red wines to convert a harsher malic acid into a smoother lactic acid. In a red wine it is a softer acid that helps in the mouth feel. The Lalvin 71-B yeast has some of this capability naturally, but not enough to tackle something like a red wine. Most wine kits do not include dealing with MLF as you don't know when it is done without either waiting several months or using a chroma photography test kit.

How fast it completes is very pH dependent. At a pH of 3.4 you will likely be done in 31 days, but I would certainly wait it out to 60 days without a test kit. At 3.3pH or under you probably want a test kit as you are likely in the 6 month area for completion; granted we don't usually have mead down that low in pH.

MLF bacteria *can* destroy the mead/wine if you use sorbate before it is complete as they will start to eat that and give off flavors that you do not want... You better be really sure that it is done if you want to use sorbate and back sweeten. My first red wine pyment, I gave the MLF before I used sorbate and back sweetened.

Maylar is correct about that resource. I believe this is the one:
https://gotmead.com/blog/gotmead-live/11-14-17-ryan-carlson-science-fine-tuning-mead/
As far as acid goes, it comes down to using graduated vessels so you know exactly how much you use into a specific volume. You do very small bench trials, say 60ml (~2oz) and weighed acid additions to try and find the sweet spot of the type of acid(s) and how much. Once you know that, you scale it to your remaining batch size. I am also afraid of ruining a batch and I will shoot a bit under the final calculated amount and then work myself up to it.
Thank you for explaining
 
Not any more. I let my subscription run out. There wasn't a lot of activity on there when I was on & this place was hopping , hence the subscription to here.
I do remember Squatchy, although he wasn't big on talking much when I had questions. Oh well.
I found a better home here ...

As far as acids, backsweetening, and tannins, I taste my meads each time they are racked (from primary, plus 1-2 more during secondary/clearing) and add what I think is lacking each time. I work my way towards what I think will work out well while aging. By bottling time, it is done.

Unscientific, but that is my way.

I am starting to learn, however, that I tend to over sweeten a young mead, so I need to keep that in mind on the front end.
 
I found a better home here ...
I agree that his is better for me then GotMead as the traffic is so very slim. There is a lot of knowledge stored there though. I was going to renew, but I don't use PayPal anymore and the Strype option wasn't functioning and Vicky hasn't gotten that resolved, though she did remove it.
 
This has been very helpful, thank you everyone! I guess I was under the assumption that the MLF did more to the viscosity of the drink that just change malic acids to lactic acids.

I was thinking it would be a good thing to combine with an oaked traditional mead or Acerglyn but based of this, I’ll probably scrap the idea.
 
The Lalvin 71-B yeast has some of this capability naturally
A minor correction - MLF (Malolactic Fermentation) can only be done by the Lactic Acid Bacteria. Lalvin 71-B can do Malo Ethanolic Fermentation, which converts malic acid to ethanol and CO2. Useful in a cider that was pressed from bitter-sharp apples high in acid.
 
A minor correction - MLF (Malolactic Fermentation) can only be done by the Lactic Acid Bacteria. Lalvin 71-B can do Malo Ethanolic Fermentation, which converts malic acid to ethanol and CO2. Useful in a cider that was pressed from bitter-sharp apples high in acid.
Thank you. I remembered that incorrectly.
 

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