Medicine-like Bitterness in my PA and IPA... Why?

[Miles_1111]

I have brewed several batches of APA and IPA with fair enough amount of bitter hops and dry hopping according to some recipes available online. For example, for 7 % ABV with 50-60 IBU and 6% ABV with 40-50 IBU. The IPA is suppuse to be bitter, horever, the bitterness in my beer is not the the favourable bitterness, it is medicine-like bitterness which is like you are tasting a medicine... it makes don't want to take another sip...this is way too much annoying. Any idea what caused the medicine-like bitternes and how to adjust it ? Thanks in advance.

 

[Miraculix]

It can be suspended hop particles, which would sort itself out with time, or oxidised stuff which only would get worse. Of it kind of mellows or when kept cold, then it was suspended particles that settled or.

 

[estricklin]

There's always a chance you have some microbial contaminants, but I would also agree it could be hop particles.

 

[dmtaylor]

Possible chlorophenol. If you have a chlorinated water source, use bleach to sanitize, or use any garden hose or rubber hose in your process, those are the common culprits. Tastes like Band-Aids.

If it tastes more like aspirin, then you might be adding too much sulfate in the form of gypsum or especially Epsom salt. Don't ever use Epsom and keep other salt additions to a minimum IMO.

 

[Miles_1111]

Possible chlorophenol. If you have a chlorinated water source, use bleach to sanitize, or use any garden hose or rubber hose in your process, those are the common culprits. Tastes like Band-Aids.

If it tastes more like aspirin, then you might be adding too much sulfate in the form of gypsum or especially Epsom salt. Don't ever use Epsom and keep other salt additions to a minimum IMO.

I used RO water and did water treatment, and the sanitizer is Starsan, so it is not the bleach problem. Also I use the homebrew hose bought from local homebrew supply shop, so can exclude this factor as well.

yeah it tastes like aspirin power after it is grind... or any other medical pills. Well, I did put bother Gypsum and Epsom for water treatment of IPA and PA, but I kept the sulfate in the recommended range, for example for the PA with sulfate 245 ppm ( Chloride is 88 ppm ), which is inside the recommended range (150-400ppm fpr PA and IPA), right? and why not ever use Epsom?

 

[Miles_1111]

It can be suspended hop particles, which would sort itself out with time, or oxidised stuff which only would get worse. Of it kind of mellows or when kept cold, then it was suspended particles that settled or.

The final beer in the bottle is pretty clear though, it chilled the fermentor before bottling to let the hops and yeart set, so the beer body is quite clear and I don't see any suspended particles.

 

[dmtaylor]

Well, I did put bother Gypsum and Epsom for water treatment of IPA and PA, but I kept the sulfate in the recommended range, for example for the PA with sulfate 245 ppm ( Chloride is 88 ppm ), which is inside the recommended range (150-400ppm fpr PA and IPA), right? and why not ever use Epsom?

There you go. How much Epsom (magnesium) did you add? Magnesium tastes like poison, just really bad. And 245 ppm sulfate can add appreciable bitterness.

 

[Miles_1111]

There you go. How much Epsom (magnesium) did you add? Magnesium tastes like poison, just really bad. And 245 ppm sulfate can add appreciable bitterness.

This water profile is my target:

Cal: 106 ppm
Mg: 20 ppm
Na: 27 ppm
Sul: 245 ppm
Cl: 88 ppm
HCO3: 27 ppm

I added salt based on that and I put 3g Epsom in a 15L mash water ( no sparge) for BIAB. So my 20ppm Magnesium should not be a problem, right? And 245 ppm sulfate is also in the right range. Why the medicical like bitterness...?

 

[Waunabeer]

Possible chlorophenol. If you have a chlorinated water source, use bleach to sanitize, or use any garden hose or rubber hose in your process, those are the common culprits. Tastes like Band-Aids.

If it tastes more like aspirin, then you might be adding too much sulfate in the form of gypsum or especially Epsom salt. Don't ever use Epsom and keep other salt additions to a minimum IMO.

I treat my water with Epsom, Calcium Chloride and Gypsum every single batch and my beer have come out wonderful. I do this because my water lacks certain minerals (RO system).

 

[dmtaylor]

my 20ppm Magnesium should not be a problem, right? And 245 ppm sulfate is also in the right range. Why the medicical like bitterness...?

Right. Your water profile doesn't look bad. High sulfate but that is pretty normal for IPA. It's possible you could be sensitive to the Epsom though anyway. Taste a grain of raw Epsom salt and see if it is giving you the same strange taste as the beer is. Also, it can be very difficult to accurately measure in grams without a very good scale. Are you sure you used 3.0 grams? Or could it have possibly been 3.5 or 3.8 grams or something like that? With Epsom being a finicky salt, this is still a potential problem.

Otherwise it is probably just from the hops, as others suggested. Look into the hops you used and whether they are considered to be low, medium, or high in cohumulone. Some brewers aim to use lower cohumulone hops because it results in a smoother bitterness. Many hops these days are high in cohumulone which can give a much more harsh bitterness. What hops did you use? Care to share the recipe?

 

[dmtaylor]

I treat my water with Epsom, Calcium Chloride and Gypsum every single batch and my beer have come out wonderful. I do this because my water lacks certain minerals (RO system).

Okay. A little Epsom can be alright. The problem I have with Epsom is that it is so easy to use too much. Just 0.5-1 grams too much can turn a great beer into an undesirable one. And it is difficult to measure accurately with many standard scales. You need like a cocaine-quality scale for some of this stuff.

 

[Miles_1111]

Right. Your water profile doesn't look bad. High sulfate but that is pretty normal for IPA. It's possible you could be sensitive to the Epsom though anyway. Taste a grain of raw Epsom salt and see if it is giving you the same strange taste as the beer is. Also, it can be very difficult to accurately measure in grams without a very good scale. Are you sure you used 3.0 grams? Or could it have possibly been 3.5 or 3.8 grams or something like that? With Epsom being a finicky salt, this is still a potential problem.

Otherwise it is probably just from the hops, as others suggested. Look into the hops you used and whether they are considered to be low, medium, or high in cohumulone. Some brewers aim to use lower cohumulone hops because it results in a smoother bitterness. Many hops these days are high in cohumulone which can give a much more harsh bitterness. What hops did you use? Care to share the recipe?

I tasted a bit of raw Epsom and I think you are right since it tastes almost exactly the same as the unpleasant bitterness in my beer. I remember my electronic scale is not sensitive enough, sometimes when I put a bit salt on it and the number on the screen does not change... I guess I will use as less salt as possible in the future like you said, especially for Epsom, to prevent oversalting the beer.

The hop I used is very simple, just cascade, 1 oz at 15mins , 1oz at 5 mins and 1 oz at flameout for a 2.5 G ( 10L) batch. This contribute a bit more than 40 IBU. I did not add at 60 mins or 45mins as I don't want to emphasize the bitterness. Other thoughts are that is the medicine-like bitterness can also be caused by corrupt hops (not fresh)? Or wrong grist-to-water ratio at mash? Or high fermenting temperature?

 

[Miraculix]

I tasted a bit of raw Epsom and I think you are right since it tastes almost exactly the same as the unpleasant bitterness in my beer. I remember my electronic scale is not sensitive enough, sometimes when I put a bit salt on it and the number on the screen does not change... I guess I will use as less salt as possible in the future like you said, especially for Epsom, to prevent oversalting the beer.

The hop I used is very simple, just cascade, 1 oz at 15mins , 1oz at 5 mins and 1 oz at flameout for a 2.5 G ( 10L) batch. This contribute a bit more than 40 IBU. I did not add at 60 mins or 45mins as I don't want to emphasize the bitterness. Other thoughts are that is the medicine-like bitterness can also be caused by corrupt hops (not fresh)? Or wrong grist-to-water ratio at mash? Or high fermenting temperature?

I never ever used Epsom salt during any of my brews. I have no idea why you want to just limit it, throw it out completely instead!

I used a tiny bit of magnesium chloride sometimes... But don't do that any more, didn't bring me any detectable benefit.

 

[Gozie Boy]

And get a digital jewelers scale. I find it invaluable, especially as you can get one cheeeep, like this one (there's gazillions of them out there):

https://www.amazon.com/Weigh-Gram-D...0169&sprefix=aws+jewelry+scale,aps,201&sr=8-5