Logistics of Home Lager Brewing - Discussion

[SoggyWood]

The title is somewhat self-explanatory. I would like to have an open discussion on how home brewers can economize on space, time, and energy to not only make quality lagers but (most importantly) not let those pipelines go dry.

As an exclusive ale brewer, I can brew several times a month and keep a constant flow of fresh beer on hand. Many beers going grain to glass in about 3 weeks. If I were to brew a proper lager it would tie up my pipeline, fridge space, fermentation chamber space, you name it.

That got me thinking--what if I brewed exclusively lagers? My whole brewery has been constructed around the single fact that I only brew ales.

How would it differ if I only brewed Lagers? what kinds of things would you need to consider? how would it affect yeast management? would the home lager brewer be more apt to keep larger quantities of slurry on hand? would you buy a separate chest freezer just to 'lager' several kegs for extended periods?

If you built a home lager-only brewery from the bottom up, what are the most important factors to consider?

 

[schematix]

Since I've invested in chest freezers, I've almost exclusively done lagers. I bought 2 freezers and use 1 for fermenting, and 1 for storage. I can fit 7-8 kegs in one, and 4 5G carboys in the other.

Biggest hassle is yeast. You need a LOT. I typically will do 2-3 step starters to get where I need to be. I haven't had as good of results using slurry, although i expect if you turned around batches every 10-14 days you could use the slurry without issue.

Curious to hear what others say. I could talk about this for days.

 

[MeanLowerLow]

You could also consider batch size. So if your batch size is 5 gal and you Bree every other week to keep your pipeline, you could double or triple the batch size based on the extra time require to lager.

 

[SoggyWood]

Since I've invested in chest freezers, I've almost exclusively done lagers. I bought 2 freezers and use 1 for fermenting, and 1 for storage. I can fit 7-8 kegs in one, and 4 5G carboys in the other.

Biggest hassle is yeast. You need a LOT. I typically will do 2-3 step starters to get where I need to be. I haven't had as good of results using slurry, although i expect if you turned around batches every 10-14 days you could use the slurry without issue.

Curious to hear what others say. I could talk about this for days.

That's a good point. When I brew a couple ales a month, I am never lacking fermentation space. with a 14 day primary you almost always have one finishing up which opens up a slot for a new batch to go down.

Infrastructure (for lack of a better word) is definitely a critical point. By that I mean more freezer space, which means more freezers. I guess two chest freezers are a must in most cases?

You could also consider batch size. So if your batch size is 5 gal and you Bree every other week to keep your pipeline, you could double or triple the batch size based on the extra time require to lager.

Do you think the average Lager batch by most home brewers is 10g versus 5g?

 

[chickypad]

I've got extra space in the kegerator that I lager in. I don't tend to brew more than every 2 wks so I just use the same primary fermentation chamber for lagers and ales.

 

[schematix]

Do you think the average Lager batch by most home brewers is 10g versus 5g?

I designed my system for 10G batches due to the time investment. However, on a recent batch i pushed it to 15G (had to add about 1.5G top up water at the end). I find the beers to be more 'drinkable' and prefer to have more on hand. Will probably continue this method going forward when making moderate gravity Pils style beers...

Which is a great time to point out that lager beers require a modest alcohol content. Sure there are a few big ones out there, but there is something incredible about a 4.5-5% lager beer.

 

[mongoose33]

Since part of your concern is time, I point you to this:

http://brulosophy.com/methods/lager-method/

Like you, SoggyWood, I have just brewed Ales, and for the same reason. But I want to try a Lager or two, and a shorter time period is just what the doctor ordered. I have a fridge I can dedicate to a fermentation chamber, but until my keezer is done, I need to use it for chilling kegs.

When the time comes, I'll try Brulosopher's method.

 

[acidrain]

I was going to point to brulosopher's method as well. Grain to glass in a relatively very short period of time.
I would use a smaller fermentation chamber purpose built for lagering, and quickly lager one batch at a time as opposed to lagering a bunch of batches all at once (or rotating in) the old standard way.

 

[BrauHund]

I'm faced with a similar dilemma in how to keep the pipeline flowing. I recently bought an 11 cu.ft. chest freezer for use initially as fermentation chamber and in the not too distant future, as a keezer. The only solution I can come up with is to buy a second, smaller chest freezer to use as my fermentation chamber and use the larger chest freezer to lager and serve beer. The smaller chest freezer should allow me to ferment ales or lagers as I choose, while the larger chest freezer would be kept at lagering temps to lager and serve beer.

 

[Natdavis777]

I do 10 gal batches and just cranked out a Maibock (with Brulospher's Lager Technique) in 3 weeks. This is the same time frame for me to do a big DIPA or most extensively dry-hopped beers. Therefore, I dont feel an extra chamber is necessary. Just the means to produce the proper yeast. Most grain to glass ales go in 14 days, but I enjoy knowing that I can crank out 10 gal of a lager within 21-28 days.

 

[cvillehokie]

I've got a small 3.5 cu foot chest freezer for all my fermentation - being able to dial in exact temps for lagers and ales makes a big difference.

FWIW - every year, I brew a Maibock, 2-3 weeks later, I brew a Doppelbock and throw it on the Maibock slurry. Yeast starts bubbling with in a few hours.

The Maibock is kegged and 'lagering' in my keezer (~45F), when the doppel is ready, i throw both of the kegs back into the fermentation chamber at 1C for a month.

 

[SoggyWood]

Since part of your concern is time, I point you to this:

http://brulosophy.com/methods/lager-method/

Like you, SoggyWood, I have just brewed Ales, and for the same reason. But I want to try a Lager or two, and a shorter time period is just what the doctor ordered. I have a fridge I can dedicate to a fermentation chamber, but until my keezer is done, I need to use it for chilling kegs.

When the time comes, I'll try Brulosopher's method.

I've seen this article and think it's a great technique. It would fit well into an Ale brewer's rotation but it seems problematic if you intend on brewing multiple lagers.

Unless I'm missing something, you can't drop a new batch into your chamber if a previous batch is in the middle of this schedule. From this standpoint, I wonder if it makes sense to stick to a more traditional lagering schedule.

I do 10 gal batches and just cranked out a Maibock (with Brulospher's Lager Technique) in 3 weeks. This is the same time frame for me to do a big DIPA or most extensively dry-hopped beers. Therefore, I dont feel an extra chamber is necessary. Just the means to produce the proper yeast. Most grain to glass ales go in 14 days, but I enjoy knowing that I can crank out 10 gal of a lager within 21-28 days.

Along the same vein, what would you do if you wanted to do 2 lagers back-to-back? If you do this technique, even though it's much quicker, you can only do one batch per fermentation chamber, correct?

 

[LLBeanJ]

Lagers/ales no real difference in brew time for me. I don't get hung up on the 4-8 week lagering time. My lagers are usually ready to keg in about 2 weeks, so a 3 day cold crash prior to that, keg with gelatin, then let the keg "lager" @ 65° (basement temp) until a tap opens up. Once on tap is when the cold lagering happens and I find it will typically clear a bit more over the next few weeks.

 

[Natdavis777]

I've seen this article and think it's a great technique. It would fit well into an Ale brewer's rotation but it seems problematic if you intend on brewing multiple lagers.

Unless I'm missing something, you can't drop a new batch into your chamber if a previous batch is in the middle of this schedule. From this standpoint, I wonder if it makes sense to stick to a more traditional lagering schedule.



Along the same vein, what would you do if you wanted to do 2 lagers back-to-back? If you do this technique, even though it's much quicker, you can only do one batch per fermentation chamber, correct?

My only suggestion would be to brew the lagers back to back so they stay on the same timeline, or at least very close to the same timeline if you plan on using the same chamber. I see the same issue arising with dropping an ale in the fermentation chamber while another ale has been in, say a week. Im warming my ales up after a few days of low temps, so I obviously dont want to drop my "new" ale into a warm chamber.

So either have multiple ferm chambers or brew the different beers back to back to utilize one chamber efficiently.

 

[gspot]

I now do almost exclusively German lagers and agree with LLBeanJ--the logistics aren't something to get hung up on. For me the key was having both enough kegs (9) and an extra lagering freezer. The first thing I did was fill up all my kegs except for one with ales (8 kegs) to last me until my first lager was ready. Then I brewed a lager for that last keg and put it in the lagering freezer. Every time I kicked an ale keg, I would brew another lager to replace it and put it in the freezer. Eventually, I had gone through all the ale and was able to start putting only lagers in my kegerator. Since I had been brewing only lagers as replacements, my pipeline is full of them. I can occasionally alternate an ale in there and not lose my pipeline if there's something I get the hankering for, such as a Saison.

I use a variation of the Brulosophers quick lagering method: one week at 50, one week at 64, and one week at 34, then keg. Although they are drinkable at that point, they are a little cloudy, so I prefer to leave them in the lagering freezer at least a month or two to age and clarify.

 

[SoggyWood]

What are lager brewers doing with their yeast? Harvesting, purchasing multiple vials/packs at a time, mix of both?

I rarely re-pitch when i brew. I find it easy enough to buy a smackpack/vial and get a 1L starter going as 99% of my ale OGs are below 1.055

I think with the high pitching rates of lagers it might make sense to have larger quantities of yeast on hand? would the lager brewer be more apt to re-pitch?

 

[LLBeanJ]

Due to the higher pitch rate required for lagers, I always brew two lagers back-to-back. I make a large enough starter for the first one and direct pitch slurry from the first into the second one.

 

[tennesseean_87]

I'm new to brewing lagers, but I have a batch of something steam-like going with 34/70 right now. It's a 2 gallon batch I only boiled for 20 minutes and added some hops to since I thought an 8 qt starter was too big not to drink. If I split the cake in two it should be good for the two 3 gallon lagers I plan to brew when it'starts done. I think pitching on cake would be good, too.

Also, building a ferm chamber with dual zones has been key.

 

[gspot]

Due to the higher pitch rate required for lagers, I always brew two lagers back-to-back. I make a large enough starter for the first one and direct pitch slurry from the first into the second one.

Great minds think alike, I guess

I make a starter for the first batch, and for subsequent batches I transfer the wort right into the previously-drained fermentor. I should probably clean it between batches this next time

 

[m1k3]

I do a series of three Lagers at a time with my buddy. In the last series we started with two packets of 34/70 (10 gallon batch) and each beer got higher gravity (and/or darker).

Brew days were:
Feb 14
Feb 27
March 12

The previous batch was kegged on brew day (or the night before).
I just switched from 3 taps to 6 so space was not an issue.

I know that having a full size fridge and ferm chamber is a luxury that not everyone else has.

By the way, brewing Lagers has really improved my ales. Other than the specifics of the ferm temperature ranges... and how the beer tastes better on tap sooner (for ales)... my process is exactly the same.

 

[jddevinn]

Even though I do 95+% ales I have a chest freezer with 4-9 kegs (some of which modified to "brite tanks") "conditioning" and carbing at a time. Between (3) fermenters and keg "secondaries" i think this would work for lagering .

 

[TastyAdventure]

After reading the brulosophy link I'm ready to take the lager plunge. I've heard good things about WLP830 and S-34/70. What do you think I should go with for a malty and rounded pale German type lager around 1.055?

 

[Natdavis777]

After reading the brulosophy link I'm ready to take the lager plunge. I've heard good things about WLP830 and S-34/70. What do you think I should go with for a malty and rounded pale German type lager around 1.055?

I was a bit disappointed with the Munich Lager (though went from 1.070 to 1.017) so I would recommend something like Bohemien.

 

[brewbama]

My Lagers are not figured into the pipeline. I brew Ales with the every third or fourth beer being a bonus Lager. I keep the Ale flowing in a temp controlled ferm fridge then rack into a serving keg and cold crash in the temp controlled freezer side of a side-by-side along side my Lager in a modified bright tank keg. When the Lager is complete, I'll put it in the rotation of the serving side of the side-by-side fridge as a bonus beer.

 

[kcinpdx]

I just did a bo Pils using Imperial yeast L17 harvest. Dropped it down to 1.010 easily and it's easily the best Pils I've ever done, if not the best beer altogether.

 

[wobdee]

All I brew are lagers. I have 6 ea 2.5 gal kegs, a mini fridge fermentation chamber, a regular fridge for lagering and a kegerator with two taps for dispensing. I brew every other week and use the previous batches slurry for the next batch. fermentation lasts 2 weeks, keg and lager at 32° for 4-6 weeks, works out well for me.

 

[gspot]

After reading the brulosophy link I'm ready to take the lager plunge. I've heard good things about WLP830 and S-34/70. What do you think I should go with for a malty and rounded pale German type lager around 1.055?

I pretty much use the 2206 Bavarian. I like it.