melomel via "fruit in secondary" method

[zipmont]

I've been experimenting with the "fruit in secondary" method I found in Ken Schramm's book "The Compleat Meadmaker," where plain mead (still fermenting but at least 10% alcohol ... ) is racked onto fresh berries. So far, so good. The presence of alcohol does seem to get a cleaner flavor extraction out of the fruit, and I have had no sanitation issues or off flavors from the introduction of unsulfited fruit mid-ferment.

I am using the 8 gallon, snap-on lid fermenters, which seem to be pretty common with this method. Supposedly they allow the headspace to sparge with co2 to protect against oxidation, while providing the requisite access and ease of handling for the fruit. (getting 10 pounds of fruit into a carboy is a bit messy I guess). This raises a couple of questions for me, not having much of a background in chemistry. First, is it still ok to open the buckets twice daily to punch down? And second, is it safe to let the melomel ferment completely out and flocculate? On the one hand, I want as much time on the fruit as possible. On the other, I don't want to risk oxidation, especially if I'm taking the lids off daily. Thanks in advance for any thoughts or ideas.

 

[Bearmaul]

I very well could be mistaken but I don't think oxidization happens with brief exposure to oxygen... it should take a while. I say continue to punch down, especially if fermentation is still going on, cause that'll just fill any headspace back up with co2.

 

[fatbloke]

Yes it would.....

Maximum fruitiness would likely need some pectic enzyme, which can help with colour/flavour extraction too.

If you checked the gravity once a day as well as punch down twice daily, once its getting close to dry, you could then just leave it and let the fruit sink.....

Unless you have used 71B, then I'd get it off the fruit within 2 months of the end of completion whether the fruit had sunk or not.......

 

[MindenMan]

Have you looked the drill powered stirrers that go through the bung hole, and turn into a propeller under power? That way you wouldn't take the lid off, just pop out the airlock, give it at good spin, and put the airlock back in, and mixy, mixy, you're all done.

 

[zipmont]

"I very well could be mistaken but I don't think oxidization happens with brief exposure to oxygen... it should take a while. I say continue to punch down, especially if fermentation is still going on, cause that'll just fill any headspace back up with co2."

Exactly what I was hoping. It certainly stands to reason!

"If you checked the gravity once a day as well as punch down twice daily, once its getting close to dry, you could then just leave it and let the fruit sink....."

Sounds good. So the sparged headspace will likely protect the wine for prolonged periods (several months or more ...) provided the lid is not removed?

"Unless you have used 71B, then I'd get it off the fruit within 2 months of the end of completion whether the fruit had sunk or not......."

I did use 71b on one of the batches. So you would treat this one differently?

"Have you looked the drill powered stirrers that go through the bung hole, and turn into a propeller under power? That way you wouldn't take the lid off, just pop out the airlock, give it at good spin, and put the airlock back in, and mixy, mixy, you're all done."

I've never tried that. My buckets don't have a bung hole, just a rubber lined hole big enough for a bubbler. But if got a bucket with a bung, wouldn't the sparged headspace still be lost upon removing the bung?

Thanks -

 

[fatbloke]

The point of a drill stirrer is that it will spin and disturb the lees but not cause a vortex. So the lees creates the nucleation points for the carbonic acid to attach to and come out as gaseous CO2.

If this is done in a still environment, with no draughts etc, then it should be fine to lift the lid. After all the CO2 is heavier than air so why not exploit that property.....

I have no idea WTF "sparged headspace" might be..

71B makes good meads, especially fruit based ones, but its not known to be good for sur lie/batonage aging. The guestimate is 2 months, nothing scientific but no-one seems to have reported any problems with autolysis off flavours.....

 

[zipmont]

"I have no idea WTF "sparged headspace" might be.."

I'm not sure I do either. A ferment bucket with a snap on lid will keep a co2 blanket in the headspace longer than a fermenter with a loose fitting lid because the only way out is through the bubbler. So with the snap on lid, you're not in such a hurry to rack when fermentation stops because the headspace stays full (sparged) with co2 longer, allowing for more contact time with fruit, among other things.

But I guess an even safer route would be to skip the bucket altogether and just put everything (including the fruit) into carboys instead so headspace is not a worry. The buckets with the snap on lids seem fine as long as there is fermentation, but if prolonged contact time with fruit is wanted, then carboys would protect better against oxygen? I'm just afraid the fruit won't sink and I'll have a giant heap of fruit at the top of my carboy.