Making the switch, bottling to kegging

[jlfindley74]

Ok, I've been a bottler since I started. I've probably brewed about 10-12 five gallon batches since I began brewing. 1 of which was a all grain, the rest extract. I want to know if any keggers out there have some good solid advice for someone who is looking to make the switch from bottling to kegging.

 

[dnslater]

Do research ahead of time on components, and buy the good parts from the start. Costs far more to buy cheaper parts and then buy upgrades.

 

[solbes]

Get to know someone who works at a keg or brew shop supplier I had a brew buddy that helped me buy my components @ cost and it was so awesome.

-Decide on Ball Lock corneys vs Pin Lock corneys (tall/skinny vs fat/short, they were made for Pepsi vs Coke). Usually this decision needs to mesh with what size fridge you have or want. The taller/skinnier ball locks usually make them higher in demand since fridge floor space is more at premium than height in most cases.
-Buy 1-2 corney kegs to get started. Used could be had for $25 if you go back 3 years, now they are $50-60 in most cases.
-Decide if you need a single or dual CO2 regulator setup. I dispense 1 keg only, so the decision is obvious. When we setup our bar up at our future cabin I will go dual regulator so I can dispense different kegs at different pressures (for different styles). If you want to force carb and dispense at the same pressures, a simple manifold with a single regulator setup works fine.
-CO2 tank. Most places around me do not refill, but rather exchange CO2 tanks. So my brand new Aluminum 5# tank was handed over the counter and I got a used one in return (I have at least kept them to be aluminum). So you can save money if you go with painted steel tanks. If you have a place that does refills, go and buy a shiny new aluminum tank if you want.
-Beverage Lines. Go with 3/16" ID lines that are at least 10 feet long. You need that ID and length to give enough pressure drop to avoid foamy pours. Gas lines are also usually 3/16" ID, but length is not critical. I went to a PET inner lining as I could taste the vinyl in the regular stuff. Usually just had to pour out the first quarter pint or so. Now I drink it all.
-Tower vs Shanks. Are you going to have a vertical tower coming out of the top of a mini fridge or keezer? Or a shank that goes through the door of a standard sized fridge? Up to you.
-Faucets. Go with SS Perlicks right from the start and you will have no issues. Yes they are more money. And yes they are worth every penny as they do not stick. Ever.

Finally you need to think about how you are going to clean your system. Look for the DIY keg line cleaner thread here. One of my favorite DIY things I've built for homebrewing. My beer tastes fresh everytime now, whereas before the dirty lines (from my laziness) was affecting the taste of the beer.

 

[jekeane]

Plan for what you really want to have and what you have space for. I started with a GE7cf chest freezer that if forced can hold 4 ball locks and a 5# tank. Soon after I realized I wanted a space to lager kegs too. So I upgraded to a Maytag 14cf that can hold 10 kegs.

Once you decide how much space you want to have map out each piece and decide where it is best to spend your money. It gets expensive quick and can be a little overwhelming. Don't think of it as I need every bell and whistle now unless money isn't an issue. ie. Picnic taps with a 10ft hose work just fine and cost $10 as opposed to swanky sweet 525ss that are around $75 for the shank and faucet.

A good regulator with 2 outputs is pretty nice in my opinion. I have a single output regulator and 6 kegs serving at the moment. I am always wanting a separate line set to another pressure for purging kegs quick carbing etc...

Find out if your lhbs or welding store exchanges tanks or fills them. You don't want to buy a nice shiny new tank to find out that the shop is just going to give you a full crappy looking one to replace it. Craigslist is your friend!

As for kegs Ball locks are my favorite. Pinlocks are generally a lot cheaper but they are fatter meaning you can fit less in a freezer. If you plan ahead and get a bigger freezer you can avoid the size problem but I wonder if you will ever see the cost benefit bcse a bigger freezer is more money.

 

[fivepointslow]

Buy a 4 tap tower right off the bat if you are going to use a tower... Adding taps to a tower isn't as easy as it looks and will end up costing more.

 

[Yooper]

I know that it seems expensive at first, so either buy "bigger" than you'll think you need, or get components that are easily upgraded.

I mean, don't get two kegs and one WYE fitting, if you think that you will only have two kegs on tap. Oh, the one WYE fitting is fine, but always have one keg more than you plan on having on tap since you will need to clean one and then carb it up.

Some things you don't need- a second regulator unless you really want to serve a wit beer at 16 psi and a stout at 9 psi. I serve 6 taps at 12 psi. It's cheaper, with one regulator and a distributor. Or, if you're serving two, just the WYE fitting.

You absolutely need to have check valves. Do NOT buy a set up without them.

I agree that you need perlicks right from the start. I know other faucets are cheaper- but they stick. If you're not pouring beers often (several times a day in each faucet), they will stick closed. Perlicks are forward sealing and never stick- that's one splurge that is always worth it.

Go with 12' lines, no matter what anybody else tells you. 12' of 3/16" beerline for each tap. Trust me- you met me on the internet so right there that proves I'm trustworthy! Seriously, just look at the "foam" posts in this forum, and you can see that almost all of them are from folks who bought their setups preassembled with 5-6' of beerline. Don't do that- when you order, ask for 12' of line for each tap. I bought my setup from kegconnection.com, and ask them to do that since my setup was preassembled. They told me I didn't need that- but I insisted. It was a lot better than the other setup I got with 5' of line! Then I went to 6', then 8' and finally 10' on that set up. Um, yeah- it would have been MUCH cheaper and less of a headache to start with 12' and have it done. So go with what your gut says is right in the first place. Beerline is cheap, but it's a pain to change later on when you have multiple taps. Just do it right the first time.

If you're going with an upright fridge, those are easy to convert as there are no lines in the door. Freezers are awesome, but require a temperature controller and possibly a collar. The reason for an upright fridge for me wasn't that, though. I love the look of a keezer, and the fit in the house would be better. For me, I'm 50 years old and have trouble lifting full kegs and carboys in and out of a chest freezer. An upright is much easier physically for me, although far less attractive. My kegerator has a definite "college party with taps out of the fridge" look to it, while keezers can be attractive even in a living room. So think about that if you're married, or if it's not going in the garage.

 

[rekoob]

Good comments and hard to disagree with any of them.
I went with cheaper faucets and some time ago I did have them stick on me. After it happened one time I now spray some starsan into the faucet after using it. I haven't had a sticky faucet again. Not saying I won't but seems like if you take care of them and don't leave beer to dry inside they do work. I just keep a spray bottle close by and give it a quick spray after done using it. I had caps that I would then put on but now I have the faucet brushes,give them a spray and put them in the end of the faucet. Good to go.
Will I upgrade them at some point? Maybe, but after years of use, I got my money out of these.
Everything else, see above.

 

[Rev2010]

Not to hijack, but to further question on the point of faucets as a new kegger myself - I too just went with the standard faucets that came with my KegCo kegerator. I've read a number of posts suggesting Perlick's and I'm more of the "just get the best now and be done with it" type of guy. Do the Perlick's make that much a difference? And since I'm also so new to kegging, when a faucet sticks how does it stick... like does it stick open? I would imagine that being an issue I'd certainly like to avoid.


Rev.

 

[rekoob]

It's just sticky, hard to move the handle and when you add force it will turn on and you will have a heck of a time turning it off.

I don't have Perlicks so can't comment... But they sure are pretty.

 

[jlfindley74]

Holy crap I've opened a can of complex and overwhelming stuff... is there a easy answer? Like "buy this this and this and that's all ya need"???

 

[Rev2010]

Holy crap I've opened a can of complex and overwhelming stuff... is there a easy answer? Like "buy this this and this and that's all ya need"???

I'm new to it, but my suggestion would be to go with 10-12 feet lines. Don't stick with the included 5 foot lines with most kegerators, you'll likely get a lot of foaming. I, and pretty much everyone else using a kegerator, just coils up the excess and zip ties it neatly, then you can simply rest the coil of tubing on top of the kegs.

I went with brand new Italian made homebrew kegs. I've done lots of reading and have read a lot of horror stories about the cheaper Chinese and India made kegs. I figured they are something I am going to be using for years so it's best not to cheap out. Others might have different opinions.

Last thing I guess I can advise as a new kegger... do NOT worry about the high pressure gauge reading on the regulator - meaning the one that tells you how much CO2 is left. Most gauges appear to have a red zone which indicates it's time to order more gas which might make you think your new 5lb tank (if that's what you go with) is empty when it's not. The gauges are designed for even larger tanks so a typical 5lb tank would show somewhere around 750psi when full. But then, if you keep the CO2 tank inside your kegerator the temp will drop the gauge reading to something like 500psi (red zone). It scares many noobs into thinking there's a leak but it's due to the temp change.

Again, I'm a total noob at this, but I guess that's all I can offer for now. Only kegged two batches of beer the first time this past weekend and everything went perfectly. It's really a LOT easier than it might sound, and way way easier than bottling IMO overall.


Rev.

 

[Puddlethumper]

No easy answers because everyone has different priorities. I tried going with picnic taps and found that they leaked and made a mess in the keezer. Built a collar with some faucets on shanks and the problem was solved.

Go with 10-12' lines to start. I saw someone else suggest this and it's good advice. Taps/towers/etc. are a matter of preference. I like taps coming out of the collar because the beer and lines stay inside the keezer longer before being dispensed. A tower creates a warm zone for about 10" worth of beer to sit in until waiting to be poured. Some guys fit computer fans in the tower to keep it cool. No perfect solution so it's your choice.

I have standard SS faucets. Yeah, they stick occasionally and need cleaning. I can afford to buy Perlicks but I also have the time to clean the ones I have. It becomes a case of dollars vs. time. Perlicks are great. But if you're willing to accept a little more maintenance then regular faucets will work just fine.

DO NOT make the mistake of thinking picnic taps will replace regular faucets. Out of 4 picnic taps I own, only two can be relied upon not to leak while at rest. Leave picnic taps to the ice chest that goes to the picnic..

Figure out how many styles you want to have on hand and buy a freezer that will accommodate that many kegs. See this link for help deciding: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f35/chest-freezer-specs-layouts-377518/

The best deal I've found on kegs is through Adventures In Homebrewing. Another source for excellent selection and customer service is Keg Connection.

Good luck and cheers!

 

[Yooper]

Holy crap I've opened a can of complex and overwhelming stuff... is there a easy answer? Like "buy this this and this and that's all ya need"???

It's not complex at all. I think we've said what you need, but there is a bit of thinking involved.

you can keep bottling if you're not ready to keg, but kegging is simple. Even I can do it.

 

[TAK]

Holy crap I've opened a can of complex and overwhelming stuff... is there a easy answer? Like "buy this this and this and that's all ya need"???

No.





All above is great advice. You'll need to dive in, learn from doing, and then look back like everyone else has and say to yourself "I should've done this, this, and this." But that's just part of the gig. You won't regret switching. Bottling sucks.

 

[jekeane]

DO NOT make the mistake of thinking picnic taps will replace regular faucets. Out of 4 picnic taps I own, only two can be relied upon not to leak while at rest. Leave picnic taps to the ice chest that goes to the picnic..

I have 6 picnic taps that have never leaked. Experiences vary I guess.

 

[Puddlethumper]

I have 6 picnic taps that have never leaked. Experiences vary I guess.

Absolutely true. I have no clue what the difference is between taps. But the advice above holds true. About all you can do is read all you can, learn what you can, then plug your nose and dive in. You'll probably make a few mistakes. But then all of us have. It's part of the learning experience.

But the fact remains that kegging is far easier than bottling. You can clean, sanitize and fill a keg in about 30 minutes. 50+ bottles and you're in for a 3-4 hour session + all the storage issues with empties, etc.

Cheers

 

[pricelessbrewing]

Thanks for the thread, been lots of helpful good tips here. I'm on the market to start kegging as well, probably a two tap keezer with room for two more kegs in the freezer.

Help me start without all upfront costs, expandable manifold, expandable faucets and towers(maybe). Just need to find a CL freezer and I'll be all ready.

Question: Is the quick c02 burst really needed to seal the lid when carbing naturally? I'd like to get three kegs ready on deck for when the stuff arrives?

 

[solbes]

Question: Is the quick c02 burst really needed to seal the lid when carbing naturally? I'd like to get three kegs ready on deck for when the stuff arrives?

If you don't have a CO2 tank yet, I'd say its not strictly necessary but will ensure you get a solid seal. See if you can pick up some keg lube, its food grade grease that you put on the O-rings. Makes a big difference around the main seal on top of corney's (the big o-ring). You can virtually eliminate keg leaks this way. To check for leaks, spray some Star-San 12-24 hours after sealing to ensure no CO2 is leaking out. You would see bubbles coming out of the main seal or either of the posts this way.

Once you do get a CO2 tank, you should be purging 3-4x anyway with CO2 after filling (through pull ring relief valve). Since you are doing that anyway, I then crank it to 30 psi, let it sit for 15 seconds, and disconnect. I am a big fan of sugar priming kegs. Some swear against it, but I do it for all of my kegged beers except for lagers and Kolsch's where I want no extra yeasties.